Is the RN--->BSN push a clever way to get older nurses out of the way

Nursing Students ADN/BSN

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As in certain "Baby Boomers" who wont retire? Wont we NEED a faster RN producing mechanism (hello again, ADN programs!) in order to provide enough nurses to care for this huge group of people due to retire soon?? Just wondering...

Seems like those ABSNs and DEMSNs would be much more indebted than the typical BSN or ADN. I believe you have previously discussed how administrators prefer BSNs because they have so much debt they will not give management any trouble for fear of loosing their jobs and being unable to pay their school loans.

Around here, ABSN programs charge 2-3X per credit hour than even BSN programs within their own university. That would seem to engender a very indebted population that will do anything management dictates to keep their job.

But would there not be FEWER credit hours involved in the ABSN?

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Specializes in Nurse Scientist-Research.
But would there not be FEWER credit hours involved in the ABSN?

Yes, there would be, especially if you had the "right kind" of previous bachelor's degree (in a science-heavy concentration). It's almost like they calculated that into the equation. . . So, we aren't getting these ABSN people except for about 30 credits (or whatever, I'm not sure on the exact number right this moment0, so instead of $275/hr, we're going to charge $1,004/hr.

One of our local private universities had one of the first ABSN programs in the area. They charged right at $40,000 for the 18 month program (this would have been about 5 years ago, so I'm sure it's more now). The local State university initially had an ABSN with the hourly credit charge commensurate with their usual hourly charge for credit hours. People soon noticed the State University's bargain basement prices and flooded the program. Very soon after that they went up to the >$1,000 a credit hour, which made it approximately what the private university was charging. And btw, this is a respected long-established private university, not one of those sketchy investor owned types.

I know all this because a close family member briefly flirted with the idea of pursuing an ABSN so we did some serious shopping around at the time.

So was an ABSN from these two universities worth $40,000? Possibly yes, especially the private one. They enjoyed a good reputation for the quality of their graduates which personally I believe was more due to the tendency of their graduates being from higher socioeconomic status in general. At the hiring desk, these graduates were given an advantage. When new grad positions were getting hundreds of applications each, it pays to come from a well respected program. I'm not sure the $40,000 from the State university was well spent. They have a good program, probably equivalent in NCLEX pass rates, but they lack that elite name.

And I'm betting that $40,000 price tag has gone up in the last 5 years.

ETA: I just checked and the private uni's new total price for ABSN: >$100,000 :nailbiting:

Guess it's better than spending that much and showing up with a WCU degree (available in the area also).

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Again, what a bunch of mindless robots some nurses have become. The BSN push is about money period! They do not care about you, elevating the profession, patient care or any other bits of phony altruism they try to postulate. There are numerous people and organizations that benefit monetarily from trying to force nurses to run back to school. The only thing these people care about is keeping their titles and cushy jobs. The thing they fear the most is possibly having to move their plump cabooses out from behind their desks with the coffee and doughnuts and actually be forced to work again.

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Specializes in kids.

Yes I am......I got my BSN right out of high school.

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Specializes in TELE, CVU, ICU.
Ok, this I don't hear from a lot of the ADN as entry level defenders. For the most part, I hear arguments that the studies are flawed. Sadly, this is from a group that is (by and large) not versed in the intricacies of research. This sounds sad.

What you, MunoRN are contending is worthy of attention. For myself, as as 1992 ADN graduate, I had little to no theory, NO research, virtually no community nursing (oh, we had to attend ONE AA meeting). These are the aspects I found greatly deepened my nursing knowledge in the last couple of years and I am sad that people are fighting so hard against it.

Sorry in advance but my first reaction to this was what kind of BS ADN program did you attend? I went to a community college and the curriculum included theory, research, and community/public health. I found out when I tried to join the military that the program wasn't even NLN accredited. I went back to school, to an RN to BSN program at an accredited state university, and it was a joke. Basically a complete rehash of everything I had already learned in my ADN program.

I never took physics, never took organic chemistry, and I have a Masters degree now. This degree (from the same accredited state university) did not even require pharmacology or pathophysiology. I am failing to see how all of this advanced education improves my life or the care I provide.

