Male Patient Modesty Question

Nurses General Nursing

Published

My Experience:

I recently had a not so awesome experience regarding male patient modesty in a local hospital. It involved a trip to the ED, subsequent admission to the floor and emergency surgery with a week stay afterwards.

My Question:

Is it the general attitude of nurses in general (ED, OR, PACU, recovery, etc.) that patient modesty only matters when it is a female patient and that guys either don't care about that or that it just doesn't matter when it's a guy or did I just have a one-off bad experience?

My Request:

Yeah, it does matter! Guys might not say it, or feel uncomfortable saying it, probably out of fear of being ridiculed, or being the topic of discussion, in the break room but yeah, male patients do care about it. So I guess my request is the next time you leave a male patient uncovered for an extended period of time where everybody coming in and out of the area (not involved in their care) can see them, come into their room and just pull the covers off of them and lift up their gown and start doing stuff to them, etc. etc. maybe you take a minute and think about whether you would do the same thing to a female patient. Pretty sure I wouldn't of had the same experience if I were a female patient. And yeah; I know you're a professional, that you've seen/done it a thousand times and that checking out my "junk" isn't of any interest to you, however, I'm not a nursing professional, haven't had it done to me a thousand times and would prefer that my "junk" stay covered when you're doing something that requires it to be exposed to anybody in the area (not related to my care)!!!

Just saying...

Caliotter3... Why wouldn't I? Use my name that is. Or at least the first initial of my first name, my last name and my year of birth (which this year is also my age).

Many of the replies I have gotten suggested that I speak to hospital administration about my concerns. I just can't. Partly because it was humiliating and I would be even more embarrassed discussing it face-to-face with someone (as opposed to here).

Especially considering my desire not to subject myself to further embarrassment by addressing an issue directly with the person(s) who were a part of, or the cause of, the problem if it wouldn't be acted upon and would only humiliate me further.

I think that the second and third quote answer the question you pose in the first quote. The nurses who cared for you may well be members here. It's always a good idea to remain as anonymous as possible on the internet and especially on this topic due to the concerns you've expressed. However it's of course entirely up to you to decide whether you're comfortable with "linking" your identity to the experiences/feelings you've described in your posts.

I agree that you don't have anything to hide. That's not the problem. It's about exposure (absolutely no pun intended). You decide how much about yourself you want to be made "public".

Think I'd rather just die on the side of the highway next time than go to the hospital.

If this accurately describes how you feel I think that you definitely need to bring your experience of your hospital stay to the facility's attention. If you aren't simply being melodramatic and this is a true reflection of your feelings, this seems to indicate that you found the experience not just less than optimal, but that you actually found it traumatizing. This would be quite serious and not something the internet can easily fix. I genuinely and sincerely hope that your experience wasn't as bad as the above quote implied.

I joined the board here just for the sole purpose of discussing this and asking my question. I did so, however, at the urging of an ED trauma nurse friend of mine. I asked her the same question and had the same discussion with her.

She also told me today, after I had posted and talked to her, that she also had an ulterior motive. That my post would serve as a "gentle reminder" to others in the nursing profession that modesty matters as much to male patients as it does to female patients.

In my opinion the best thing that your friend can do is to advocate for patients at her place of work (and for all I know, she already does that). Advocating for our patents and protecting their autonomy and dignity as human beings is something we all as nurses have an obligation to do. It has happened on every floor and every department I've ever worked in, and had I ever witnessed any untoward behavior from coworkers of any profession I would have spoken out, right there and then.

Anecdotal accounts on the internet will however will likely have little or no effect on improving a workplace that doesn't have a culture of treating all their patients with respect. If a specific floor/unit/facility has a poor culture, that can only be solved by management and people working there. It needs to be brought to their attention.

I'll be honest with you, I actually find your friend's ulterior motive patronizing. I can figure out for myself, as I'm sure most posters here can, that I/we need to treat patients with respect without her "gentle reminder".

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Emergency Dept. Trauma. Pediatrics.
Caliotter3... Why wouldn't I? Use my name that is. Or at least the first initial of my first name, my last name and my year of birth (which this year is also my age). It's pretty much the same username I use on the boards that I post on within my own profession. I have nothing to hide. Except for maybe my "private parts" when I was in the hospital. And we now all know how well that worked out for me (laughing while crying). Guess I wouldn't make a very good "troll".

