Healthcare Costs and Unvaccinated Patients

[guest1168940]

Several articles from Forbes and others have reported the costs of healthcare of unvaccinated individuals is burdened almost entirely by private entities and the public in the billions.  A waiver (when your hospitalized most of the bill is covered) used by most insurers for hospitalizations is now being declined by some or will stop at the end of the year if unvaccinated. The urgent and long term costs such as ecmo (80k per week I believe it’s higher), post lung transplant, loss of wages if the family breadwinner will and have presented a financial and moral dilemma for Americans. The insurance companies and health care facilities will most likely never deny care but certainly this has come to light as we go into the third year of the pandemic. I am interested in others opinions about how society should or should not bear the brunt of free choice. Thank you.

[Guest219794]

11 hours ago, Stacie McClellan said:

The thing about this argument is that there is no fast, easy way to prevent CHF, diabetes or COPD like the vaccination for Covid. If you had a 3 shot regimen to prevent them most of the people affected would be lining up in droves to get it. The fact that there is a safe, quick, easy and effective way of preventing Covid makes this different from lifestyle diseases. 
 

I’m obese and diabetic. Have battled my weight for years. If it could go away with 3 shots I’d be thrilled to take them so I would no longer have these issues and wouldn’t use healthcare resources. 

And this, ^^^^^, is the crux of why the analogy falls short.  
The bottom line is that there are not enough resources for everybody.

It is not unreasonable to require anybody who wants to draw from these resources to contribute something.  All we ask that they contribute is getting vaccinated.  I am not suggesting that we stop caring for the unvaccinated.  But, others are truly suffering as a result of that decision.  I think it, at this point, it may be reasonable to prioritize care for those who did participate by getting vaccinated.

And, if we had a sudden explosion of obesity wreaking havoc on this country, crippling healthcare, and that pandemic was largely preventable, I would feel the same way. 

 

[guest1168940]

Wapo has an article today that five states (guess the red state LOL) give unemployment benefits for those fired for not vaccinating against covid. Just sayin.

[subee, MSN, CRNA]

4 minutes ago, lMCRN said:

Wapo has an article today that five states (guess the red state LOL) give unemployment benefits for those fired for not vaccinating against covid. Just sayin.

Moron states.  As a taxpayer in those states, Iwould be outraged but I guess a lot of people in those states don't pay taxes - they are too poor because they repeatedly vote against their economic interests.  I have a Southern relative who is a Trump supporter because he would "bring back coal."  This is a person who has a college degree but obviously only listens to her favorite source of news....Fox.  She's totally oblivious to development of renewables and believes that someone will actually wants to buy all that coal anymore.  She lives in one of those moron states and I guess is OK with paying taxes for people to sit home and do nothing.
 

[chevyv, BSN, RN]

Our inpatients are just about half and half. Half are fully vaccinated and half aren't. I was off of work for nearly a month with covid in November. I am fully vaxxed and my hubs refuses to get vaxxed.  He tested negative 2 times and never got it. We are so quick to blame and judge. As nurses we care for those that are sick. 

Some do believe forcing a vaccine on them is unreasonable. 

Who out there didn't know that this fall/Winter was going to see a huge step in those needing care? I'm in the Midwest and every fall/Winter we catch and spread everything. Now we have nurses coming back after 5 days still sick but can't afford to stay home.  Good times

[Guest219794]

11 hours ago, chevyv said:

We are so quick to blame and judge

It is true that the unvaccinated are largely being blamed with the extent of this disaster.  That is because they are, literally, to blame. That is the objective truth.  As far as judging- well, that is a little more subjective.

11 hours ago, chevyv said:

As nurses we care for those that are sick.

That is what I do every work day.  Blame and judgement are irrelevant. I do the best I can every time.  I, and almost every nurse and doctor I know who actually works in this environment, resents the unvaccinated for their role in this.  Personally, I focus my anger on the leaders of this death movement, not their victims.   

[macawake, MSN]

11 hours ago, chevyv said:

I was off of work for nearly a month with covid in November. I am fully vaxxed and my hubs refuses to get vaxxed.  He tested negative 2 times and never got it.

What’s the purpose of your n=2 anecdote? Because it sounds like to me that you are attempting to downplay the importance of getting vaccinated. Whatever happened to you and your husband is extremely uninteresting in terms of public health. Looking at the effects of the vaccines on a population level, we know that the vaccines work and that they have saved countless lives. So what was your reason for posting this? 
 

11 hours ago, chevyv said:

Some do believe forcing a vaccine on them is unreasonable. 

