Just got called for a depostition for a pt from 5 yrs ago!

[PICNICRN]

Just got notice that my deposition is needed from a delivery 5 years ago! I don't have any details yet- so far I have been told the baby's name.... which rings no bell! I am out of state so the hospital's attorney is mailing me the medical chart for me to review and wants to speak with me next week before the plalntif's attorney gets a hold of me. Apparently, I was the infant delivery nurse(lucky me) and admitted the baby to the NICU. Like I said, I have not a clue about this case!

Has anyone had a deposition? How afraid should I be- cuz I'm kinda freekin'! What if I really do not remember anything? Any suggestions or words of wisdom?

Thanks in advance!

[blueeyedgoose]

I'm a bit confused here so maybe someone could clarify for me. One of the blogs stated that you should keep detailed/ exact records of the cases that you are involved in just in case you do sme day get hauled into court. Wouldn't keeping these records, and I'm assuming having them at one's home, be a violation of confidentiality? Also if this is something that nurses regularly do how long do you keep these records for? Sounds almost like how long you keep your tax return records.:typing

[rph3664]

That's just the sort of thing that got me started keeping notes on situations that could be ugly later...

I first started working the the PICU in Winnipeg, Manitoba around the time that nurses were being subpoenaed to the pediatric cardiac inquest (details to follow) and many of my new coworkers were sweating bullets waiting to see if they were on the list. It was NOT the greatest time for me to be the only new nurse there! The emotion and fear were palpable. As it turns out, only one of my new coworkers was called, and her testimony was very concise and confident. The finding of the judge in that case was that the nurses were entirely blameless and that their charting was beyond reproach.

For those unfamiliar, in 1994 the pediatric cardiac surgery program at e Winnipeg Children's Hospital had a new, very inexperenced but cocky surgeon who took on cases that were well out of his skill range. Twelve babies and children died in a very short period of time. The nurses were the first to go to administration with concerns about his skills, his demeanor and his behaviour toward those he considered his inferiors - anyone who was not a surgeon. The nurses had specific concerns and they only got worse over time as their concerns were pooh-poohed. But when anaesthesia began refusing to work with him TPTB sat up and took notice. The program was suspended for awhile, restarted with his agreement to do only low risk cases, which lasted about two weeks, and then he was back attempting Norwoods, and more babies died. The program was suspended forever late in '94 after the 12th child died. The ensuing inquest was the longest medical inquest in Canadian history. The inquest report is available in its entirety on the web and I've read most of it. Of the 12 kids who died, the finding was that only 1 of them would have died no matter what. Now all the peds cardiac surgery in western Canada is done at the hospital where I work now.

PICNICRN, I'm so sorry this has happened to you. I hope your role in this case is only because your name is on the chart! Please let us know how it all comes down. I'll be thinking of you.

The hospital where I work had a heart surgeon who was killing patients too. Nobody asked too many questions as long as he kept bringing money into the hospital , but when word got out that there was a surgeon at my hospital who was killing patients, people started refusing to come here for open heart surgery.

Since he left, our morbidity and mortality rate in CVU has declined dramatically, and months-long hospital stays, as well as transfers to tertiary facilities, have fallen off as well.

[GingerSue]

What became of this idiot quack?

He is an American, and he went to work in research & organ procurement (in California)

[leslie :-D]

I'm a bit confused here so maybe someone could clarify for me. One of the blogs stated that you should keep detailed/ exact records of the cases that you are involved in just in case you do sme day get hauled into court. Wouldn't keeping these records, and I'm assuming having them at one's home, be a violation of confidentiality? Also if this is something that nurses regularly do how long do you keep these records for? Sounds almost like how long you keep your tax return records.:typing

this is exactly what i did, when i was witness to a nurse being electrocuted (sev'l yrs ago)

hubby suggested i write everything down, in the event case went to court.

so while it was fresh in my memory, i wrote every detail down, including position of the nurse when she was plugging in appliance.

i was deposed 3-4 yrs later, with lawyers from all sides, sitting around the table.

for me, it wasn't intimidating.

i remember a couple of lawyers asking me, "how can you remember xxx?"

and i showed them the paper i had written everything down on.:)

this nurse's lawyer was very pleased with me that day.

anyways, be truthful.

if you don't remember, say so.

and don't let anyone bully you.

overall, they were a bunch of nice people.

leslie

[Keepstanding, ASN, RN]

so sorry that you are having to go through this. i am praying that it all turns out okay very soon. :heartbeat:heartbeat

[miko014]

I'm a bit confused here so maybe someone could clarify for me. One of the blogs stated that you should keep detailed/ exact records of the cases that you are involved in just in case you do sme day get hauled into court. Wouldn't keeping these records, and I'm assuming having them at one's home, be a violation of confidentiality? Also if this is something that nurses regularly do how long do you keep these records for? Sounds almost like how long you keep your tax return records.:typing

In the case leslie described, sure, it's okay. But that was a one-time situation. If you're in a big situation like that, it would probably be okay to take a few notes for yourself, just in case. But it's a bad idea to do this on a regular basis, or to keep info on every patient you've ever worked with. If you keep your own private notes, they can be used as evidence in court. A lot of people say, "well, I just won't tell them that I have them", but what about when they ask you under oath if you have saved notes about this patient or any others? It happened to someone I know. But that's more for just saving your papers that you use every day - like sometimes our report says things in - not the most diplomatic way. If they get ahold of something that says the pt was "grumpy today", they can use that to say that you didn't like the pt so you didn't give them the best care, etc. If you mean should you take notes on every patient and save them just in case the person decides to sue down the road, well, that seems like a waste of time, and potential HIPAA issue if anyone else reads those notes. Just chart objectively and without judgement in your actual chart, and then if you are called in the future, you can read your notes there and be able to figure out what's going on.

