Is my rage justified. My friend just flunked out of her first semester at Charity with a 76 average. 77 is the cut. The failing question (and I don't know it word for word, but here is the general gist of it): An african woman who lives in Africa has an intestinal bug. She believes that by eating pumpkin seeds, the bug will be eliminated. Is this a : religious belief, a cultural belief, is she correct, and few other choices. My friend answered, a cultural belief. As per the teacher: WRONG. First of all, regardless of the question or answer, how is this question even relevant to Nursing? Upon doing her homework and research, she could prove it very much IS a cultural thing. She appealed the question. The woman who wrote the question refused to budge and the committee sided with her. So boom. My freind is out. Never mind she is an excellent student. I am outraged. 44 people apparently missed that stupid, trick, unfair, irrelevant question. When teachers result to trickery on exams, it is so unfair and the students will never win. What can be done about this? This is a power issue and the teacher is getting off on it. People like that have got to go. I am beginning Charity in January. If I wasn't sufficiently terrified before, I certainly am now. Feedback, please.
Specializes in Peds/outpatient FP,derm,allergy/private duty.
Is my rage justified. My friend just flunked out of her first semester of Nursing School with a 76 average. 77 is the cut. The failing question (and I don't know it word for word, but here is the general gist of it): An african woman who lives in Africa has an intestinal bug. She believes that by eating pumpkin seeds, the bug will be eliminated. Is this a : religious belief, a cultural belief, is she correct, and few other choices. My friend answered, a cultural belief. As per the teacher: WRONG. First of all, regardless of the question or answer, how is this question even relevant to Nursing? Upon doing her homework and research, my friend could argue it very much IS a cultural thing. She appealed the question. The woman who wrote the question refused to budge and the appeals committee sided with her. So boom. My freind is out. Never mind she is an excellent student. I am outraged. 44 people apparently missed this question. When teachers result to trickery on exams, it is so unfair and the students will never win. What can be done about this? This is, no doubt, a power issue and the teacher is getting off on it. People like that have got to go. BTW, she is a mean and unhappy woman who has been teaching at the school forever. I am beginning in January at the same institution. If I wasn't sufficiently terrified before, I certainly am now. Feedback, please.
No, your rage is not justified. Your friend set herself up for failure long before she missed whatever question this actually was. It's a poor strategy as a student and as a nurse to knowingly leave yourself a smaller margin of error than you absolutely have to and gamble your entire future career on the small probability that you can have an average of 76% going in and expect to do well enough on that one test to keep the entire train from derailing.
The particulars of that one question aren't really relevant, but even if they were -- you are asking us to evaluate a question while providing us with vague information and only two of the possible answers out of an unknown ("a few") number of other possible answers. From the information that is provided, "cultural" does sound like it would be correct, but that still doesn't address the central issue. The reason it's relevant to nursing is that we often encounter people who's cultural beliefs are at odds with standard Western medical care, so we have to be sensitive to that and do a lot of explaining without seeming to be disrespectful of their traditional beliefs. Every nursing program has questions like these. I had a test question in one class that started off like that one, but the patient thought their disease was caused by "the evil eye". It would be inappropriate to mock that belief, while at the same time we need to educate the patient about the science of their disorder and explain the treatment and how it works.
You might suggest that all the homework and research she put into her attempt to get her answer accepted would have been better done all along, so that one question would not make or break her entire future in school. On the plus side, it's her first semester, and now she has a chance to alter her future behavior without losing years of nursing school, as happens sometimes.
You and/or your friend describe the teacher as a deceptive power-tripping person who gets off on getting people kicked out of the program. But you don't know this person. I've had people tell me such and such person is a fire-breathing battleaxe from hell and then found out myself they were actually likeable, so don't go into school assuming the worst about anyone. I think that is just the decent thing to do. Best wishes in nursing school!