Who are ”some” people? This is like saying ”many people say” or ”think”. It’s so extremely vague and poorly defined that the statement is rendered useless. Are you one of the people that believe that forcing a vaccine on someone is unreasonable? If so, why not just say it? (Not that anyone is being forced). 
 

11 hours ago, chevyv said:

Who out there didn't know that this fall/Winter was going to see a huge step in those needing care? I'm in the Midwest and every fall/Winter we catch and spread everything. 

No it’s not like every other Winter season. It’s like every other Winter season plus Omicron. 

This is in my opinion a great resource. Look at the trajectory of the number of hopitalized Covid patients in the U.S. in the last couple of weeks. You can also look at for example the UK where the Omicron variant became dominant a couple of weeks earlier than in the U.S.

---

https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/current-covid-hospitalizations-per-million?time=2020-10-31..latest&country=USA~GBR

 

[subee, MSN, CRNA]

13 hours ago, chevyv said:

Our inpatients are just about half and half. Half are fully vaccinated and half aren't. I was off of work for nearly a month with covid in November. I am fully vaxxed and my hubs refuses to get vaxxed.  He tested negative 2 times and never got it. We are so quick to blame and judge. As nurses we care for those that are sick. 

Some do believe forcing a vaccine on them is unreasonable. 

Who out there didn't know that this fall/Winter was going to see a huge step in those needing care? I'm in the Midwest and every fall/Winter we catch and spread everything. Now we have nurses coming back after 5 days still sick but can't afford to stay home.  Good times

Refusing a vaccine is also unreasonable and unconsionable.

[chevyv, BSN, RN]

I apologize for voicing thoughts and not digging up facts that may or may not support my thoughts. I just come here to unwind after work. 

[londonflo]

Here in my city, there are 2/3rds unvaccinated and 1/3rd vaccinated in the hospital. I gotta say if I went to Las Vegas and knew I had a 1/3rd (33%) of winning versus a 2/3rd (66%) of winning, I would of course go for the 2/3rds for the odds. 

[macawake, MSN]

1 hour ago, londonflo said:

Here in my city, there are 2/3rds unvaccinated and 1/3rd vaccinated in the hospital. I gotta say if I went to Las Vegas and knew I had a 1/3rd (33%) of winning versus a 2/3rd (66%) of winning, I would of course go for the 2/3rds for the odds. 

You’d be making the correct ♦️♣️♥️♠️ choice ? 

The 2:1 risk for an unvaccinated person of ending up hospitalized with a Covid infection is in reality even worse than those odds. The odds are only correct if the exact same percentage of the population is vaccinated vs unvaccinated, I.e. 50/50. If more than 50% are vaccinated than the risk is even higher for the unvaccinated. I’m not sure exactly what the numbers are in your area but for the entire country, well over half the eligible population is vaccinated.

In my country, two weeks ago the risk of becoming hospitalized with a Covid infection was 12 times higher for an unvaccinated individual compared to a vaccinated one. 
 

(I have no idea why the I in I.e. becomes capitalized. That’s not what I’m typing ?)

[matlee123]

Moronic antivaxers…or are they people who weighed the information and felt mRNA technology was too risky and risks outweighed benefits for themselves? Maybe they’ve personally known several people who had severe life altering adverse reactions that nobody in the medical field can solve yet and government won’t pay for?

I’m home recovering from Covid. You know who gave it to me? A vaccinated colleague. Does anyone know how long the cells of the vaccinated will continue manufacturing spike proteins? Do these contribute to that never ending pandemic? Have any studies been done that give us answers? Maybe it’s the vaccinated that are now driving this train. 

[subee, MSN, CRNA]

2 hours ago, matlee123 said:

Moronic antivaxers…or are they people who weighed the information and felt mRNA technology was too risky and risks outweighed benefits for themselves? Maybe they’ve personally known several people who had severe life altering adverse reactions that nobody in the medical field can solve yet and government won’t pay for?

I’m home recovering from Covid. You know who gave it to me? A vaccinated colleague. Does anyone know how long the cells of the vaccinated will continue manufacturing spike proteins? Do these contribute to that never ending pandemic? Have any studies been done that give us answers? Maybe it’s the vaccinated that are now driving this train. 

How can you know who transmitted the virus to you without a molecular genetic test to verify your virus? You may THiNK that, but that doesn't make it true.  The purpose of the covid vaccine isn't to stop the transmission of the virus but is to lower the viral load you receive and keep you, or someone immnocompromised, out of the hospital.  There is no way to stop the transmission of the virus and that's why it will be endemic.