At my job, we are offered classes each month for our CEU's as LNA's. We were at one the other day for some psych training, and we were asked what we wanted to be doing in 5 years. Myself and another woman said that hopefully we be all graduated and working as RN's, since we're both in nursing school.
Another woman said that she was graduating next week from an Medical Assistant program, and how it was "exactly the same as being an RN", but she got her degree faster, but won't get the same money (and she proceeded to b!tch about that).
Now, I've seen the debate here in the General Nursing discussion, but this just chapped my rearend. I think MA's are great - as are LNA's and LPN's and RN's and everyone that works in healthcare. A friend of mine is an MA, but she does not pass herself off as a nurse. Another friend is a Surgical Tech, and while she doesn't say she's an RN, her son calls her a nurse, saying his mom told him she did "more" nursing in the OR than the nurses do. I've corrected him twice about it, but don't anymore. It just bugs me that I'm busting my hump to become an RN, yet anyone that works in healthcare feels they can call themselves one.
I'm so careful, I don't even call myself an SN while at work, and don't call myself an LNA while in clinical!
I don't know why people can't be proud of what they are. Some of the best tips and knowledge I've gotten on the job has been from the LNA's, many of which are career LNA's. THey're damn good at what they do! It's bothersome that some feel it all comes down to you're either a nurse, or have to claim to be one to be recognized.
Anyway, I kept my mouth shut when this LNA/MA was going off, but I so wanted to say, "So if you're the same as an RN, why won't the hospital or the state recognize you as one? Why? Because you aren't. You may as well call yourself an astronaut. You aren't one of those either!"
Okay, back to the regularly scheduled programming.
Specializes in Case mgmt., rehab, (CRRN), LTC & psych.
Also, why in the world would anyone go to school for 2 years to be a medical assistant??? Mine was only 9 months. Two years of school isn't worth 8 bucks an hours.....sorry, no way, no how.
Some MAs would rather be referred to as a 'college graduate', and the only true way to achieve this accolade is by attending a community college MA program and earning an applied Associate of Science degree in Medical Assisting. If you have an AS degree, you're legally a college grad, whereas the MAs with certificates or diplomas are not legally college grads.
I suppose the degree is very important to some MAs, so they take the 2-year route instead of the 9 to 10 month route.
Thank you for all of the replies! I'm glad to hear there are others who don't like people misrepresenting what they are.
I'm stunned to learn that the program lenths vary so much. I've read anywhere from 8 months to 2 years! Wow!
I knew from my friend becoming a Surgical Tech that the A&P and Micro she took are WAY different than the ones I've taken. There were no credit or hour value assigned to them either - they were just part of the curriculum. She said they would transfer if the wanted to go to nursing school, but I know my school would not accept them if she tried. You have to have a "B" or better in all sciences, plus they must have been 4 credit or higher. One woman I know had to take A&P 1 over again because she only took a 3 credit course (and that was with a lab!) and they wouldn't accept it.
Anyway, I hope I never have to work with this woman. I'd only seen her this one time in the LNA conference, and boy was she "Holier-than-thou" with her attitude. If I wasn't the "new girl", you can bet I would have said something, but I've only been there a month, and don't want to p!ss anyone off or think *I'm* the holier-than-thou one.
After you become an RN and you see that girl, you can tell her where to go...
...BACK TO SCHOOL!
:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
Thank you for all of the replies! I'm glad to hear there are others who don't like people misrepresenting what they are.
I'm stunned to learn that the program lenths vary so much. I've read anywhere from 8 months to 2 years! Wow!
I knew from my friend becoming a Surgical Tech that the A&P and Micro she took are WAY different than the ones I've taken. There were no credit or hour value assigned to them either - they were just part of the curriculum. She said they would transfer if the wanted to go to nursing school, but I know my school would not accept them if she tried. You have to have a "B" or better in all sciences, plus they must have been 4 credit or higher. One woman I know had to take A&P 1 over again because she only took a 3 credit course (and that was with a lab!) and they wouldn't accept it.
Anyway, I hope I never have to work with this woman. I'd only seen her this one time in the LNA conference, and boy was she "Holier-than-thou" with her attitude. If I wasn't the "new girl", you can bet I would have said something, but I've only been there a month, and don't want to p!ss anyone off or think *I'm* the holier-than-thou one.
I knew from my friend becoming a Surgical Tech that the A&P and Micro she took are WAY different than the ones I've taken. There were no credit or hour value assigned to them either - they were just part of the curriculum. She said they would transfer if the wanted to go to nursing school, but I know my school would not accept them if she tried. You have to have a "B" or better in all sciences, plus they must have been 4 credit or higher. One woman I know had to take A&P 1 over again because she only took a 3 credit course (and that was with a lab!) and they wouldn't accept it.
It is highly unlikely any nursing school would accept it. If a nursing school does accept it, the quality of the school would be highly suspected and it may even be a scam.
Specializes in Critical Care, Pediatrics, Geriatrics.
We have to know a lot of stuff that nurses might not (partly because they do not need it) such a all the current medications, since we have to call in RXs and refills, so of course we have to know all the abbr.
Nurses are extensively trained in pharmacology, moreso than a MA, and use it every single day in the hospital as well as the ambulatory care setting.
Specializes in Critical Care, Pediatrics, Geriatrics.
This issue is a huge pet peeve with me, as I have been through MA school and now currently a nursing student.
A MEDICAL ASSISTANT IS NOT A NURSE IN NO SENSE OF THE WORD!
