I just finished a CNA course at a public technical college.
On our last day of class we had a small graduation ceremony with the students and a few residents of the nursing home where we did clinicals.
Our instructor invited a guest speaker from a religious group she belongs to. The guest speaker preached about her religion and put down everyone who doesn't practice the same religion.
We had to go up one by one to receive a certificate from our teacher and a New Testament book from the guest speaker.
The school is not a private school and has no religious affiliation. This is a state approved program. The program had no religion component, discussions, or learning material. We were never asked if we felt comfortable with this before we were blindsided with it.
THIS ALL TOOK PLACE BEFORE OUR FINAL REVIEW WITH THE TEACHER FOR THE CLASS!
Is this legal?
What would you do?
How would you feel if you felt forced to participate in something like this outside of your own religious beliefs?
There is no such thing as a democratic republic. You are one or the other. We are a republic, democracy in America is a myth that people seem to swallow hook line and sinker. As far as not being a theocracy, we almost are. If the majority of Americans had their way we would be. However the founding fathers knew this and smartly made us a republic not a democracy or in their words a mobocracy.
I agree with you. I meant we hold democratic principles as a core component of our republic.
Pure democracy would be a scary thing, to say the least.
She was a guest speaker...she can speak about whatever she wishes. You aren't evaluating HER. Freedom of speech. Appropriate..maybe not..but certainly not illegal.
I agree don't let it ruin your graduation experience you have every right to disregard what the guest speaker was speaking about. And also you have the right to decline a bible if it goes against what you believe. Everybody is entitled to there own religious ideals and practices, and has the choice of religious freedom no matter what background or country you come from. But on a personal note I do feel that it was a little inappropiate to express someones religious views upon a crowd of people who are there for a graduation NOT a RELIGIOUS conference .
Too funny:chuckle Thanks for the laugh, it's always welcome when arguments get too heated.
It wasn't a joke. The whole-grainy FSM is hurt by all those who deny his presence and turn to false idols. They may offer false hopes of salvation and small unleavened crackers, but the FSM offers eternity in pasta heaven complete with beer volcanoes and stripper factories.
Wow! This makes my heart sad. I am praying for each and everyone of you that you will find guidance and understanding. What does it matter if they did not have the same preferance of faith. One of the responsibilites as a Christian is to witness to others and bring them to Christ. Maybe the speaker went about it wrong, and maybe the school should have brought it to the attention of the students that the speaker was a Christian before the ceremony took place. But all in all, what does it really matter. What makes you more mad, having your toes stepped on or hearing about a God that forgives.
By the way, doesn't anyone else remember receiving a Gideon Bible on the school campus? I do! They hand them out every year.
I am an Atheist and believe everything you just said was complete and utter idiocy congruent with mental illness. Can I go and say this at a graduation, as it is my belief and all.
i am far from being a devout christian; i can count the number of times i have been to a church service on one hand in the last ten years. i don't pray before meals, i don't pray before i go to bed. i don't give tithes.
but.
it only takes 270 electoral votes out of 538 to elect the president of our country. (50.1%)
78.4% of the population of the united states identify themselves as christian in some form. i am one of them, though i don't practice.
even at 30 years old, i can see the decline in our society that is rapidly increasing over the years. do i think it has anything to do with the pullback from christianity and the morals i was raised on? maybe. probably.
it's the overwhelming minority that complains. most people, even most non-christians, don't really care. i wouldn't move to the saudi arabia and complain about them giving me a koran at graduation. i'd politely decline it and let it be.
this is going to ruffle a lot of feathers, but frankly i don't really care. my skin is thicker than a nanometer. i know how to shrug off things i don't agree with, especially when i'm not in the majority.
p.s. when running a spell-check with microsoft word, it forced me to capitalize the c in christianity. it wouldn't ignore christianity or christ in any form without requesting capitalization.
this will be my only post on the topic. i will not fight about it.
morality is relative. christians killed many people in the 1600s for being witches. society is changing, not becoming morally corrupt. in fact, murder and violent crime have been decreasing in nyc, while divorce and violent crimes are highest in the bible belt. i think closed-mindedness and tyranny of the majority are what makes society sucky.
