Get CNA cert? Before NP?

[Polly Peptide]

I'm not sure where to put this, so I'm starting here. Will let mods move it if necessary.

I will be starting an MSN program this fall, which admits those with degrees in other fields; so I do not have any nursing experience. I do however have about 15 years experience on the business side of healthcare (which includes some population health management and financing), but of course nothing clinical. This is a very reputable program and is well known for graduating prepared NPs (though I'm under no illusions that you really begin learning when you start to practice).

My question is - because I am not an RN, and I will most likely start to practice as an NP without RN experience, would it benefit me to get my CNA certification and then work as a CNA while I am waiting for school to start? Pros, cons, neutral? I understand this is not what I will be doing as an NP, but I wondered if it would provide any skills practice, or even any 'street cred'? Would it help (AT ALL) in the hiring process down the line?

My specialty will be AG-ACNP.

Thanks for your advice.

[PG2018]

I wouldn't recommend either. Focus on finishing the NP then go to work.

[sailornurse]

Vanderbilt is in TN. The program is two years for those with bachelors degrees in fields other than nursing (though this is slightly variable if you seek a dual MSN, like FNP/CNM). The first year is spent essentially like an accelerated (very) BSN year, but they don't award the BSN. At the end of the first year, you must take the NCLEX and become an RN in order to move on into the second year (the specialty year and the true "masters" portion of the program). However the entire program is considered graduate level. Vandy does not offer any undergrad nursing degrees.

Vanderbilt has multiple specialty options and does not allow those without experience into certain ones (ENP, NNP, P-ACNP). Others they do.

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Yes and in my little town I have met 3 Vanderbilt grads from these direct entry programs and all 3 had to move far away to even be considered for jobs due to no nursing experience that's what the last 2 told me.

[CBlover, BSN, RN]

What state is this? Ive never heard of such a thing. The programs that i know of that are even similar to this topic are MSN entry programs to obtain an RN license and then from there allowed to enter a post-masters NP program. If im not mistaken its not even possible in state law for a school to enroll a person without an RN license or BSN for that matter. Let alone most reputable schools wont accept a person without a minimum of 1-2 years RN experience.

I said the same thing. Then I did a little looking around online and sure enough there's such programs. I would NEVER in a million years feel comfortable practicing as an NP with zero nursing experience, but apparently this is the new thing. Even as a nurse with 5 years experience under my belt the fact that I have no ICU experience alone is enough for me to feel uncomfortable.

[PG2018]

Yes and in my little town I have met 3 Vanderbilt grads from these direct entry programs and all 3 had to move far away to even be considered for jobs due to no nursing experience that's what the last 2 told me.

When I was hired for my position, it was never even asked if I'd been a RN in any environment.

Prove you're a good clinician in the NP role, during your clinical rotations, get references, and get a job. It's totally about who you know and what you know and can do as a diagnostician. Most NPs I know obtained their jobs because they had the credentialing to do the job rather than some arbitrary time spent as a staff nurse.

[PG2018]

Vanderbilt is in TN. The program is two years for those with bachelors degrees in fields other than nursing (though this is slightly variable if you seek a dual MSN, like FNP/CNM). The first year is spent essentially like an accelerated (very) BSN year, but they don't award the BSN. At the end of the first year, you must take the NCLEX and become an RN in order to move on into the second year (the specialty year and the true "masters" portion of the program). However the entire program is considered graduate level. Vandy does not offer any undergrad nursing degrees.

Vanderbilt has multiple specialty options and does not allow those without experience into certain ones (ENP, NNP, P-ACNP). Others they do.

There are quite a few other programs, and well known ones that do this. Johns Hopkins is an example.

Vanderbilt is a great school. I looked into the programs there to speed things up. I'm the end, I decided to spend more time working on the outcome rather than moving. I often wish I'd moved, lol.

[Polly Peptide, BSN, MSN, RN, APRN]

When I was hired for my position, it was never even asked if I'd been a RN in any environment.

Prove you're a good clinician in the NP role, during your clinical rotations, get references, and get a job. It's totally about who you know and what you know and can do as a diagnostician. Most NPs I know obtained their jobs because they had the credentialing to do the job rather than some arbitrary time spent as a staff nurse.

