Accusation Against Male Nurse (Me)

[Lapzs]

So here's the story. I am a male RN. Recently, I had a conflict while at work with a female CNA. For the sake of anonymity and simplicity, I will call her Jen. A relative of a patient of ours asked for his IV to be wrapped so that they can give him a shower (bless this family for being so involved in his care). I went off to find Jen in the break room and asked her if she was on break or on lunch. She said she was on lunch, so I replied "Ok it can wait then." I explained to the family that I couldn't wrap the IV at this particular time due to my having medications to pass to my other patients, but that Jen could do it when she came back from lunch. I even held the meds that I had in my hand up in the air for them to see. The family understood and said they can wait. I go off to pass my meds.

After I finished my last or second-to-last med pass, I was walking down the hall towards the nurses' station when I hear Jen's voice, screaming "Lapzs! Why didn't you wrap the IV?! The family's so pissed! God! You're so unprofessional!" I stood there dumbfounded. The only words I could get out were "I had meds to give." Before I could explain any more, she scoughed, turned around, and made way for the supply room. I called out her name, but she ignored me and went inside. I followed her in, and on my way I noticed a patient's family member looking stunned (possible witnessed what she was yelling about). The following conversation ensues (as I recall to the best of my memory):

Me: Jen. We need to talk.

Jen: God Lapzs! You could have wrapped the IV!

Me: First of all, if you have a problem with me, you take me somewhere private and talk. You don't yell at me in the hallway like that.

Jen: I wasn't yelling!

Me: Fine. But I told you. I had meds to pass.

Jen: That doesn't matter. You could have wrapped it before! God you are just so lazy!

She tries to walk around me to leave, but I stand in front of her to prevent her from doing so.

Jen: Don't you EVER do that to me!!!

Me: Fine. But we need to talk. We can't let this issue get out of this room. I already talked to the family. They were ok with it. Plus those meds were important.

Jen: You still could have wrapped it before.

Me: Do you want to pass my meds for me then? That is my job. That was my priority. If I could have wrapped it, I would have. And I already talked to them. This is your job. You're the CNA...

Jen: I'm NOT just a CNA! I'm more than that!

Me: Fine. So like I said, I had meds to give.

Jen: No! You could have wrapped it!

The back-and-forth goes on for a little while like that until she walks around me again and leaves. After that, the only time we talked again during the rest of the shift was when I asked her if she took a patient's blood pressure (she didn't document it) and she asked me about a patient's diet. I even talked to the patient's family afterwards and asked if there was a problem. They insisted there wasn't and asked me why I thought there was. I mentioned that I know Jen came to them a little while ago, and they said "Oh yeah she seemed pretty pissed."

We both talked to our charge RN individually. The next day (Jen wasn't working but I was), the same charge RN tells me that I need to apologize to Jen or do whatever I can to mend things because Jen told our director about this event and that she was going to file an incident report because she felt her safety was at risk. Charge RN tells me that our director told her to tell me to file a MIDAS (our internal reporting service) so that I can defend myself. Charge RN says that she already vouched for me. I filled out my MIDAS report at the end of my shift.

That's that. I am a 24 year old male RN and Jen is a 40-something year old CNA. I have been an RN on our med-surg/telemetry unit for two years. For pretty much all of that time, I was the only male worker, RN or CNA, on the floor on day shift. Jen and I have known each other that entire time. We were good friends and even took pictures together at work. Also, I'm confident most of my other female coworkers would vouch for me as well.

What do you all think? Was I in the wrong here? Was she in the wrong? Is my career and license in jeopardy? I know we both could have definitely handled things better, but I felt that her non-stop yelling, insulting, and unwillingness to slow down and listen and talk prevented us from squashing this issue.

[Emergent, RN]

I think if you're in the habit of tracking CNAs down in the break room to do a simple task that you could have done yourself, that wears thin. It sounds like it was the last straw for Jen. I advise you to not be one of those nurses again.

What I would have done would be to quickly wrap the IV. That's entirely within your job description.

