IV Phenergan and Toradol "Push"

Specialties Emergency

Published

Just thought I would bring a recent experience up for discussion:

29 May I end up in ER w/24 hours of extreme chills (long sleeve T-shirt, PJs, 2 blankets, quilt and down sleeping bag), intermittent, transient bone and joint pain, nausea and vomiting. I was given an IV set near the base of the thumb for fluids and then an IV "push" of phenergan and toradol at the site of the IV set rather than up the line where it would have been somewhat diluted. As a 30 year Crohn's disease patient I have had PLENTY of IV and IM phenergan and demerol w/o any discomfort or problems. But this one BURNED and HURT! The nurse continued the "push" and explained that it was the phenergan. I didn't really believe this given my previous experiences and assumed it was really the toradol as that was my first experience with it. The pain and burning only lasted a few minutes after the "push".

I had no swelling of the hand or arm, no pain, no redness for several days. Long enough that I never even thought of the IV push when I began with a bruised type feeling on the inside of the arm just above the wrist and the outside of the arm 1/2 below the elbow. Several days after that I did notice a hard stretch of vein about 3/4" long 1/2 way below the elbow on the outside of the arm. Later a "bump" at the wrist, still later another 3/4" hard stretch of vein just above and a little to the outside of the bump. And then a 1/2" hard spot in the vein below the base of the thumb at the wrist. It finally occured to me that this was probably the result of the IV push but since there was no redness, no swelling, no tenderness unless I kept poking the areas I didn't bother seeing a doctor about it. (Heaven knows I see him enough as it is, bless his heart!).

21 July the "bump" at the wrist turned red and was tender. Hot compresses did nothing for it that evening nor the next morning. My family doctor isn't in the office on Fridays and I figured the ER IV push was the cause so I went to ER. I was told it was "just" superficial thrombophlebits that could take as much as 6 months to resolve and was about to be released (which was ok with me as long as the doctors weren't concerned). But the "lead" ER doctor came in, first time I had seen her, and she said she would feel more comfortable ordering a venous ultrasound before I was released as she had had 2 STs go "sour" on her in the previous 3 months. I didn't have a problem with that so of course I agreed. What the heck, she was the doctor.

Ha! Turns out I had a deep vein thrombosis in the axillary vein in that upper arm! You could have floored me!! I ended up being admitted and given IV heparin drip and oral coumadin. Upon release 3 days later I had to agree to daily blood draws which was a cheap price to pay to be released from the hospital since I didn't feel sick and didnt hurt.

I've since been reading up on STs and DVT and realize my part in letting things go so far. However, I've found quite a bit of controversey on IV phenergan (and also demerol). The Infusion Nurses Society Standard # 43 specifically states phenergan should NOT be given IV due to its PH and potential for harm.

Frankly, given my experience thru the years and the blessing that IV and IM phenergan (and demerol) has been I would hate to see its use be discontinued. However, this was the first and only time phenergan was ever administered IV that close to the IV set instead of up the line where it gets diluted w/the IV fluids.

I'd be interested in your thoughts and experiences on this event and the use and method of administering IV phenergan. Mind you, my mother worked at this hospital all the while I was growing up, other than Mayo Clinic it is the only hospital I have ever gone to (altho we have another in town) and I've been volunteering here for several years in Endoscopy or Messenger Service. I'm not looking to cause any trouble and I know my ER nurse from previous encounters in the cafeteria and elsewhere at the hospital and he is a fine and conscientious nurse. He was marvelous when my brother in law was brought in with an AAA.

WOW! Good information to know. We always give phenergan IV and toradol IV in the ER. I have never once been told to dilute it and have never seen any of the other nurses diluting it either. As a new nurse that is really helpful. I have never had anyone complain, but will make sure i dilute it from now on! Thanks for the info!

I always dilute Phenergan very well, give it very slowly through the highest port and flush well behind it. It is very irritating.

I hate heplocks in general.

And yes, I have seen the Reglan reaction several times, anxiety, chest pain, sweating....I hate when that happens.

Reglan also needs to be pushed very slowly, pushing it too fast will cause that type of reaction.

Specializes in OB, lactation.

We give it all the time (in OB) & dilute with 10cc ns and push slowly. I don't think I've given it through a heplock without fluids running.