The BSN and MSN did, however, add up to one hundred thousand dollars in student loans. My job prospects are no better, I actually had to take a $10/hr pay cut to work at one of the small rural hospitals mentioned above. And oh boy did the teeth come out. The only difference I noticed between me and the ADN nurses working there was that I was not content to be screamed at by the hospitals only surgeon, and that I was not content to be manually entering vitals on their antiquated EHR.

I did nd a job that is paying extra because I have a BSN, but that is becaue they are trying to become Magnet and need BSN prepared nurses with certifications in order to do so.

Also the pay rates I am seeing posted here are abominable. I have ten years of experience. The range here for my experience level is a low of $37/hr (at the small rural hospital, non-union & non-profit) to $53/hr (level 2 trauma, union, for-profit) with an average of about $46/hr. I can't imagine doing this job for less than $40/hr. It's not worth it.

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Specializes in TELE, CVU, ICU.
In turn I resent your attitude that you consider yourself more important than your patients and the profession.

Good lord what an obnoxious comment. You do realize people cannot take care of others without taking care of themselves first, right?

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Specializes in CRNA, Finally retired.
Sorry in advance but my first reaction to this was what kind of BS ADN program did you attend? I went to a community college and the curriculum included theory, research, and community/public health. I found out when I tried to join the military that the program wasn't even NLN accredited. I went back to school, to an RN to BSN program at an accredited state university, and it was a joke. Basically a complete rehash of everything I had already learned in my ADN program.

I never took physics, never took organic chemistry, and I have a Masters degree now. This degree (from the same accredited state university) did not even require pharmacology or pathophysiology. I am failing to see how all of this advanced education improves my life or the care I provide.

The BSN and MSN did, however, add up to one hundred thousand dollars in student loans. My job prospects are no better, I actually had to take a $10/hr pay cut to work at one of the small rural hospitals mentioned above. And oh boy did the teeth come out. The only difference I noticed between me and the ADN nurses working there was that I was not content to be screamed at by the hospitals only surgeon, and that I was not content to be manually entering vitals on their antiquated EHR.

I did nd a job that is paying extra because I have a BSN, but that is becaue they are trying to become Magnet and need BSN prepared nurses with certifications in order to do so.

Also the pay rates I am seeing posted here are abominable. I have ten years of experience. The range here for my experience level is a low of $37/hr (at the small rural hospital, non-union & non-profit) to $53/hr (level 2 trauma, union, for-profit) with an average of about $46/hr. I can't imagine doing this job for less than $40/hr. It's not worth it.

And you are complaining that you found a higher paying job that required a BSN? I also doubt that your CC required a full 3 credits each in theory, research and public health with full clinical rotations. I believe you had a scant smattering of each not a full 9 credit exposure. Yes, many of the RN to BSN programs are crap and shame on the NLN for accrediting them.

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Huh? Can't even imagine any logic behind this argument.

Nope - the 'push' for BSN in acute care is being driven by compelling evidence - higher nurse education levels produce better patient outcomes. Plain and simple. I know, I know - we all know a jillion non-BSN nurses who are just the bee's knees and waaaay better than those snotty BSN grads. But the evidence is based on analysis of aggregate data - not the results of individual nurses.

Can you please link the studies that concluded this.

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What is stopping TPTB from declaring the BSN the minimum requirement ?

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What is stopping TPTB from declaring the BSN the minimum requirement ?

Because the state legislatures would have to mandate that, not TPTB in nursing, and none of them are willing to do it.

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Because the state legislatures would have to mandate that, not TPTB in nursing, and none of them are willing to do it.

Couldnt TPTB stop accrediting 2yr programs?

They are not willing, why?

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Couldnt TPTB stop accrediting 2yr programs?

They are not willing, why?

They could, but that wouldn't change anything about licensure. There's no US state that requires you be a graduate of an accredited program in order to eligible for licensure. State BON approval is all that required.

I'm guessing that ACEN hasn't stopped accrediting ADN programs because they are viable paths to licensure, now and for the forseeable future.

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