I know I won't have specific RN experience, but I have to start somewhere...so might as well start by working as hard as I can to be the best NP I can, learning as much as possible, asking questions, finding good mentors, applying myself at my program and again on my job. Thanks for the support and advice. I am very excited. This is a long-time goal of mine.

[evolvingrn, BSN, RN]

When I was hired for my position, it was never even asked if I'd been a RN in any environment.

Prove you're a good clinician in the NP role, during your clinical rotations, get references, and get a job. It's totally about who you know and what you know and can do as a diagnostician. Most NPs I know obtained their jobs because they had the credentialing to do the job rather than some arbitrary time spent as a staff nurse.

It came up in all of my interviews and was def an asset/ selling point ...... I still think you can sell yourself without it but living in a tighter market it does come up. I don't have a problem with these programs ..... I just don't get why you wouldn't go the pa role of you don't have a nursing background. They have so much more freedom in where they can practice

[Dogen]

I've worked with a handful of Vanderbilt grads and have generally been impressed. The school is great, and from practicing NPs I've never heard anything but good things about their students.

I'm with PsychGuy. I'm finishing an NP program, have had several job offers, and none of them have asked about my RN experience. Kill it in clinical, get letters of recommendation from faculty, and you'll be fine.

[Polly Peptide, BSN, MSN, RN, APRN]

It came up in all of my interviews and was def an asset/ selling point ...... I still think you can sell yourself without it but living in a tighter market it does come up. I don't have a problem with these programs ..... I just don't get why you wouldn't go the pa role of you don't have a nursing background. They have so much more freedom in where they can practice

I evaluated the PA vs NP option quite thoroughly and will not get into the whole medical model vs nursing model debate...

For me, it was just logical. I can't (won't) move. There is one PA school in my area and it is quite small. They require about a year of direct patient care experience before you can apply. They also require a few more pre-reqs beyond the Vandy option. And the program length is the same. It made no sense for me to get an EMT or CNA cert, work for a year, take additional pre-reqs, and then apply for a much smaller program with a lesser chance of getting in, when I can become an NP and they end up filling the same clinical roles anyway.

My biggest hurdle with the NP route was actually getting into my school of choice (Vanderbilt) and my specialty of choice. And I got in! I am very excited about that. With ACNP at Vanderbilt, they offer the option of specializing as an intensivist (which I haven't seen much with PAs) and you can certainly get into surgery if you want. Another thing you can do as an ACNP that you can NOT do if you go the PA route is move on into CRNA, if that ever calls your name. That's not really in my long term plan, but it's an option I wouldn't have otherwise.

[Dogen]

Another thing you can do as an ACNP that you can NOT do if you go the PA route is move on into CRNA, if that ever calls your name. That's not really in my long term plan, but it's an option I wouldn't have otherwise.

And, if you ever do decide to move, NPs are completely independent in some states (though not TN). I'll never have a supervising physician... because I don't plan on living in a state where I can't practice independently.

[PG2018]

I know I won't have specific RN experience, but I have to start somewhere...so might as well start by working as hard as I can to be the best NP I can, learning as much as possible, asking questions, finding good mentors, applying myself at my program and again on my job. Thanks for the support and advice. I am very excited. This is a long-time goal of mine.

I agree. Stay in the books. Learn everything you need to know and then some. Think about it. Sleep on it. Even though I'm in psychiatry, I try to stay on top of primary care related medicine and particularly neuro, endo, and sleep. In the end, regardless of where you work and what you do, you are going to be the patient's doctor so prepare yourself and handle yourself accordingly.

[PG2018]

And, if you ever do decide to move, NPs are completely independent in some states (though not TN). I'll never have a supervising physician... because I don't plan on living in a state where I can't practice independently.

You know, I live in a collaborative practice state, bit it doesn't impact my work. I'm the only prescriber hadn't in the clinic and only talk with the psychiatrist on a social basis by text message. I've seen him maybe twice in the last six months both times at conferences. My collaborative agreement basically says do whatever I learned to do in school and vocally it was "it's your clinic, do what you want." If you can find a practice like this you're golden.