Well, All4U, I'm only a patient. Hopefully one of the nurses here in the forum can give you better advice. You might ask to speak to the hospital's Patient Advocate to see if he/she can be of any help to you. It would seem that your Gyn would know how best to handle this but maybe not. Maybe a vascular specialist is needed to help get you some relief. (((hugs))) I hope you find some relief soon!

Specializes in ER, Med/Surg.
... with children we don't give shots and never push either of the drugs

You don't give kids shots?

Specializes in Emergency.

Hospital policy is 12.5 mg in 10ml over 2 min. EMS will often bring them in and have administered 25mg (which I love because the pt is always so well behaved.) We also use a lot of Zofran which seems to have no side effects and Reglan. Phenergan is definitely the most effective, though.

In regards to Toradol do you guys stock the 30 and 60mgs and if so have you noticed the 60mg vial is labeled not for IV use? Meaning if you are out of 30mgs, don't grab a 60 and plan on only giving half.

I have never had a pt c/o pain with phenergan or toradol IVP, I always dilute and give relatively slow. Our pts always have terrible veins and usually have a 22gauge hanging out ridiculously flimsy vein in a pinky or something else ridiculous. Hey, you take what you can get.

It was brought up that perhaps the toradol and phenergan were given too close together and came in contact. When Toradol first came out, I was working in a very small rural facility with 1 other RN and an always half-asleep doctor. We decided to "play" and see if the two drugs were compatible in a syringe. A most impressive result !! I try to dilute every IV med I give, if allowed by the literature...saves veins, saves pain.

Specializes in Pain Management, RN experience was in ER.
I agree that phenergain iv is a nasty drug so I always dilute it with 10ml of NS before giving it either through a saline lock or an IV with fluids running.

I like that idea, I think I'm going to start doing that. Perhaps I can get other nurses started on that as well. In my dpt we just give the phenergin IV push with a NS flush.

Thank you, thank you, THANK YOU for being dynamic with your nursing education and being open to new practice. We ALWAYS dilute phenergan with AT LEAST 10ml saline, and shoot for 20ml. It's supposed to be given over 10 minutes. The new drug books, for the most part, are updated with much larger rates of infusion than in recent years. I looked at a 2006 drug book and it said phenergan over 1 minute!!!! My 2009 says 10 minutes. Actually, in my hospital, new policy says we're supposed to urge the doc to change the order to something like zofran if possible or have the order changed to IM phenergan if he refuses to change to another antiemetic. Under NO circumstances can we give phenergan in the hand and it MUST be given in the most distal port as possible. :twocents:

Just thought I would bring a recent experience up for discussion:

29 May I end up in ER w/24 hours of extreme chills (long sleeve T-shirt, PJs, 2 blankets, quilt and down sleeping bag), intermittent, transient bone and joint pain, nausea and vomiting. I was given an IV set near the base of the thumb for fluids and then an IV "push" of phenergan and toradol at the site of the IV set rather than up the line where it would have been somewhat diluted. As a 30 year Crohn's disease patient I have had PLENTY of IV and IM phenergan and demerol w/o any discomfort or problems. But this one BURNED and HURT! The nurse continued the "push" and explained that it was the phenergan. I didn't really believe this given my previous experiences and assumed it was really the toradol as that was my first experience with it. The pain and burning only lasted.

I had no swelling of the hand or arm, no pain, no redness for several days. Long enough that I never even thought of the IV push when I began with a bruised type feeling on the inside of the arm just above the wrist and the outside of the arm 1/2 below the elbow. Several days after that I did notice a hard stretch of vein about 3/4" long 1/2 way below the elbow on the outside of the arm. Later a "bump" at the wrist, still later another 3/4" hard stretch of vein just above and a little to the outside of the bump. And then a 1/2" hard spot in the vein below the base of the thumb at the wrist. It finally occured to me that this was probably the result of the IV push but since there was no redness, no swelling, no tenderness unless I kept poking the areas I didn't bother seeing a doctor about it. (Heaven knows I see him enough as it is, bless his heart!).

21 July the "bump" at the wrist turned red and was tender. Hot compresses did nothing for it that evening nor the next morning. My family doctor isn't in the office on Fridays and I figured the ER IV push was the cause so I went to ER. I was told it was "just" superficial thrombophlebits that could take as much as 6 months to resolve and was about to be released (which was ok with me as long as the doctors weren't concerned). But the "lead" ER doctor came in, first time I had seen her, and she said she would feel more comfortable ordering a venous ultrasound before I was released as she had had 2 STs go "sour" on her in the previous 3 months. I didn't have a problem with that so of course I agreed. What the heck, she was the doctor.