Don't be angry for your friend, what a waste of energy! She obviously didn't give herself a wide-enough gap to miss a question like that. Just don't fall into the same pattern as her and you won't have such a bad experience w/ that particular class as your friend did. Stay positive and learn from your friend's mistake, don't stew about it!
My personal opinion is that if one is struggling with Cs in the nursing program, they're either a) unmotivated, or b) just don't grasp the material. I personally would not want either type as my nurse.
In school (as an adult learner), I've always been an overachiever. I would consider it an epic fail to get a C in any class. If my grade in any class starts to get below a 92%, I start kicking myself. If that makes me 'elitist' so be it. But I know I'm capable of As (even with three children and a fulltime job) so if I get less than an A, I know it was because I wasn't trying hard enough. And BTW, in my graduate program, a C = failing. You need to maintain at least a B average to stay in the program.
Thank you for that, I was getting the feeling everyone on here was satisfied with mediocrity. When have we become so complacent?
Why the bar is set so low for nursing school is beyond me. I would really question the school where a measly C was considered a passing grade. Getting at least a B average is attainable by most people and it has nothing to do with how smart you are, but your attitude and motivation and determination.
Perhaps I'm stuck in the 'old' way of looking at grades.. but in my little world I always thought that:
F= epic failing
D= sub-par/failing
C=average
B=above average
A=excellent
I realize that in NS we have to do 78 or better to be considered passing. I've kind of assumed that was because they don't want the lower side of average (and below) students moving on. Leaving the C+ (high average) and above to move on. They have the right to keep standards wherever they wish.
BUT- I personally think calling a C+ student academically challenged is a little insulting. (I've made a couple C+ in my college career)
I've seen a lot of elitist (you should be able to make As all through or you shouldn't become a nurse/graduate/be allowed to live) comments on here and I must say I find it ridiculous. Straight As are simply not a possibility for many, many otherwise well qualified and equally bright students.
It's easy to say, "YOU SHOULDN'T BE A NURSE IF YOU CAN MAKE A 90 or 99.9 or 95" or whatever ridiculously high value you want place on passing students if you were a straight A never had a blip kind of student. Good for you.
For the rest of us, there are a more reasonable guidelines (high C+ and up). Thank heaven someone in the nursing school world realizes that the ability to memorize and regurgitate mountains of information for test purposes isn't the ONLY measure of a good nurse.
Forgive me, but I find your scoring interpretation rather odd; you find difference between F and D when both mean exactly the same thing; failure. Then your next grade up (grade C), is considered to be 'average'? So, effectively what you're saying is, that 'average' is a student that is only one grade from failure; I respectfully disagree.
Next, what I see you doing is attempt to create yet another level (between failure and average), by your artificial distinction between C minus and C plus. Your description of 'high' C plus (I'm assuming versus low C minus) I see makes a real difference to you. However for me, whether someone scores a 70 or 79 is immaterial, both remain academically challenged or sub par or below average.
Again, IMHO, some become so emotionally invested in the labeling that they rationalize and engineer hair splitting ways to take the personal affront out of it, even if they blatantly resort to artifice to do so. While you may consider calling a C student academically challenged to be personally insulting, the grading system is what it is. No amount of creative word play or semantically distancing oneself is going to turn that C into a B. The only thing that does that is hard academic work.
My suggestion for those who wish to avoid the academically challenged labeling; do better.
This reminds me of an argument I regularly have with my 8th grade son (who has a genius level IQ, but ZERO motivation). "But mo-om, Cs are 'average'!" "I don't care, you're capable of better than 'average'."
My personal opinion is that if one is struggling with Cs in the nursing program, they're either a) unmotivated, or b) just don't grasp the material. I personally would not want either type as my nurse.
In school (as an adult learner), I've always been an overachiever. I would consider it an epic fail to get a C in any class. If my grade in any class starts to get below a 92%, I start kicking myself. If that makes me 'elitist' so be it. But I know I'm capable of As (even with three children and a fulltime job) so if I get less than an A, I know it was because I wasn't trying hard enough. And BTW, in my graduate program, a C = failing. You need to maintain at least a B average to stay in the program.
