How did she/he get through nursing school?

[Emergent]

I have more than one coworker that I'm amazed that they got through school. I really like them, but marvel at their cluelessness. These are not new nurses, to say the least.

[Mr_Edwino]

To me the answer is in part related to the fact the nursing school just isn't that rigorous academically and the licensing exam is a joke.

Agreed. There are a lot of people in this forum that graduate from a nursing program and seem to think they have achieved the impossible. Granted, it is a great accomplishment to procure a degree in anything, but nursing school is not difficult for all of us. And NCLEX? please. Not worried about it.

[Orion81RN]

Typical comment from an allnurses critic extraordinaire!

Well, it was a good response. If you feel they lack the knowledge and skills to provide safe care, the managers need to know. Preferably speaking to the nurse herself first.

It would have been a different matter if you had posted your concerns and asked advice on how to approach the people who need to know.

[Orion81RN]

I doubt it. People always say that. Then, when you approach them, they get defensive and PO'd.

Perhaps it's your wording. Either way, the person needs to know. Leave how they take it to them, and if serious enough, management. Try to make it less about the nurse, and more about patient safety. If someone can't handle constructive criticism, that's not your problem, and you can move forward with a clear conscience knowing you did the right thing by advocating for the patients receiving sub par care.

[HappyCamperRN]

I have found that contrary to conventional wisdom it's not at all universally necessary for a person to be an astute, highly competent, hard-working, student to get through nursing school or to be selected for nursing employment, nor is it necessary to be an astute, knowledgeable, highly competent nurse, to be a valued employee. Far, far, from it. Excellence is definitely not always valued or rewarded, in fact, many people, including some nursing instructors and employers, are threatened by the possibility that a student or employee could be excellent, and will prefer the lesser able person for a multitude of self serving reasons. We are taught to strive for excellence; the reality is that if we strive conscientiously to be excellent in what we do and we succeed in becoming excellent, it may well work against us.

I couldn't agree more. There will always be self serving people/employers/employees trying to keep others with a bright future from suceeding. We all had to start somewhere, not knowing everything, but some fail to realize that about others. We have a charge RN that likes to talk about how stupid some nurses are on the floor but fails to help the new nurses or new employees to improve. Nursing is a constant learning curve based on a lot of actual experience and research. I am not sure why some people think that others success will detract from their own, so they feel the need to sabotage those folks.

[KalipsoRed21, BSN, RN]

I think of this as more of a comment on how poorly trained people are through nursing programs now. Kinda like how I feel about my grandchildren and their highschool. They both do not deserve the diploma they have.

[Guest219794]

Perhaps it's your wording. Either way, the person needs to know. Leave how they take it to them, and if serious enough, management. Try to make it less about the nurse, and more about patient safety. If someone can't handle constructive criticism, that's not your problem, and you can move forward with a clear conscience knowing you did the right thing by advocating for the patients receiving sub par care.

I don't think this is about the nurse who still "aspirates" an IM, or rubs the spot after, or uses Trendelenburg, or does a Valsava vs a Modified valsalva.....

This is about missing basic concepts, and lacking either the aptitude or ambition to understand them.

No amount of constructively crafted feedback will create aptitude.

I am not a good dancer. I lack rhythm. And grace. It does not matter how you speak to me about dancing, I will still not be a good dancer. Ever. I do not have the aptitude. Even if I passed a 2 year dancing course, and somehow passed my national dance exam, I would suck at dancing, and you would wonder how the heck I made it this far.

Now substitute "nurse" for "dance".

That is what this vent started as.

Oh- I forgot to mention- I think I am a great dancer. In school, some of the instructors picked on me, and all 6 choreographers who fired me were ignorant.

[Orion81RN]

I just want to mention, if people don't bring up various subjects here at allnurses, there won't be any discussions. I find it baffling when someone criticizes a thread saying 'why talk about this with a bunch of strangers?'. I wonder why they waste time here if they disagree with the basic premise of discussion forums.

You're right. That is a very good point. I just think in this example, it would benefit that nurse and most importantly her patients, if something was done or said about it. Then come here and give us all the juicy gossip. LOL We could all then share in our own "duh" moments.

Oooh, that might be a good thread. What are some "dumb" mistakes you've made, or "duh" moments you've had.

I have had plenty. I'll have to think about a good one and start a thread.

You are right, though. A lot of us did come at you kind of strong. I'm sorry.