Specializes in Vents, Telemetry, Home Care, Home infusion.
Adding my :
I've learned this best from my child's pediatrician:
Don't make mountains out of molehills. Pick your battles carefully and make sure they are the important things in life.
a. Is this legal to invite a guest speaker who preached about religion and handed out bibles? Yes.
b. Is is wise when a public institution using state supported dollars to have a speaker go off the deep end at a nursing home re religion when topic was CNS graduation ceremony: No
c. Did the program administration even know about said speaker and the topic of said speech? Doubtful.
d. Do religious groups give out bibles at nursing school graduations: Yes, often from the Gideons.
One can read a prayer to help comfort a person even if not of same faith..... learned that lesson well working in hospice.
You sometimes get more success with sweetness than with fiery emotional outbursts. Write a nice proofread letter to head of the program outlining your concerns just as you posted them here. No one should be made to feel uncomfortable at any type graduation ceremony.
Wishing you much success in your CNA career..... it's how I got my start in Fall 1973.
I've learned this best from my child's pediatrician:
Don't make mountains out of molehills. Pick your battles carefully and make sure they are the important things in life.
No one is telling him/her to pursue all out legal action. Instead, all that have been supportive have recommended going up the chain of command in the institution with their grievances, which seems fairly proper to address molehills.
a. Is this legal to invite a guest speaker who preached about religion and handed out bibles? Yes.
Again, this is highly debatable. It is a public institution and appears to be a non-elective event. The combination of the two with clear religious preference violate the endorsement test.
c. Did the program administration even know about said speaker and the topic of said speech? Doubtful.
That's probably untrue. Considering this was a small CNA graduation, the speaker was likely a close friend of one of the instructors, which is fine. She probably has spoken in the past and when you're "preaching to the choir" so to speak, it's doubtful anyone's complained.
d. Do religious groups give out bibles at nursing school graduations: Yes, often from the Gideons.
This doesn't make it acceptable.
One can read a prayer to help comfort a person even if not of same faith..... learned that lesson well working in hospice.
And one can read a prayer to bring discomfort to a person not of the same faith. I learned that well working critical care in a multiethnic community.
A lady from the Gideons spoke to our class the week before graduation. I remember turning to my friend and saying something about how offensive this could be to those of us who are not of the Christian faith. I felt it was inappropriate for her to give such a presentation to a group of people who did not all share her faith and had not asked to know about it.
I should add that I am married to a Baptist pastor.
While I agree that part of my faith is being willing to share it, forcing it on a captive audience is not the same thing as talking about it with someone who is open to hearing about it.
I think the speaker in the OP was inappropriate.
And yes, it is possible to have a smile on your face and not believe in Jesus. I have friends who do so on a daily basis.
I categorize myself as a praying atheist. I pray all the time knowing it's ridiculous. That said:
I have no problem at all helping someone reinforce their faith when they are in distress. I had a LOL who paced with her Bible in her walker basket, around and around the facility, and would, when she was particularly anxious, sit with her and read to her from Psalms.
I will tell a frightened woman with a cross around her neck that she will be at home with Jesus and her husband soon, and not to be scared, that Heaven is waiting.
I will pray with anyone who needs me to.
But I do not condone people in positions of authority foisting their beliefs upon subordinates - which students are. It is flat-out wrong. Just as I would NEVER tell someone clutching a rosary a joke about the FSM and denigrate that which gives them comfort I do not want anyone "witnessing" to me when I am a captive.
Unless it's about Pastafarianism, That good message I'm always ready to hear.
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hypocaffeinemia, BSN, RN
1,381 Posts
I agree with you. I meant we hold democratic principles as a core component of our republic.
Pure democracy would be a scary thing, to say the least.