In DESPERATE need of adivce

allnurses Guide · Dec 15, 2008

I don't agree with this. I just graduated nursing school and almost all our instructors were very helpful and did everything they could to help us understand the material and graduate. If a student does not understand something, the instructor could at least point out where the problem is or pages to read or websites to go or something! Not all nursing schools are like this!! The OP has 2 other degrees so it's not like she's never been to college and thinks it's too hard. There may be something eally wrong with this program.
OP- if you think you should leave this program you are probably right. It sounds awful and in nursing you have to really know the material because you will use it in practive. You can't just fake it until you make it. Another thought- I see you're asking about accelerated programs, maybe a full time program would be better. I can imagine that instructors in accelerated programs expect more and maybe, in this case, too much. Just my . Hope it helps.

Truthfully, I had good instructors as well, for the most part, but some of the instructors at my school were pretty well similar to what the OP describes. My opinion is that someone should go into nursing school expecting it to be fairly brutal; but that oftentimes it will actually be better than what they expected.

Penguin67 · Dec 16, 2008

originally posted by penguin67

as far as curriculum changes go, you are admitted under a university catalog that is your contract with the school, including the curriculum that is in effect at the time you were admitted. a program cannot just change a curriculum and not take any courses from the old curriculum, unless you are talking about failing a course and wishing to repeat it.

:omy:really? i am amazed at this, because during spring semester of my sophomore year, we were informed that the entire curriculum was changing, starting with our class during our junior year! we suddenly required no "second writing requirement," for example. are you telling me that the university of delaware was not allowed to do this? (i've been out of school for two and a half years, but still, the way everything went was upsetting).

*~jess~*

yes, the student's "contract" with the university is considered to be the catalog under which they were admitted. we have to show the accrediting agency a copy of all cataogs for the years they are reviewing so they can see what policies were in effect at the time.

the big thing here is that there is usually a clause somewhere in the front of a university catalog what state something to the effect of" subject to change with notice" meaning the university recognized the contract of the catalog with the student, however, if things change, they are required to notify the students prior to the change taking place.

frankly, there are some changes that need to be implemented with all classes, and not phased in with new classes. one that comes to mind is anything that increases success on nclex. you don't want to implement changes related to that outcome to only the new students as they get admitted. what about the nclex success of the students who are already in the program? we've had several issues like that, and just posted the change on the website and sent each student a personal letter informing them of the change.

CHATSDALE · Dec 16, 2008

i know that nursing schools all over the country do have the agenda of 'weeding out' with a sharp knife

this is beneficial to the profession but extremely frustrating to the students some of whom are holding on my their toenails of course some instructors take advanage of this to be sadistic with a very good excuse,

however the changing of the cirriculum after a student has paid and passed is not kosher, does nothing to improve the competancy of the graduates

most of the instrutors i had i learned a lot from and could appoach with question and clarification of points i did not understand

before you change schools check about the trasfer of credits, talk with the students and see if they have the same complants that you have now..good luck with whatever you decide

pagandeva2000, LPN · Dec 16, 2008

One of the reasons why I hated school so immensely is that while it is said that nursing school is tough in order to weed out the weak, observing the end results has shown me that a great deal of graduates knew how to play the game, feed the professors and NCLEX what they want to hear, but none of these things (in my humble opinion) really crank out competent nurses. A competent nurse, in my opinion has become that way out of personal choice and dedication, not from the rigors of a nursing program alone.

iteachob, MSN, RN · Dec 16, 2008

What I am trying to say is, you will not find that "perfect" or "ideal" program that nurtures its students. Every person I've ever talked to about the education process says the same thing about their school. I met someone who changed schools 8 times before he realized he just had to deal with it. Dont be like him.

Gotta disagree here! There ARE good schools out there. I know. I went to 2 of them, and I teach at 1 of them!

The person that changed schools 8 times......I ask you, what is the common denominator here? Uh-huh....the student! Truer words were never spoken when you said :

"Don't be like him."

eriksoln, BSN, RN · Dec 20, 2008

Gotta disagree here! There ARE good schools out there. I know. I went to 2 of them, and I teach at 1 of them!
The person that changed schools 8 times......I ask you, what is the common denominator here? Uh-huh....the student! Truer words were never spoken when you said :
"Don't be like him."

Hey, I'm just mirroring my experience and what I've been told. Fact is, of course you think the school you teach at is a good school. They sign your paycheck. Now, let me be a fly on the wall during class breaks or right after clinicals and listen in on what the students have to say. Thats the tell all.