By the way, we chart by exception at my hospital - so if they called me and said, "why didn't you write anything on this patient's chart?", I can simply say that my assessment is documented in the check boxes, and that nothing out of the ordinary occurred during my shift. If something did happen, say, the pt c/o chest pain, I narritively document what the pt said, how they described the pain, what their VS were, which doc I called, and what I did. I also have the written orders to back me up - if my notes say that the pt c/o chest pain at 10pm, and at 10:10pm, I wrote an order for an EKG, cardiac enzymes, nitro, etc, that kind of backs up the fact that I called the doc. If I get called in the future about that situation, I don't need my own notes to remember it, because they are all there in my charting.

[HouTx, BSN, MSN, EdD]

PicNicRn,

Don't fret. The hospital's attorney will prep you for the deposition. He/she probably will also offer to make sure you have an attorney with you when you are deposed. Even if you don't work for that facility any longer, you were their employee at the time, so they will make sure that you are prepared as well as possible.

I have been deposed 3 times - as an Educator!!! Whenever there's any question about clinical competency, they always dig up anything 'competency' related -- that included me. Most of the questions they asked were related to established processes - and I just referred to what was in place at the time. When I did not remember something, I just said "I don't remember".

I was told that nurses are frequently subpoenaed, but very seldom end up actually being named as a plaintiff. 'Cause we don't have any $ - duh.

It wasn't that bad. Just answer the questions that they ask... and don't add anything else. If you had malpractice insuranc at the time of the event, be sure to notify your carrier & they may also want to get involved.

[woody62, RN]

In the case leslie described, sure, it's okay. But that was a one-time situation. If you're in a big situation like that, it would probably be okay to take a few notes for yourself, just in case. But it's a bad idea to do this on a regular basis, or to keep info on every patient you've ever worked with. If you keep your own private notes, they can be used as evidence in court. A lot of people say, "well, I just won't tell them that I have them", but what about when they ask you under oath if you have saved notes about this patient or any others? It happened to someone I know. But that's more for just saving your papers that you use every day - like sometimes our report says things in - not the most diplomatic way. If they get ahold of something that says the pt was "grumpy today", they can use that to say that you didn't like the pt so you didn't give them the best care, etc. If you mean should you take notes on every patient and save them just in case the person decides to sue down the road, well, that seems like a waste of time, and potential HIPAA issue if anyone else reads those notes. Just chart objectively and without judgement in your actual chart, and then if you are called in the future, you can read your notes there and be able to figure out what's going on.

By the way, we chart by exception at my hospital - so if they called me and said, "why didn't you write anything on this patient's chart?", I can simply say that my assessment is documented in the check boxes, and that nothing out of the ordinary occurred during my shift. If something did happen, say, the pt c/o chest pain, I narritively document what the pt said, how they described the pain, what their VS were, which doc I called, and what I did. I also have the written orders to back me up - if my notes say that the pt c/o chest pain at 10pm, and at 10:10pm, I wrote an order for an EKG, cardiac enzymes, nitro, etc, that kind of backs up the fact that I called the doc. If I get called in the future about that situation, I don't need my own notes to remember it, because they are all there in my charting.

I agree with the not keeping detailed records. In my last position I had to testify in court and under go depositions on a regular bases. I also had to submit regular reports to the insurance companies we contracted our services to. I kept notes detailing each of my visits, with whomever, to write my reports from. Once the reports were written, the notes were destroyed. I learned very early on that attorneys will subpoena every little piece of your work product, including personal notes. Anyone subpoena for a deposition has the right to review the patient record and to have access to it during the disposition. If something unusal happens to a patient you are caring for, you write detailed notes in the patient's record. If you witness something happening to another, a few notes detailing the highlights should be enough. Most important, if it isn't written down, your feet can't be held to the fire. And you cannot be impeached because you state "I do not recall".

Woody:twocents:

[CHATSDALE]

i have seen this happen to other nurses but i have not been called myself...knock on wood

it is impossible to remember every patient that you have ever had..and lawyers are trained to pick up on nervous behavior and zero in on it

HOWEVER, it cannot be said too often, chart every thing that you can think of..those nurses notes will be available to you before you go to court and they can bring back facts and memories and they will give you a confidence that you did the correct procedure and the conditio of the patient

an injured or deceased baby can pull on the heart strings of the jury and it is imperitive that they have the correct knowledge that procedures were followed