Governor Dean changes his mind and his views...

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i am no dean fan...he changes his mind and position more often than i change my clothes...i still have no idea who i will vote for, but as an independent, i certainly peruse the views of all.....here is a letter written by dean concerning bosnia...just insert iraq and the same letter applies, then of course....interesting that he is so against things now...i profess no prejudice toward any other candidate but this certainly interested me...guess it has to do with it being a campaign year and his thoughts were to a democratic president..or, perhaps the atrocities committed in iracq were somehow less important than bosnia...in his mind , anyway...

howard dean letter to president clinton

below is the text of howard dean's letter to president clinton on the conflict in bosnia, dated july 19, 1995.

the honorable william j. clinton

president of the united states

the white house

washington, d.c. 20500

dear mr. president:

after long and careful thought, and after several years of watching the gross atrocities committed by the bosnian serbs, i have reluctantly concluded that the efforts of the united nations and nato in bosnia are a complete failure.

i think your policy up to this date has been absolutely correct. we must give, and have given, this policy with our allies and with the united nations every opportunity to work. it is evident, however, that the cost in human lives in allowing this policy to continue is too great. in addition, and perhaps more importantly for the united states, we are now in a position of ignoring, as many did in the 1940s, one of the worst crimes committed in history. if we ignore these behaviors, no matter where they occur, our moral fiber as a people becomes weakened. as the catholic church and others lost credibility during the holocaust for not speaking out, so will the united states lose credibility and our people lose confidence in themselves as moral beings if the united states does not take action.

since it is clearly no longer possible to take action in conjunction with nato and the united nations, i have reluctantly concluded that we must take unilateral action. while i completely agree with you that no ground troops should be committed for other than humanitarian purposes in bosnia, i would ask that you take the following steps in bosnia. first, lift the arms embargo as it applies to the bosnian government. second, enforce a full embargo of the sort that is now in effect in iraq on the bosnian serbs and upon yugoslavia. third, break off diplomatic relations with yugoslavia. fourth, commit american air power to support the bosnian government until the situation is stabilized and the civilian murders and atrocities by the bosnian serbs have been stopped.

i understand the risks of this policy and their implications for the nato alliance and the future success of the united nations. surely, however, as you watch and read about the huge amount of unwarranted human suffering, particularly of children, you would agree that our current course must now be changed.

i urge you to make these changes as soon as possible, and i look forward to supporting your policy fully to the best of my ability.

sincerely,

howard dean, m.d.

governor

/color]

Specializes in Med/Surg, Geriatrics.
Originally posted by fergus51

We don't have to invade SA to get their oil, because they are our best friends in the middle east....

Isn't that something? Talk about hypocrisy. Saudia Arabia has THE most brutal dictatorship in the world, it was worse than Iraq yet all those who are always bemoaning the atrocities of Iraq seem to care less about our good "friends" the Saudis. Oh and what was the nationality of the majority of the 9/11 terrorists? Hmmmm......

Dean wrote that letter NINE YEARS AGO!

Sheesh!

Originally posted by SharonMH31

Isn't that something? Talk about hypocrisy. Saudia Arabia has THE most brutal dictatorship in the world, it was worse than Iraq yet all those who are always bemoaning the atrocities of Iraq seem to care less about our good "friends" the Saudis. Oh and what was the nationality of the majority of the 9/11 terrorists? Hmmmm......

Saudia Arabia is THE MOST brutal dictatorship in the world? Worse than Iraq was?

hmmmmmm . . . .

I suppose it depends on your outlook Steph. I do think SH was definitely more sadistic, but I would not want to go to SA either. ESPECIALLY AS A WOMAN! Their "justice" system is as crooked as they come, and there have been many cases of torture and abuse coming from there, similar to Iraqi prisonner's treatment and their political scene is as oppressive to say the least.

Frankly, i don't think which is worse even matters. Saying a country has a better human rights record than Iraq is certainly no defense for their treatment of their citizens. You also have to remember that this is one of the only countries in the world that recognized the Taliban as the proper government of Afghanistan and funnels the most money into extremist Islamic groups, while exporting the most radical version of Islam in existence. I'd have been more in favor of invading SA than Iraq.

When I hear him rant, I know where I have expereinced that rant...