[Orion81RN]

I don't think this is about the nurse who still "aspirates" an IM, or rubs the spot after, or uses Trendelenburg, or does a Valsava vs a Modified valsalva.....

This is about missing basic concepts, and lacking either the aptitude or ambition to understand them.

No amount of constructively crafted feedback will create aptitude.

I am not a good dancer. I lack rhythm. And grace. It does not matter how you speak to me about dancing, I will still not be a good dancer. Ever. I do not have the aptitude. Even if I passed a 2 year dancing course, and somehow passed my national dance exam, I would suck at dancing, and you would wonder how the heck I made it this far.

Now substitute "nurse" for "dance".

That is what this vent started as.

Oh- I forgot to mention- I think I am a great dancer. In school, some of the instructors picked on me, and all 6 choreographers who fired me were ignorant.

The difference is you did not become a dancer. The nurse in OPs case did become a nurse and HAS to have the aptitude to be one. So if patients are at risk, it MUST be brought to the attention of management.

Let's say the nurse is in ED. Comes off dumb as rocks. Maybe the ED isn't a good fit for her at this time. Maybe that nurse would Excel on another unit. Management needs to know.

[KatieMI, BSN, MSN, RN]

I don't think this is about the nurse who still "aspirates" an IM, or rubs the spot after, or uses Trendelenburg, or does a Valsava vs a Modified valsalva.....

This is about missing basic concepts, and lacking either the aptitude or ambition to understand them.

No amount of constructively crafted feedback will create aptitude.

I am not a good dancer. I lack rhythm. And grace. It does not matter how you speak to me about dancing, I will still not be a good dancer. Ever. I do not have the aptitude. Even if I passed a 2 year dancing course, and somehow passed my national dance exam, I would suck at dancing, and you would wonder how the heck I made it this far.

Now substitute "nurse" for "dance".

That is what this vent started as.

Oh- I forgot to mention- I think I am a great dancer. In school, some of the instructors picked on me, and all 6 choreographers who fired me were ignorant.

The problem is that sense of rhythm, grace and turnout can be developed only to the point. One has to be born with slight dysplasia of hip joints in order to have good degree of turnout later in life. Some people even seem to crawl gracefully, some are not and there is not much to be done about it.

Unlike the above, logic, analytical thinking and knowledge base can be totally and fully developed, and in pretty much any age. But people just refuse to do it. They refuse to use their own brains.

I got a panic call yesterday from a nurse. Patient was started on dialysis recently and was prescribed colchicine (highly nephtotoxic drug). Nurse was wondering if it should be held.

"Now, just think" - I said - "why should we care about the kidneys now, when the patient already is on HD?"

It took for the nurse full 30 sec and then some cues to realize what it was about.

It was, for me, a common logic. Kidneys are already out of the game as far as we are concerned. Even if the drug kills half of the remaining 5% of function, it doesn't matter from now on - HD is on board. And patient had acute gout, which is VERY painful. I did not need renal dose table, HD filtration dosing table or even advanced knowledge of HD to make this decision, which took me a split second. But for the nurse it seemed to be a significant effort to understand this basic connection. Everything the nurse knew was 1) patient is in renal failure, and 2) drug is bad for kidneys. The nurse just couldn't insert one more dot between the two and connect them all with straight line.

This nurse passed school, NCLEX and everything else and was very successful in a place where I was abused into stress-related cardiomyopathy.

[broughden]

Unlike the above, logic, analytical thinking and knowledge base can be totally and fully developed, and in pretty much any age.

"Fully" developed but only to the limits of their capacity. Not everyone's capacity is the same.

[KatieMI, BSN, MSN, RN]

"Fully" developed but only to the limits of their capacity. Not everyone's capacity is the same.

Something tells me that potential capacities of many people around us, including our nursing colleagues, are much higher than we can predict. They just not get used. If a person is able to discuss for hours the minorest things about college football or golf or guns, then there are no problems about intellect or memory.

[Ruby Vee, BSN]

Honestly, I still wonder how did I make it through undergrad accounting for vicious antiintellectualism of some of my classmates, professors and colleagues.

Being smarter than the majority of people around you sucks, plain and simple. It doesn't make life and job any easier, and there's pretty much nothing to be done with it.

People who think they know everything make it really tough for those of us who really do know everything! (Tongue firmly planted in cheek).

Dunning and Kruger were spot on!