In our tristate area, MA programs are 8 months and you acquire a certificate. If you opt to obtain an associates degree it offers no more medical training than a general college major: english, math, and basic science and electives. NO more clinical experience, etc.
I chose to become a medical assistant after I was put on a two yr waiting list for nursing school...thought it would be a great way to get experience in the medical feild while I waited. I spent $8000 for the program which consisted of six months in a classroom and two months of externship in an outpatient clinic. I learned how to take vitals, draw blood, give injections, and dosage calculation. I also learned medical terminology and a limited number of outdated lab tests....like a manual CBCdiff, ESR, etc. In retrospect, it was a waste of time and money. I should not have been allowed to administer medicine, especially injections based on the knowing now what I didn't know then.
Nursing encompasses so much more than just knowing the name of a med and which pt it should go to. You learn the norms, the way the body metabolizes the med, the possible reactions/complications as well as WHY they occur and how to intervene, WHY the med is given, when to question the order, and how to assess the pt before hand and afterwards based on a multi-system approach. You learn more than just normal values, but why they should remain stable, what complications will arise if they don't, and what labs are pertinent for what diagnoses/medications.
Our hospitals do not use MA's. They are only used in the Doctor's offices and I am quick to ask for a nurse if I feel the MA is about to perform a procedure/give a med that I am not comfortable with them doing because of their training. I don't devalue MAs and they certainly have their place, but I think the healthcare system is more lax with their use in comparison to the strict guidelines that nurses must adhere to.
I would have educated this person that there is a huge difference between medical assistants and nurses, as I was in the dark as well before entering nursing school. I am not working my butt off in school to allow someone else to falsely claim they are a nurse when they are not. Lets call apples apples and oranges oranges, eh?
At least in California, the term "nurse" is a protected title. You can be charged with practicing nursing without a license if you refer to yourself as such.
It is the same way in Texas though I don't know how well it is enforced. I have met plenty of MAs along the way that refer to themselves as nurses. I quit the last job that I had because I had an MA working under me that told patiants that she was a nurse and was giving very bad "nursing" advice, some that could have harmed the patient if I had not caught and corrected her. I had no problem contridicting her in front of the patient either, explaining to them that she was a Medical Assistant, I was a Registered Nurse and that she did not have the training or knowledge to be dispensing advice. I was the only RN in the office (I was getting paid quite well) and brought it to the attention of the doctors in the group. The MA was a personal friend of one of the doctors and she often did things like pick up his laundry and send flowers to his girlfriend for him so he refused to get rid of her. I ended up quitting out of fear for my license.
Specializes in home & public health, med-surg, hospice.
You know what doesn't makes sense to me? Why do MA refer to themselves as nurses yet profess disdain for the nursing profession's education?
Furthermore, why do they claim to be nurses when they do not perform/participate in the nursing process (Assessment, Planning, Diagnosing, Planning, Intervention and Evaluation). As far as I know, they're only performing some physical tasks that nurses happen to perform as well. They're not performing these tasks for any particular reason other than that they have been ordered to do so, they're not using in critical thinking behind the rationale for the tasks performed, right?
What's a little bit sadder is, the fact that patients and even some docs and other ancillary healthcare workers are not familiar enough with our process to know the difference. Then the question becomes who is at fault for this knowledge deficit amongst the public?
Is it the nursing profession itself? Are we not projecting a well-defined image of who we are and exactly what we do?
Specializes in Critical Care, Pediatrics, Geriatrics.
You know what doesn't makes sense to me? Why do MA refer to themselves as nurses yet profess disdain for the nursing profession's education?
I knew a few MA students in my class that couldn't hack nursing school so they came to MA school instead, so they displayed this attitude often. Then there were some MA students who had no clue what the difference is between an RN and a MA...like myself at the time, so I was easily swayed by others who said, "You are the same as an RN, you just get paid less...so don't let them tell you any different." I boils down to a combination of lack of knowledge and a self imposed inferiority complex.
Furthermore, why do they claim to be nurses when they do not perform/participate in the nursing process (Assessment, Planning, Diagnosing, Planning, Intervention and Evaluation). As far as I know, they're only performing some physical tasks that nurses happen to perform as well. They're not performing these tasks for any particular reason other than that they have been ordered to do so, they're not using in critical thinking behind the rationale for the tasks performed, right?
Beginning MAs with no medical experience are much like robots...they are skill oriented and don't question why something is being done or if it should not be done. This is only because they aren't given that knowledge base in school. No, they do not use critical thinking or rationale but simply go by the facility policy or doctor's orders.
What's a little bit sadder is, the fact that patients and even some docs and other ancillary healthcare workers are not familiar enough with our process to know the difference. Then the question becomes who is at fault for this knowledge deficit amongst the public?
Oh these docs know the difference believe me. Why hire one RN for $30/hr when you can hire 3 MAs for the same amount? It's a business and all about the bottom line. The public for the most part does not know the difference and that is our fault as a profession.
Specializes in home & public health, med-surg, hospice.
Oh these docs know the difference believe me. Why hire one RN for $30/hr when you can hire 3 MAs for the same amount? It's a business and all about the bottom line.
This demonstrates poor business sense to me though, b/c then they have to pay 3 x the benefits, ins., sick time & vacation time, you know?
The public for the most part does not know the difference and that is our fault as a profession.
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TheCommuter, BSN, RN
102 Articles; 27,612 Posts
I suppose the degree is very important to some MAs, so they take the 2-year route instead of the 9 to 10 month route.