Ha! Turns out I had a deep vein thrombosis in the axillary vein in that upper arm! You could have floored me!! I ended up being admitted and given IV heparin drip and oral coumadin. Upon release 3 days later I had to agree to daily blood draws which was a cheap price to pay to be released from the hospital since I didn't feel sick and didnt hurt.

I've since been reading up on STs and DVT and realize my part in letting things go so far. However, I've found quite a bit of controversey on IV phenergan (and also demerol). The Infusion Nurses Society Standard # 43 specifically states phenergan should NOT be given IV due to its PH and potential for harm.

Frankly, given my experience thru the years and the blessing that IV and IM phenergan (and demerol) has been I would hate to see its use be discontinued. However, this was the first and only time phenergan was ever administered IV that close to the IV set instead of up the line where it gets diluted w/the IV fluids.

I'd be interested in your thoughts and experiences on this event and the use and method of administering IV phenergan. Mind you, my mother worked at this hospital all the while I was growing up, other than Mayo Clinic it is the only hospital I have ever gone to (altho we have another in town) and I've been volunteering here for several years in Endoscopy or Messenger Service. I'm not looking to cause any trouble and I know my ER nurse from previous encounters in the cafeteria and elsewhere at the hospital and he is a fine and conscientious nurse. He was marvelous when my brother in law was brought in with an AAA.[/quote

This drug iscaustic to the blood vessels, it should NOT be given in small veins period. In the pyxis a statement is an automatic pop-up that describes how the drug should be given. In fact the ISMP Medication Safety Alert Newsletter (not sure which edition) describes the use of Phenergan and how hospitals are moving away from giving it IV due to the nature of the drug on Blood vessels. I always dilute the medication in 10 ml no matter how much I administer (more than likely 12.5 mg/10 ml of NS). Toradol also cann burn on administration, however if the medication was given away from the insertion site and further up the line, more than likely the events would not have occurred, but cannot be for sure. Be well soon.

:nurse::typing

Specializes in NBN, ER.

At the hospital ER that i work in, we add phenergan and demerol to a 50cc bag of NS and infuse in that way. The patients have less irritation at the IV site and none have ever complained of burning while it was being administered. As for IV toradol, I've never had anyone complain of buring while administering it.

Each 12.5 mg Phenergan diluted in the greater part of 10 ml and give preferably in a running IV. Definitely superdiluted if not (12.5/10 ml and given very slowly), and first verify with 3 ml or so of NS that the IV is good and no pain, redness, leakage, etc to prevent tissue damage that Phenergan causes outside the vein. Love Zofran, hate Phenergan (except if the pt needs the byproduct sleepiness). Your IV site appears to have been bad either way.

Hi, I'm new to this site. Seeing that I've managed to be a nurse 8 yrs and given phenergan many times without diluting it and last thursday gave it twice through a saline lock undiluted and suspected infiltrates when flushing both times...I decided I need to either quit nursing or get some current information as fast as possible.

When the second site infiltrated, I suspected something was wrong. How could I be in the dark about this? After telling and showing the doctor, I filled out an incident report that day when I figured out what I'd done and then two days after after I'd done some internet research on the topic. The patient was discharged on Thursday and has an appointment with her Dr. on Tuesday, tomorrow. I've been asking around and it seems some nurses have seen benign reactions, and some have seen serious reactions. I'm doubly worried because per the pt's report, CT had tried to inject contrast into the hand site I'd tried just before CT that I'd seen leak a small drop of sero sanguinous fluid out of while flushing.

I called the supervisor Friday night and she said not to lose sleep over it, she'd seen phenergan infiltrations cause just redness. I'm worried about the effects over the next couple of weeks. Today I wrote an email explaining the situation to the director of nurses because my manager is on vacation. I'm almost fully expecting to be roasted for this in addition for the guilt I have for screwing up someone's arms out of my ignorance. All the other nurses seem to know to dilute it. Still I did not see any alert on the MAR. All it takes is one misstep like this and you can ruin someone's life. I keep looking at my left hand wondering what I'd do without it. How do I deal with this?

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