P.S. I'm an awesome clinical nurse, as well. So book smarts and real-world smarts are not mutually exclusive.
I have one child who is an A student...if he brings home 70 I lecture as I know he can do better, that said, another one of my children is a 60-75 percent child...they bring home a 50 they get lectured...they bring home a 70 and I applaud them :)
Specializes in M/S, MICU, CVICU, SICU, ER, Trauma, NICU.
This reminds me of an argument I regularly have with my 8th grade son (who has a genius level IQ, but ZERO motivation). "But mo-om, Cs are 'average'!" "I don't care, you're capable of better than 'average'."
My personal opinion is that if one is struggling with Cs in the nursing program, they're either a) unmotivated, or b) just don't grasp the material. I personally would not want either type as my nurse.
In school (as an adult learner), I've always been an overachiever. I would consider it an epic fail to get a C in any class. If my grade in any class starts to get below a 92%, I start kicking myself. If that makes me 'elitist' so be it. But I know I'm capable of As (even with three children and a fulltime job) so if I get less than an A, I know it was because I wasn't trying hard enough. And BTW, in my graduate program, a C = failing. You need to maintain at least a B average to stay in the program.
P.S. I'm an awesome clinical nurse, as well. So book smarts and real-world smarts are not mutually exclusive.
Your son is gifted but has fallen into the trap that most gifted kids fall into...the unmotivated, but genius kid. The opposite end of the spectrum that people think "aw, they're so smart--they don't need help..." BS...I had to fight for both of my kids (also very gifted) in order for them to remain motivated. Now that they are teens, they are self-motivated, and strive for excellence. One wants to be a doctor, and the other wants to be a lawyer. Please look at hoagiesgifted.org for some help. It really helped my kids.
As for being smart and clinically excellent--you are correct, they are NOT mutually exclusive.
I got ONE c in nursing school on a test, and I deserved it. The hardest C I ever worked for. Otherwise, it was fun and challenging most times (I started college planning on being an Engineer)..and I have to say, I graduated #1.
You do need smarts and BIG TIME smarts for grad school...so I'd like to say that it pays to be smart...and shouldn't be maligned by those who perceive the "smarties" as non-clinically inclined chumps.....
Pfffft, who needs an appendix anyway, they take them out all the time.
Yes, but it's MY appendix So what if it's a useless piece of tissue, we've come a long way together! AND they've already taken my tonsils, they can be satisfied with that!
On one hand, I think that good grades are important because they show that w student had an understanding of the material presented and knows how to apply it.
On the other hand - good grades does not necessarily mean you are a good nurse and can apply what you have learned in school to the real life setting.
We had a student on our unit once for her pre-grad (last placement before grad).
We were told numberous times that this girl was an A+ student. Yet, give her more than 1 pt and she couldn't cope. Her preceptor tried and tired. One pt - OK. 2 pts - complete disator. Just could not figure out how to priortise and manage care. Never mind working toward the usual assingment of 5 or 6. Her preceptor tired and tried. Nothing worked. Finally, 1/2 way through, she was finally removed and put back to the semester before final. She just couldn't cope no matter what we did (and trust me, we all tried) yet she was an A+ student.
So do marks matter?
I don't know.
I would say that if someome failed because their grades we 74% and passing was 75% then they must not have been doing well in clinical as well.
Specializes in Emergency Dept. Trauma. Pediatrics.
Yes, but it's MY appendix So what if it's a useless piece of tissue, we've come a long way together! AND they've already taken my tonsils, they can be satisfied with that!
The appendix is how I know God is a man. Anytime a man puts something together there are always extra parts.
So what if it's a useless piece of tissue, we've come a long way together! AND they've already taken my tonsils, they can be satisfied with that! 
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roser13, ASN, RN
6,504 Posts
Very, very small risk of that. Likely you're thinking of irritation of diverticulii.