Accusation Against Male Nurse (Me)

[Lapzs]

So here's the story. I am a male RN. Recently, I had a conflict while at work with a female CNA. For the sake of anonymity and simplicity, I will call her Jen. A relative of a patient of ours asked for his IV to be wrapped so that they can give him a shower (bless this family for being so involved in his care). I went off to find Jen in the break room and asked her if she was on break or on lunch. She said she was on lunch, so I replied "Ok it can wait then." I explained to the family that I couldn't wrap the IV at this particular time due to my having medications to pass to my other patients, but that Jen could do it when she came back from lunch. I even held the meds that I had in my hand up in the air for them to see. The family understood and said they can wait. I go off to pass my meds.

After I finished my last or second-to-last med pass, I was walking down the hall towards the nurses' station when I hear Jen's voice, screaming "Lapzs! Why didn't you wrap the IV?! The family's so pissed! God! You're so unprofessional!" I stood there dumbfounded. The only words I could get out were "I had meds to give." Before I could explain any more, she scoughed, turned around, and made way for the supply room. I called out her name, but she ignored me and went inside. I followed her in, and on my way I noticed a patient's family member looking stunned (possible witnessed what she was yelling about). The following conversation ensues (as I recall to the best of my memory):

Me: Jen. We need to talk.

Jen: God Lapzs! You could have wrapped the IV!

Me: First of all, if you have a problem with me, you take me somewhere private and talk. You don't yell at me in the hallway like that.

Jen: I wasn't yelling!

Me: Fine. But I told you. I had meds to pass.

Jen: That doesn't matter. You could have wrapped it before! God you are just so lazy!

She tries to walk around me to leave, but I stand in front of her to prevent her from doing so.

Jen: Don't you EVER do that to me!!!

Me: Fine. But we need to talk. We can't let this issue get out of this room. I already talked to the family. They were ok with it. Plus those meds were important.

Jen: You still could have wrapped it before.

Me: Do you want to pass my meds for me then? That is my job. That was my priority. If I could have wrapped it, I would have. And I already talked to them. This is your job. You're the CNA...

Jen: I'm NOT just a CNA! I'm more than that!

Me: Fine. So like I said, I had meds to give.

Jen: No! You could have wrapped it!

The back-and-forth goes on for a little while like that until she walks around me again and leaves. After that, the only time we talked again during the rest of the shift was when I asked her if she took a patient's blood pressure (she didn't document it) and she asked me about a patient's diet. I even talked to the patient's family afterwards and asked if there was a problem. They insisted there wasn't and asked me why I thought there was. I mentioned that I know Jen came to them a little while ago, and they said "Oh yeah she seemed pretty pissed."

We both talked to our charge RN individually. The next day (Jen wasn't working but I was), the same charge RN tells me that I need to apologize to Jen or do whatever I can to mend things because Jen told our director about this event and that she was going to file an incident report because she felt her safety was at risk. Charge RN tells me that our director told her to tell me to file a MIDAS (our internal reporting service) so that I can defend myself. Charge RN says that she already vouched for me. I filled out my MIDAS report at the end of my shift.

That's that. I am a 24 year old male RN and Jen is a 40-something year old CNA. I have been an RN on our med-surg/telemetry unit for two years. For pretty much all of that time, I was the only male worker, RN or CNA, on the floor on day shift. Jen and I have known each other that entire time. We were good friends and even took pictures together at work. Also, I'm confident most of my other female coworkers would vouch for me as well.

What do you all think? Was I in the wrong here? Was she in the wrong? Is my career and license in jeopardy? I know we both could have definitely handled things better, but I felt that her non-stop yelling, insulting, and unwillingness to slow down and listen and talk prevented us from squashing this issue.

[Here.I.Stand, BSN, RN]

an IV can be wrapped in what, 20 seconds. I would have just wrapped it, or at least come back right after administering the meds you had in hand. You spent MUCH more time on seeking Jen out--and your little exchange--than wrapping it.

And the preventing her from leaving the supply room?? Yeah, not acceptable. You owe her an apology, and be thankful she's not the vindictive type!

[blondy2061h, MSN, RN]

I'm a woman who is nearly 6 feet tall and heavyset. When I'm heated I need to watch my posture and proximity to people to not appear physically threatening.

[Sour Lemon]

I agree that you were wrong to block her in. I disagree that you were wrong to ask the family to wait for the patient's IV to be wrapped.

I grow tired of the argument that "it only takes a few minutes". The problem is that all the "few minute" tasks we're asked to do pile up and collectively take MUCH longer than those few minutes. The nurses who can't prioritize and delegate because they're too nice are the ones who leave late on a daily basis.

Why did you have no idea if the CNA was on break or lunch? That's something that probably should have been communicated to you. I let the CNAs assigned to my patients know when I'll be unavailable and who they should report to, instead. It might also have been a good idea for someone to have been assigned to cover the breaking CNA.

And as for looking for the CNA, there are some CNAs that make it a point to stay hidden. You won't receive any assistance for some nursing assistants if you don't look for them. Some will stay in the break room all night watching movies on their iPhones if they know all they have to do is stay out of your sight to avoid working.