Then, to demand to hash things out mid shift with a protracted back and forth argument was another mistake, and of course blocking her exit was totally inappropriate.

On Jen's part, her outburst was over the top. I think she must be feeling disrespected, she's older than you, and you are treating her like a servant to the point of interrupting her lunch to perform a menial task that you feel is beneath you.

I'm sure you can both move on. Be gracious and forgiving.

[Orca, ADN, ASN, RN]

I think if you're in the habit of tracking CNAs down in the break room to do a simple task that you could have done yourself, that wears thin.

Early in my career, I was assigned to a geropsych unit. A patient had soiled herself, and another RN of the floor was driving herself nuts trying to find one of the psych techs, and when she did, they were both busy with other patients. She looked exasperated. I told the charge nurse, "I don't know about you, but where I went to school, they taught me how to put on a pair of gloves." It took about 2-3 minutes to take care of the situation, and the other RN killed at least four or five times that trying to track down someone else to do it.

[Lapzs]

I'm not gonna reiterate how threatening blocking the CNA in was.

As far as wrapping the IV, I would've just done it. I'm willing to bet it took you more than 10 seconds. In that amount of time you could've just covered the IV site & avoided this whole mess.

This wasn't a shining moment for either of you two. But it has nothing to do with your gender.

I agree. For that, I need to apologize to her. However, only that.

I would have done it if I wasn't in the middle of something that I felt was more important. Pain and BP meds and antibiotics definitely take priority over wrapping an IV. All three I had to give plus a steroid and calling for RT to administer a breathing treatment. It took me about 10 seconds to find her because, like I said in that comment, I knew where she was. Our break room isn't too far from in front of the room where I was asked about the IV.

I mentioned our genders because of the incident report I was told she'd file.

[caliotter3]

You don't block somebody's egress.

[Lapzs]

I think if you're in the habit of tracking CNAs down in the break room to do a simple task that you could have done yourself, that wears thin. It sounds like it was the last straw for Jen. I advise you to not be one of those nurses again.

What I would have done would be to quickly wrap the IV. That's entirely within your job description.

Then, to demand to hash things out mid shift with a protracted back and forth argument was another mistake, and of course blocking her exit was totally inappropriate.

On Jen's part, her outburst was over the top. I think she must be feeling disrespected, she's older than you, and you are treating her like a servant to the point of interrupting her lunch to perform a menial task that you feel is beneath you.

I'm sure you can both move on. Be gracious and forgiving.

As I said in previous comments, I was in the middle of something I deemed took priority over an IV wrapping. I even explained to the family and they were fine with it. It was only Jen who had a problem with it.

I agree with you on the hashing things out mid shift part. Big mistake on my part. At the time, I felt it was my attempt to make things right before our tension leaked and impaired our quality of work.

She most likely did feel disrespected. Making her feel like a servant was not my intention. Still, I don't think it justifies her yelling at and insulting me. I asked her to do something that falls within her scope of practice. She just didn't like that I delayed it until after she came back from lunch.

And trust me, on our unit, both RNs' and CNAs' lunches are interrupted quite frequently. It just seems like the CNAs are more resolute in making sure they get their whole 30 minutes plus their two 15 minute breaks when compared to the RNs. But that's an entirely different topic.

[kakamegamama]

I agree. For that, I need to apologize to her. However, only that.

I would have done it if I wasn't in the middle of something that I felt was more important. Pain and BP meds and antibiotics definitely take priority over wrapping an IV. All three I had to give plus a steroid and calling for RT to administer a breathing treatment. It took me about 10 seconds to find her because, like I said in that comment, I knew where she was. Our break room isn't too far from in front of the room where I was asked about the IV.

I mentioned our genders because of the incident report I was told she'd file.

I agree that the meds were more important. Apologize for blocking her in, as you said you will. Yes, she does owe you an apology----her behavior in the hallway was unprofessional. However, if she doesn't, take the high road. It sounds as though you are acknowledging your own responsibility. I hope a good resolution results.