He is an Arrogant Physician in the middle of the nurses station who can't find his charts.

first and foremost - noone is "lying through their teeth" - everyone is allowed an opinion and it is quite possible to people to see the exact same situation differently...however

the country WAS NOT TOLD we were invading due to WMD.... we were told time and time again about a deadline..... SH was not allowing inspectors where they needed/wanted to go...he was not cooperating....THERE WAS A DEADLINE....praises to GWB for standing by what he says...we have rarely had a president do that...yet we always complain about it......"he said he would do this and he didn't"

We finally have someone who sticks by what they say and WE STILL COMPLIAN?!?!?!? Republican or Democrat doesn't really matter to me...they are a mixed bag anymore anyway....but the President of the US should have the ability to say something and stand by it...even in the wake of the critisism he has taken....And all this Unilateral talk....the other nations knew we would do their work for them because they knew we had a president who would put his money where his mouth was....why would they spend their money when the US could do their dirty work for them....Read last nite where they are likely coming in to help NOW!!!

and this wasn't the US out of their own....there were other countries...namely Britain who completely agreed....hmm... makes you think...two of the strongest countries in the world, best intel etc...saying "yes" we need to get in there....

honestly, i think that whoever would have been president would have been in an impossible situation...they will always have those who support and those who critisize.......and as the devil's advocate...if this was ultimately over oil....we freed a country, stopped a ruthless dictator from hurting more people, and made some money?!?!? AND SO???

Originally posted by stevielynn

Saudia Arabia is THE MOST brutal dictatorship in the world? Worse than Iraq was?

hmmmmmm . . . .

Well if Saudi Arabia isn't the worst they offered a safe harbor to the worst. Idi Amin the Ugandan butcher was given refuge there.

Originally posted by wjf00

Well if Saudi Arabia isn't the worst they offered a safe harbor to the worst. Idi Amin the Ugandan butcher was given refuge there.

I agree with StevieLynn Idi Amin got creamed by the Israeli Army, still what does this have to do with Dean being a yutz?

Specializes in Med/Surg, Geriatrics.
Originally posted by stevielynn

Saudia Arabia is THE MOST brutal dictatorship in the world? Worse than Iraq was?

hmmmmmm . . . .

You're kidding, right? You didn't know? They still behead people there, amputate limbs as "punishment", stone them to death as well as good ole garden variety torture for any number of moral/political/religious offenses all without due process of law. To be fair, the top spot does rotate between SA and North Korea.

Your surprise/skepticism is proof of what a good snow job Shrub and co. has done of convincing the American people that we started this unnecessary war because we care so much about the Iraqi people (all the while shaking hands with the brutal Saudis). Hmmmmmm........

i never remember anyone saying we started the war primarily for the iraqi people...i do remember them saying that the freedom of the iraqi people was on the list....

so, you are telling us that if we unilaterally invaded saudi to free them from corporal punishment then you would support that?!?!

i am sure that every american would like to assist those who are under the leadership of tyrants...but the american people are arguing whether attacking a country for not adhering to deadlines in regard to WMD, possibly funding terrorism that occurred 9/11, and as a benefit - bringing freedom to the people is right or wrong....and then you are saying we don't care about human rights because we aren't attacking every country who abuses its people.....just for the sake of argument - perhaps there are those of you who are right...and GWB was just waiting to invade iraq...perhaps he was so disgusted w/ how sh tortured his people that he just wanted to get him out of power....but no...that couldn't be the reason, could it?!?! why all of the sudden is GWB the devil...i truly believe that no matter what he does - it will be argued as wrong....

I was taught to respect those in authority - i see no respect for the president of the US - and the American people voted him into office - he didn't vote himself there!!

Originally posted by BarbPick

When I hear him rant, I know where I have expereinced that rant...

He is an Arrogant Physician in the middle of the nurses station who can't find his charts.

Oh my gosh Barb . . . exactly!!!

steph

Specializes in Med/Surg, Geriatrics.
Originally posted by athomas91

just for the sake of argument - perhaps there are those of you who are right...and GWB was just waiting to invade iraq...perhaps he was so disgusted w/ how sh tortured his people that he just wanted to get him out of power....but no...that couldn't be the reason, could it?!?!

NO that couldn't be the reason. They wanted to get a foothold in the Middle East to protect American "intere$t$" and Iraq was merely the easy target.

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