Probably because with your multiple posts about being mortified and embarrassed, it would make it easy to find you. ESPECIALLY with this post, as it only just took me about 3 mins on google to figure out who you are. That's why it's stressed not to use your name and personal information on here. Especially in this day and age. I mean already it was risky but this post right here just filled in any gaps and walls people might have had.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
I'll be honest with you, I actually find your friend's ulterior motive patronizing. I can figure out for myself, as I'm sure most posters here can, that I/we need to treat patients with respect without her "gentle reminder".

Apparently (unfortunately) not everyone in the profession can figure that out. Otherwise it wouldn't have happened in the first place.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Probably because with your multiple posts about being mortified and embarrassed, it would make it easy to find you. ESPECIALLY with this post, as it only just took me about 3 mins on google to figure out who you are. That's why it's stressed not to use your name and personal information on here. Especially in this day and age. I mean already it was risky but this post right here just filled in any gaps and walls people might have had.

Thank you for pointing this out, however, it's kind of an academic discussion at this point. Especially since I had already received a call from the Director of Nursing and quality assurance/customer satisfaction at the hospital where I had the experience regarding this thread prior to me making that post. As long as pictures of my "private parts" don't start showing up on the internet it's all good. I don't really care about being personally identified (obviously or I would have used an alias username). What bothered me was being exposed to everyone and anyone who happened to wander by or wander in the area I was in at the time. So like I said, unless you have pictures, it's all good (just laughing this time, no crying).

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Healthcare risk management and liability.

I am glad that the OP did bring it to the attention of the hospital so that action can be taken. As I frequently point out to staff and patients, if I don't know about a problem, I cannot work on fixing it. If someone reports an incident to me anonymously, that is helpful, and it is even more helpful if it is not anonymous, or contains sufficient details that I can pinpoint the who what and when, so I can do a more targeted followup.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Specializes in L/D, newborn, GYN, LTC, Dialysis.

I am so very sorry this happened to you. You have received some good suggestions that I cannot add anything meaningful to. You are worthy of, and deserve and should expect, respect for you as a person and your dignity. Again, I am sorry this happened.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Probably because with your multiple posts about being mortified and embarrassed, it would make it easy to find you. ESPECIALLY with this post, as it only just took me about 3 mins on google to figure out who you are. That's why it's stressed not to use your name and personal information on here. Especially in this day and age. I mean already it was risky but this post right here just filled in any gaps and walls people might have had.

Hi Mi Vida Loca (and others)...

I actually appreciate your concern regarding personally identifying myself. I don't think that came across in my last reply to you. So thank you. However, personally identifying myself was never my concern. I should provide you with a little background so that you better understand why.

I work as a computer security consultant (an ethical hacker). I have for the past 15 years. I have been a computer programmer, systems/network/security manager, database administrator, webmaster, etc. for the past 34 years. A simple google search, as you pointed out, will back that up (and probably provide you with my web site address, business address, e-mail and cell phone number). One thing I have learned as a result of that is that there is no such thing as anonymity on the internet. And if you think that using an alias when you post on a board like this will protect you then as one of my colleagues often says "I want some of what you're smoking because it must be really good stuff because you've got to be high right now". Using some really basic, and free, tools readily available on the internet I was able to find very personally identifying information on several of the individuals who replied to me here using aliases. It took like 30 minutes. I can recommend a book if you're interested in finding out just how easy that is:

Open Source Intelligence Techniques by Michael Bazzel (ISBN 9781530508907)

He has authored several other books, including ones that will help you remove that kind of information from the internet. Good luck with that. These days I don't even bother. It is what it is. If you go to the Barnes and Noble, or any other major bookseller's, web site you should be able to do an author search and find them. Or you can run a Google search. Because we all know how to use Google, right (again just laughing, not crying)?

Anyway, I had a very nice conversation with the DON at the hospital where I had my experience. Apparently she knows how to use Google as well (again laughing). It went very well. She explained their staffing, overcrowding, turnover, etc. issues and expressed to me that although it was not an excuse she would like to apologize in person to me and have me address the issue directly and explain, from a patient's perspective, my experience at an internal seminar they are having to address that exact issue at the hospital. Evidently I was not the only one to have had that experience recently and they are addressing it. She also assured me that nobody would get in trouble as a result of my post or my conversation with her which was my biggest concern.