[GermanCookie, ADN, BSN, RN, EMT-P]

Lapzs,

First, I want to say that I think it's very, very respectable that you shared your story and included an honest account of your own shortcomings. This is an anonymous forum and you could have easily slanted some of the aspects of the story to make yourself sound much better than you were. But you didn't. You were honest and forthcoming and I appreciate that tremendously.

I don't need to repeat what everyone else has said regarding the inappropriate blocking of the door, it's all been said already. If I were in the CNA's shoes, I probably would have reacted the same way. On the other hand, I would not have been unprofessional enough to yell at you in private or in a hallway.

What I *will* say, is that my husband knows to be very, very cognizant of not only his body language, but of his tone and posture when dealing with people, particularly the opposite gender. This goes triple, because he's a pretty big guy. It can easily be misinterpreted or perceived as something far worse than it really is and as we all know, perception can be reality.

Keep us posted, and for what it's worth, I think you're a pretty decent guy who just made a poor choice. And were certainly not the only one in the wrong. Life happens, lessons are learned. Hang in there.

[OrganizedChaos, LVN]

I agree. For that, I need to apologize to her. However, only that.

I would have done it if I wasn't in the middle of something that I felt was more important. Pain and BP meds and antibiotics definitely take priority over wrapping an IV. All three I had to give plus a steroid and calling for RT to administer a breathing treatment. It took me about 10 seconds to find her because, like I said in that comment, I knew where she was. Our break room isn't too far from in front of the room where I was asked about the IV.

I mentioned our genders because of the incident report I was told she'd file.

So you can't multitask now? In all of the "10 seconds" (which I'm sure took longer) you couldn't wrap it yourself? I'm not arguing which one is more important. You were already there, why track down the tech? Seems counterintuitive to me. It's not like you weren't even close to the room. I just don't understand why you couldn't take the 1-2 minutes to cover the IV site instead of getting in this hot mess.

I see you've only been a nurse going on two years, I've been a nurse for 7. Let me give you some advice, learn when to pick your battles & how to multitask. Unless it was a code those pills weren't emergent & you could've covered the IV site while passing meds.

[DTWriter]

OP, never trust families to wait. Hence, one of the reasons why one would rather deal with inpatients at night

With that said, yes, blocking the door was a no-no but I am not sure if you should go to her (let alone, without witnesses) and apologize.

This is not the Barney-world where you can say "sorry" (or some fancy, long-winded apology) and then be able to work together as a team from here on out. In the real world, people hold grudges until they find a new person to be mad about. She may be the type who might take your apology as an admission of guilt and roll with it.

Personally, I would not bother with an apology if she already filed an incident report.

Based on your post, it seems that you are dealing with a CNA who (a) has personal issues going on and/or (b) has an inferiority complex.

Tread lightly from here on out.

[Kooky Korky, BSN, RN]

In today's world, you should always have a witness, especially when someone of the opposite gender is involved.

Try to be on the cameras that are absolutely ubiquitous these days.

Don't ever block anyone in. That could be a charge of false imprisonment, gender harassment, maybe other.

She should also be reprimanded for and apologize for calling you unprofessional and telling you to do the wrapping,

which you were right to not stop to do, IMHO. You can do her work, she cannot do yours. And she was wrong to

yell at you. And to yell at you in the hallway.

Honestly, the best thing to do would have been to tell the family the CNA would wrap the IV and tell them why,

just like you did. Then, if she ******* at you for not wrapping it yourself, just remind her that no one is going to

pass your meds for you and that she is perfectly capable of wrapping the IV.

I don't think the wrapping is necessarily "aide's work", nor is it beneath you or an imposition upon her. She just

sounds disrespectful and resentful.

Don't let the aides push your buttons any more. Just hold them in check. Only you can do your meds. The aides

can and should do the stuff you could do if you had time, after all of your own RN tasks are done. They get paid to

work

and they can dang well work. DO NOT EVER VERBALIZE THIS SENTIMENT. Even though it's true, you will be

crucified if you ever say it.