Plus, you cant go searching for a program that is overly friendly or patronizing. There was ONE singular school I knew of in Pittsburgh that did not have the "eat the students with some salad on the side" reputation. Those students LOVED their instructors but followed up with "But they only trained us to be CNA's who pass meds. I dont know anything. Sure I can make perfect corners on the beds, but I have no idea how to change dressings, start IVs or even insert a foley." LOL, I'll hold off on saying the name of the school that all the students were saying this about, I dont want it to be one of your saintly 2 schools. :smokin: OK, I'm done being a jerk.

Point is, yes, there may be more ideal situations out there, but they are hard to find. You have to be 2 semesters into a program before you know for sure it is not what you want. By then, you may as well stick it out. Take the guy I went to school with. Yes, 8 is a lot of programs to start and not finish. But most of those 8 were programs he was accepted into and declined after orientation. He saw the chaos and little things like not even having a course sylibus (?spellin) and knew to get out before he put time into them. Then he quit once cause of a kid being born, wife couldnt work anymore etc.......

iteachob, MSN, RN · Dec 20, 2008

Hey, I'm just mirroring my experience and what I've been told. Fact is, of course you think the school you teach at is a good school. They sign your paycheck. Now, let me be a fly on the wall during class breaks or right after clinicals and listen in on what the students have to say. Thats the tell all.
I wish I could let you talk to our students. Not all (I'm sure), but most would recommend us, I believe. They have at least 2 other schools in our nearby area they could be attending. By the way, we are the only private one of the 3 and by far the most expensive. Also, we get what I'll call "refugees" from one of the programs ALL the time!
LOL, I'll hold off on saying the name of the school that all the students were saying this about, I dont want it to be one of your saintly 2 schools. OK, I'm done being a jerk.
Actually, that IS pretty funny......they were both Catholic in origin!
Point is, yes, there may be more ideal situations out there, but they are hard to find.
That's the most I can hope for people to consider, I guess.

Magsulfate, BSN, RN · Dec 20, 2008

I don't agree with this. I just graduated nursing school and almost all our instructors were very helpful and did everything they could to help us understand the material and graduate. If a student does not understand something, the instructor could at least point out where the problem is or pages to read or websites to go or something! Not all nursing schools are like this!! The OP has 2 other degrees so it's not like she's never been to college and thinks it's too hard. There may be something eally wrong with this program.
OP- if you think you should leave this program you are probably right. It sounds awful and in nursing you have to really know the material because you will use it in practive. You can't just fake it until you make it. Another thought- I see you're asking about accelerated programs, maybe a full time program would be better. I can imagine that instructors in accelerated programs expect more and maybe, in this case, too much. Just my . Hope it helps.

I agree with this. I actually MOVED 60 miles or so away to go to a different college that would treat me like a human and not a heard of cattle that they needed to flunk a certain percentage out every semester just to meet quotas. The college I graduated at was wonderful. The instructor on the first day said "We're not here to fail you out of nursing school, we're here to make wonderful nurses out of you". I knew from that day forth that it would be a great experience. It was HARD, and demanding, but we were never treated badly.

Not_A_Hat_Person, RN · Dec 21, 2008

I am curious about the details of your relationships and experiences at that school. Were all relationships bad? Were all instructors, lab workers, etc. unnurturing and unhelpful? Or were there 1 or 2 incidents or what? And when you say administrative staff, are you meaning secretaries or the Dean, the professors themselves, or what?

That sounds like the school where I got my BA. It's the only public 4-year college in Boston, and a lot of people go there because it's all they can afford. The attitude on campus, from professors to janitors to cafeteria staff, was "You'd better be grateful I'm letting you take this class (buy this cheeseburger, etc.)." They have an online RN-BSN program, but I wouldn't deal with them again if it was free.