I should also point out, as I did in an earlier reply, that being personally identified doesn't embarrass, humiliate, traumatize or mortify me in any way. What did was being left exposed for extended periods of time, in multiple locations, for anyone, and everyone not related to my care (including family members of other patients) who happened to wander into the area where I was seeing me that way. And not being able to do anything about it, or advocate for myself, due to the condition I was in.

Anyway, it went well. And again, thank you.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Apparently (unfortunately) not everyone in the profession can figure that out. Otherwise it wouldn't have happened in the first place.

The point that I was attempting to make was that most nurses actually do, but those who don't, whether from burnout/compassion fatigue or from not actually giving a **** if they treat patients poorly, will likely not change their behavior after reading a post on the internet. In my opinion all you're accomplishing is pretty much preaching to the choir, not effecting real change. I would have expected your ED trauma nurse friend to realize this, which is why her/his tactics rub me the wrong way.

One thing I have learned as a result of that is that there is no such thing as anonymity on the internet.

I think most folks realize this. However, you were the one who described the experience you've had as humiliating. Most people consider those emotions personal. The posters cautioning you not to use your real name were only doing it out of concern/kindness. However, as I've already said, it's entirely within your rights to decide how much you wish to share.

I should also point out, as I did in an earlier reply, that being personally identified doesn't embarrass, humiliate, traumatize or mortify me in any way.

I guess this is the part that posters weren't sure about and were trying to help prevent.

Anyway, I had a very nice conversation with the DON at the hospital where I had my experience.

Anyway, it went well. And again, thank you.

I'm glad that everything seems to have worked out well!

And if you think that using an alias when you post on a board like this will protect you..

(partial sentence quoted)

Using some really basic, and free, tools readily available on the internet I was able to find very personally identifying information on several of the individuals who replied to me here using aliases. It took like 30 minutes.

Now, now OP... Or perhaps, tut-tut... :) Is this typical white hat behavior?

Up Vote Up Vote ×
The point that I was attempting to make was that most nurses actually do, but those who don't, whether from burnout/compassion fatigue or from not actually giving a **** if they treat patients poorly, will likely not change their behavior after reading a post on the internet. In my opinion all you're accomplishing is pretty much preaching to the choir, not effecting real change. I would have expected your ED trauma nurse friend to realize this, which is why her/his tactics rub me the wrong way.

I agree. You make a good point. And I'm sorry if my friend's tactics rubbed you the wrong way. Unfortunately, however, I wasn't aware of her "tactics" until after I posted. I have "spoken" to her about that. That being said, however, since you are not one of the individuals you describe above then it shouldn't offend you at all. Since it doesn't apply to you.

I think most folks realize this. However, you were the one who described the experience you've had as humiliating. Most people consider those emotions personal. The posters cautioning you not to use your real name were only doing it out of concern/kindness. However, as I've already said, it's entirely within your rights to decide how much you wish to share.

I guess this is the part that posters weren't sure about and were trying to help prevent.

I appreciate that. I honestly do.

Now, now OP... Or perhaps, tut-tut... :) Is this typical white hat behavior?

Definitely not, however, I wear many different hats. ;)

Up Vote Up Vote ×

A forewarned caregiver is a forearmed caregiver. Time is a commodity on the job. There is a point when "there, there now" with the same attention-seeking individual robs other patients of their due attention.

Up Vote Up Vote ×

Now, now OP... Or perhaps, tut-tut... :) Is this typical white hat behavior?

A retort to every point. Must have been the shift's joy for the day.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
A forewarned caregiver is a forearmed caregiver. Time is a commodity on the job. There is a point when "there, there now" with the same attention-seeking individual robs other patients of their due attention.

I wouldn't consider asking a caregiver to cover me up after I had been exposed for over a half an hour after assessments had been done while multiple people (not related to my care) wandered in and out of the area I was in to be a "there, there now attention seeking behavior". It seemed like a simple request. And one that I had to make multiple times in multiple locations. Maybe that's the "there, there now attention seeking behavior" you are referring to? Having to make the same request multiple times? Because my, I thought simple, request wasn't being honored? And because of my condition at the time I was unable to do it myself? Unfortunately, I received the same dismissive behavior/attitude from my "caregivers" there as you seem to display. That's makes me kind of sad. For you.

I'm guessing, actually I know, that you've been doing your job for a very long time. Maybe too long. Because when you forget the "care" part of "patient care" maybe it's time to find a different career.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
+ Add a Comment