Now do try to make peace because your life will be smoother if you do.

[~Mi Vida Loca~RN, ASN, RN]

OP, never trust families to wait. Hence, one of the reasons why one would rather deal with inpatients at night

With that said, yes, blocking the door was a no-no but I am not sure if you should go to her (let alone, without witnesses) and apologize.

This is not the Barney-world where you can say "sorry" (or some fancy, long-winded apology) and then be able to work together as a team from here on out. In the real world, people hold grudges until they find a new person to be mad about. She may be the type who might take your apology as an admission of guilt and roll with it.

Personally, I would not bother with an apology if she already filed an incident report.

Based on your post, it seems that you are dealing with a CNA who (a) has personal issues going on and/or (b) has an inferiority complex.

Tread lightly from here on out.

To the OP, I would advice against this bolded part right here. You acknowledge now that blocking her in was not ok, neither was the statement of "You are not leaving this room until we discuss this" I have been blocked in by an employee before in a hostile situation TWICE. Everyone has already expressed why and it appears you now see how inappropriate that was. Because of that, absolutely you still apologize. You did it, you know it's wrong, so you own it. Apologies shouldn't be about ulterior motives so if complaint is already filed you wouldn't apologize. I do agree with maybe doing it with a mediator present.

I am a very head on person, I don't complain to management first step. I prefer to handle my issues with the person first. However, I have to do it when I have time to regroup because I am very sharp with my tongue and I can in the head of the moment without raising my voice, without cursing, without showing any aggression, have a person walking away completely irate and looking insane, while I look cool calm and collective. Or have them having a mental breakdown in a corner.

I realize this about myself and it's something I always try to work on. So I have to process things and when I feel ready then I can squash things. Jen was in an acute aggravated state and clearly not in a position where she felt she was ready.

I think having your manager bring you both end and starting with something like "First I want to apologize for blocking the door, I can now see how that might have came across, I truly wanted us to squash things right away and after reflecting on it, I can see how I handled this poorly and for that I am sorry."

You would be surprised how far that can go.

As far as the rest, I have read the replies and your replies. Honestly, I get you were in the middle of stuff and I get how busy things can be. I have grown accustomed to working with a lot of completely useless CNA's. That's why the good ones I have I cherish. So I am used to just doing everything myself. Meds are important yes, it was a med pass. I personally would have just told the family, I can wrap this real quick; I am in the middle of giving some meds so I can do this and then come back and check on your more when I finish. It wouldn't have taken just a few minutes.

Jens reaction was pretty dramatic. But I don't have her side of the story and you asked for opinions on yours, so I will leave it at that.

Kudos to you for coming here which can get pretty brutal at times, to seek opinions and to self reflect.

[Kooky Korky, BSN, RN]

As I said in previous comments, I was in the middle of something I deemed took priority over an IV wrapping. I even explained to the family and they were fine with it. It was only Jen who had a problem with it.

I agree with you on the hashing things out mid shift part. Big mistake on my part. At the time, I felt it was my attempt to make things right before our tension leaked and impaired our quality of work.

She most likely did feel disrespected. Making her feel like a servant was not my intention. Still, I don't think it justifies her yelling at and insulting me. I asked her to do something that falls within her scope of practice. She just didn't like that I delayed it until after she came back from lunch.

And trust me, on our unit, both RNs' and CNAs' lunches are interrupted quite frequently. It just seems like the CNAs are more resolute in making sure they get their whole 30 minutes plus their two 15 minute breaks when compared to the RNs. But that's an entirely different topic.

She IS a servant. We are all servants. We get paid to serve. And we have ranks. And you outrank her. She needs to learn to respect your rank and know her own rank.

That will never happen, not in today's setting. Nursing should be more like the military. Orders should be given, orders should be obeyed, there should be disciplinary action for disobedience and disrespect.

I think you were perfectly to expect to do work that you could have done but chose to delegate because you were doing meds, which only you could do.

That said - you still must swallow the proper amount of doo doo if you want to be able to survive there.

Best wishes.