Is it true that a BSN will be mandatory soon?

dauschundlover · Sep 5, 2008

In my comment stating that we all passed the same boards I was hoping to point out that to separate nurses by their education was for lack of a better word ridiculous. I should be united in the goal of bringing credibility to our field and if that means making a BSN the minimum level of education required then lets just do it. This debate has been going on for YEEEEAAAAAARRRRRRRRSSSSSSSS. In pointing out that we all pass the same boards I was merely stating the obvious that we must be equal to a point if the test required for licensure is the same given to a candidate no matter what education path they choose. Now as far as saying you can't get into grad school with your NCLEX yes that's true, so if someone who is a diploma grad or AD grad chooses that route to take then they would have to get those three initials behind their name. As far as being able to train just anyone to do some of the "tasks" involved in nursing that person is right. You can train someone to pass meds, put in an IV, draw blood, change a dressing, but what you get when a nurse does these "tasks" is the added basis of assessment. And what would separate nurses from just anyone else doing what we do is the knowledge of putting it all together and doing it right.

PMFB-RN, RN · Sep 6, 2008

Can you please provide a link to a college or university which confers an MSN in one semester to students who lack a bachelor's degree?

*** Sorry if I wasn't clear. The programs I am refering to usually have one semester bridge then on to the regular MSN program. This would be ADN to MSN in 5 semesters. Give or take, programs vary. There are quite a few such programs out there. Some are now starting to offer a DNP with two additional semesters I have heard, but not yet seen.

PMFB-RN, RN · Sep 6, 2008

I'm going to CRNA school and there are no shorts cuts. There's not even a debate about that.

*** My research seems to show that those CRNA schools that grant an MSN require a BSN. Lots of CRNA schools do not grant an MSN (as I am sure you know). The CRNA school in my state grants a MS in biology at the end of their CRNA program. Two ADNs I know who had other BS degrees in biology and zoology got in. Another with an ADN and a BS in mortuary science got into one of the MN schools.

RNGrad2006 · Sep 9, 2008

Unfortunately, I still couldn't afford it. My employer pays for only 50% tuition and then only after the semester is over. So I would have to pay upfront, and I just couldn't swing it financially. Taking out loans makes no sense, as BSN's really don't make any more than ASN's, at least in the majority of employers. I make too much for financial aid.
But, for someone else, this may be a great idea, so I'm glad you mentioned it.
Blessings

That is a shame. I am 42 and am working on my RN to BSN and have 2 kids that need a lot of homework too. It is possible. But am lucky that my employer pays $5250 per year for tuition. I am just taking classes until I run out of money so am on a break right now. And they do direct bill for a limited number of universities so all I have to pay for is books. It is a sweet deal. And indirectly the BSN does sort of create a wage increase (not alone but sort of). Our employer has a career ladder program where if you meet certain measures (one being taking undergrad courses towards a bachelors) that you can qualify for a wage increase. It was a huge increase but of course I had to meet other measures also. It was like setting up a portfolio with all kinds of patient examples how measures are being met. It ended up being a $3/hr raise. So definitely worth the work. Ends up being $4.5/hr raise since I am on a weekend program and make time and a half so definitely appreciate the opportunities for advancement. My manager is also VERY supportive of higher education which helps. Most of the major hospitals in Arizona seem to offer similar programs. Where are you located? It is definitely worth pursuing if that is a goal you have set for yourself but just not able to with your current employer.

Babs0512 · Sep 9, 2008

RNGRAD2006: Thanks for you reply. I'm in upstate NY. My manager is most definitely not supportive of educational opportunities (except her own). As part of her being a nurse manager, she has to get her BSN within one year of hire (she's been the nurse manager for 10 years, so we know how administration is on top of things where I work) Sounds like you have a sweet deal. Good for you. Take advantage of it.

I live in an area where our hospital is the only one within 50 min drives - so it's the only game in town. Very few people want to travel these days, so my employer can get away with lousy wages, lousy benefits, working you full time without full time benefits, etc... be happy your not here.

Good luck to you. Keep us posted on your progress.

Babs

RNGrad2006 · Sep 9, 2008

If you have been working in this field long enough, you soon learn that what really matters is the experience you bring to the table. We all start out as brand new, rather you have an LPN, ADN, BSN or MSN after your name. I currently work in KY, in an area with 5 different nursing programs. It's like a "puppy mill" for nurses. They bring this new nurses in, give them a few weeks orientation, convince them that they are the saviors of the units and then leave them to drown on night shift. Management promotes an attitude that any warm body will do. There is an old school rule of who you know not what you know. I don't want to sound like I'm one of those nurses that eats their young. I happen to love precepting new nurses. I love to see them grow in our profession. What I get angry about is the lack of understanding that administors and legislators and the general public has in regards to our role within the health care system. Would I love to have my BSN, absolutely, but that in and of itself will not make me a better nurse. Compassion, a willingness to learn, a commitment to my patients and their families is what makes me a better nurse. If an individual wants an advance degree, great, but don't push the rest of us aside. We are knowledgeable, experienced PROFESSIONALS. It is about time that we stopped the discussion and start standing up for our chosen profession. Bottom line, they can't do it without us. We need to stop the bickering about who has be better education and look at how we can promote our profession nationwide in a positive manner. Very simply I am a Professional Nurse, and no matter what letters I have after my name, I am here to care for my patients and support those within my chosen profession.