I did nursing school at a community college, and the professors were tough, but they were fair. They were willing to help if you asked for it. Some were better in the classroom, and some were better in clinical. They weren't out to fail us, but to make sure we were competant nurses.

eriksoln, BSN, RN · Dec 21, 2008

Hey, I'm just mirroring my experience and what I've been told. Fact is, of course you think the school you teach at is a good school. They sign your paycheck. Now, let me be a fly on the wall during class breaks or right after clinicals and listen in on what the students have to say. Thats the tell all.
I wish I could let you talk to our students. Not all (I'm sure), but most would recommend us, I believe. They have at least 2 other schools in our nearby area they could be attending. By the way, we are the only private one of the 3 and by far the most expensive. Also, we get what I'll call "refugees" from one of the programs ALL the time!
LOL, I'll hold off on saying the name of the school that all the students were saying this about, I dont want it to be one of your saintly 2 schools. OK, I'm done being a jerk.
Actually, that IS pretty funny......they were both Catholic in origin!
Point is, yes, there may be more ideal situations out there, but they are hard to find.
That's the most I can hope for people to consider, I guess.
LOL. My wife went to a catholic nurse school. Mercy Hospital in Pittsburgh. Their program was legendary awhile ago, but its lost some of its steam recently. Now UPMC owns them so, who knows how the school will be handled.
I just think there is a lot to be said about sticking to things. I agree, some schools just are too comfortable and think they are the roster among hens. I'm a firm believer in voting with your feet. Enough people leave the program and they have no choice but to change. But, the people like myself who can not afford the time or money to shop around for programs have to find ways to cope with the one we are at. There are ways to survive the "student eating" programs and learn from them.
In my case, I had the unfortunate situation of having multiple clinical classes on the exact unit I worked as a CNA on. At first, you'd think this was an advantage, that I'd be able to show people around and function well. Not so. The nurses would come tell me when they saw a problem with a student and would help me a lot. So, my instructior saw this and decided I needed a little reminding of who was the roster. She went out of her way to put me on the verge of failure at the begining of the semester. For an entire semester, I had to be perfect. If my patho. study was lacking in any way shape or form, if I was ten minutes late............anything, I would have been gone. I survived. Many people did not survive this instructors killing spree. In the end, when it was all over, she was the one who gave me the news that my clinical grade was "pass". She even talked to me for awhile about my theory grades (the stress of clinicals had an effect on my theory grades that year). She had a masters in nurse education. She gave me advice about how to approach tests and the NCLEX. I swear to you, her insistance that I rely more on myself and stop trying to figure out what the instructor was looking for (it was more than that, but thats the cliff notes of our discussion) is the guidence that made me a first time NCLEX pass student.
So, the moral of the story is, non-ideal and not so nurturing programs have something to offer too, if you have the determination to survive them.

caliotter3 · Dec 21, 2008

If you have not already dropped out of the program, I would not do so until you have a space in another program. Nursing school is too difficult to conquer without putting yourself at a disadvantage. How many alternate programs are available to you and will they accept you and give you credit for what you have already accomplished? How much further do you have to go in your present program? There is no guarantee that another program will be any better than what you are in now. If at all possible, you should try to stick it out and get what you came for, your degree, and the opportunity to take the NCLEX. Blow off the poorly performing instructors you are encountering, teach yourself the material, and get through it. You would have to do the same amount of effort to tolerate poor teaching and poor attitudes anywhere else. Good luck in whatever you decide to do. If you do leave, I certainly hope that you have gained admittance at another nursing program.

RNDreamer · Dec 21, 2008

Were you Part Time during the Spring Semester? Everyone I have met who got screwed through this new curriculum process was PT. And I'm sorry you are miserable. I like most of my professors. They are nice, some a little TOO nice.

To everyone else, these students were told that they could continue on w/the the old curriculum and the new students (like me) would start with the new one. Then they were told the their credits from the old curriculum would not count.

Hi guys,
I am currently in a nursing program where I am MISERABLE!!! I decided to give this place a chance for almost 1 year and I had to tolerate non-nurturing staff (professors, lab instructors, etc) who were rude, disgruntled, arrogant and did not care if I needed help in my courses. Also- lack of ORGANIZATION!!! Despite expressing my concerns to the administrative staff of the department, it all fell on deaf ears. I felt alone, and I was told by a professor, "it is what it is." I came to the realization that this is a money making business- therefore, I am taking my business elsewhere. To add insult to injury, the curriculum was changed and I was told that my courses from last semester (Spring 2008) would not be applied towards my degree. One of my collegues filed a complaint and was met with opposition and told if she doesn't like it; there's the door. No one should be subjected to this treatment. This I believe is one of the reasons why there is a nursing shortage.
Can anyone at this point recommend schools- accelerated, dual degree that have good resources, professional staff and some unification among students. This time around I want to make sure that I do my homework THOROUGHLY. All suggestions and comments appreciated.