Very well written post. Although, I agree with you in many ways I am finding that pursuing my BSN has not made me a "better nurse" but I have had the opportunity to apply my learning to my patients utilizing evidence based practice, research etc... I am 10 courses closer to my BSN goal with 5 to go. I feel it has made me more sensitive since the learning I have achieved are things that are non clinical in nature and not skill based. Those are qualities that patients do also notice. I am naturally compassionate and as a mature student (since I pursued nursing in my late 30's) I think I take a different perspective anyway, so maybe not a fair comparison. I think pursuing higher learning just helps me to not look at things from multiple perspectives to approaches I take. My manager has stated she is amazed at my learning since I have only been a nurse for 2 years but with life experience comes a different rate of learning (at least in my opinion). I would encourage anyone with any desire to pursue continued and advanced learning...to do it. I have not regretted it but know it takes some time away from my family. But the results have been very positive!!!! I really feel that those who pursue a BSN while working also learn a LOT more than those that get their BSN with no clinical experience since that enhanced learning doesn't take place while working and is therefore not applied in the same way. But I agree with you that those that just make a judgment based on the degree a person has really miss the point completely. A degree does not make a person a certain way 100% of the time. I have met a lot of BSN nurses that I just give my head a shake and wonder how they even got through nursing school. I know recently my manager also stated that our floor has a 80% BSN ratio and realize that managers look at credentialing in making their decisions and don't think that should be the deciding factor with new hires. It seems the RN behind the name and BSN really gets their attention. I think the fit for a floor and work ethic should also be considered. I have worked with a LOT of lazy nurses and just wonder why they ever wanted to be nurses in the first place. But I always say I am only there to do what I can...in other words only responsible for my actions and not of others. Be encouraged that you are a valuable member of the nursing profession no matter how management perceives things or what letters are behind your name though...I see value in all levels of nurses and perhaps that is because I worked as a unit secretary, then LPN, then RN, and now pursuing BSN so really understand what it takes to make things happen. All members of the team are valuable and therefore should be valued no matter what.

oakbourne · Sep 9, 2008

I also agree with the statement that we need more instruction in school such as drug interaction, A&P, and disease processes. Maybe one or two care plans, but nursing school floods the brain with those plans and it becomes crazy. I can't really remember when working on the floor and a care plan came into my mind. But I do remember disease processes, sign and symptoms and drug reactions and interactions. That helps with hands on....

Lets get down to brass tacks. Let's get away with fancy titles after our names and understand that in the long run those fancy titles don't really help you when you want to take care of your patients. Nurses are becomming like doctors - jealousy if one has more education or is specialized and makes more money.

ANPFNPGNP · Sep 9, 2008

*** If a BSN was so important it would be required for grad school. There is no nursing advanced practice field, including CRNA, that requires a BSN, though some schools require it others don't.

You will still have to take prerequisites on top of your ADN to get into grad school...did you think you could just schlep those off?

tferdaise · Sep 9, 2008

Its called Student Loans. You wont have to take much out to get your degree.. But if you don't want to go that route then the BSN degree doesn't mean much to you.

Unfortunately, I still couldn't afford it. My employer pays for only 50% tuition and then only after the semester is over. So I would have to pay upfront, and I just couldn't swing it financially. Taking out loans makes no sense, as BSN's really don't make any more than ASN's, at least in the majority of employers. I make too much for financial aid.
But, for someone else, this may be a great idea, so I'm glad you mentioned it.
Blessings

ANPFNPGNP · Sep 9, 2008

That's not what the person was saying. The bridge semester would presumably cover relevant BSN content needed for the MSN and not covered in all ADN programs. After that bridge semester, MSN coursework would begin. Total coursework for ADN-MSN would be bridge content + MSN content. Thus, it would take longer than just one semester for the ADN to earn an MSN. How such bridge coursework could all fit into one semester is a different question.
I have heard of ADN-MSN programs that do NOT confer a BSN along the way. Kinda strange but it does appear to happen.

Vanderbilt doesn't offer a BSN degree, only a MSN degree. They accept diploma nurses and ADN nurses into their MSN bridge program. However, you will be required to take those "bridge" classes at their school at >$900 per credit hour - OUCH! Plus, in order to enter their bridge program, you must have the following before applying:

Prerequisite Courses

78 semester hours or 120 quarter hours of transferable college credit which must include:

6 semester hours of English
9 semester hours of Social Science
6 semester hours of Humanities
3 semester hours of Lifespan Development
11 semester hours of Natural Science (must include Human Anatomy & Physiology and Microbiology)
3 semester hours of Statistics
2-3 semester hours of Nutrition
38 semester hours of remaining credit from an accredited college/university

FA to CRNA2b · Sep 10, 2008

Wow...that bridge program sounds like a deal!

That's what--six years and forty thousand dollars?

HaHaHa... :rolleyes:

Just kidding. That struck me funny. :specs:

PMFB-RN, RN · Sep 10, 2008

Wow...that bridge program sounds like a deal!
That's what--six years and forty thousand dollars?
HaHaHa...
Just kidding. That struck me funny.

*** I guess I don't understand what you found funny when the bridge classes where not mentioned in the message? How can you think its funny if you don't know what it is? Where do you get the 6 years & $40K from?