[Avid reader]

Grow a set! You're the RN! You are not there to make friends or be friendly. By being professional both clinically and in conduct, you will automatically garner respect which will make your job easier. You should have immediately written her up for the volume and derilection of duty. Pull your bloody finger out and realize it's a workplace that insists on professionalism at all times. When you next inform someone to perform a task, make sure it's performed but make absolutely bloody sure that the professionalism you expect from others also emanates from your own performances.

[greenerpastures]

I'm going to go out on a limb here. I don't see anything wrong with your actions. Yes, you may have blocked a door, which may have been intimidating, but I wasn't there, so I don't know how Jen felt about it. I don't know your size or hers, the body language, or the size of the room, however, she should have voiced her need to exit as well if she felt trapped by you; as a woman, she should have made it loud and clear that you needed to move if she was that scared. However, I didn't see anything that she stated you needed to move out of her way. She told you not to do it again, however, she didn't ask you to move out of her way or notify you in any way that she thought you were "impeding her egress." If I had a coworker yelling down the hallway to me and being completely unprofessional, I'd try to address the situation and calm them down before they left the room too.

Notes for the future:

1. Don't ever try to talk to Jen again about her behaviors/problems without someone else present, either on your phone, or in person. Don't close the door. Try not to be alone with her. If she's yelling and screaming down the hall like that, find the charge nurse immediately, again - either by phone or in person - let them deal with her.

2. Personally, I wouldn't apologize. However, if you are going to do so, don't apologize to her without someone else, like a manager or charge, present to witness the interaction. Be very careful with your words.

3. Watch your back - sounds like Jen has an axe to grind with you.

4. A management review of delegation needs to be completed with the CNAs/RNs/LPNs so everyone is on the same page. The best way I've heard it said is "I delegate things to you that we are both capable of doing. However, I can't delegate things to you that only I'm capable of doing. So if I ask you to do something, it's most likely because I have to do something that only I CAN DO. Just like you, I am only one person, I can't be two places at once. If I ask you to do something and you can't, just tell me you can't do it right now; Give me an approximate time/sequencing you'll get to it so I can decide if I need to rearrange the things only I can do to accommodate the request."

[OrganizedChaos, LVN]

an IV can be wrapped in what, 20 seconds. I would have just wrapped it, or at least come back right after administering the meds you had in hand. You spent MUCH more time on seeking Jen out--and your little exchange--than wrapping it.

And the preventing her from leaving the supply room?? Yeah, not acceptable. You owe her an apology, and be thankful she's not the vindictive type!

Exactly! I just don't understand why the OP spent so much time & energy hunting down the tech when all he had to do was wrap the IV site & go on with his med pass. I understand he currently had meds in his possession but he could've either locked them up or given them to the patient & then gone back to the patient that needed the IV site to be covered.

Not all techs are helpful & there are some hospitals that don't even employ techs. If it were me & the tech wasn't readily available, I would've just gone in & covered the IV site. It sure would've taken less time & energy than hunting down the tech & getting into this hot mess.

[DTWriter]

To the OP, I would advice against this bolded part right here. You acknowledge now that blocking her in was not ok, neither was the statement of "You are not leaving this room until we discuss this" I have been blocked in by an employee before in a hostile situation TWICE. Everyone has already expressed why and it appears you now see how inappropriate that was. Because of that, absolutely you still apologize. You did it, you know it's wrong, so you own it. Apologies shouldn't be about ulterior motives so if complaint is already filed you wouldn't apologize. I do agree with maybe doing it with a mediator present.

Technically, all apologies come with an ulterior motive; even making peace, or "feeling good inside" can be considered an ulterior motive.

Once a colleague files a incident report, that colleague is pretty much saying, "I am going to mess with your livelihood. Mmm hmm." What is the point of apologizing to someone who pretty much declared that he/she is after your job? Would you not want to minimize your interaction with said colleague and avoid further accusations? For instance - While the OP tries to apologizes, his colleague might go a power trip, instigate another scene, and then file another incident report.

To clarify: I would not bother apologizing after the incident report has been filed because it would be giving fodder to the complainant (in this case, the CNA). I do not know about you but I would not want to give someone more ammo against me. If, and only if, upper management pressures the OP to apologize in person, even after an incident report has been filed, then the OP should, and definitely with a mediator.

[OrganizedChaos, LVN]

I agree that you were wrong to block her in. I disagree that you were wrong to ask the family to wait for the patient's IV to be wrapped.

I grow tired of the argument that "it only takes a few minutes". The problem is that all the "few minute" tasks we're asked to do pile up and collectively take MUCH longer than those few minutes. The nurses who can't prioritize and delegate because they're too nice are the ones who leave late on a daily basis.

Why did you have no idea if the CNA was on break or lunch? That's something that probably should have been communicated to you. I let the CNAs assigned to my patients know when I'll be unavailable and who they should report to, instead. It might also have been a good idea for someone to have been assigned to cover the breaking CNA.

And as for looking for the CNA, there are some CNAs that make it a point to stay hidden. You won't receive any assistance for some nursing assistants if you don't look for them. Some will stay in the break room all night watching movies on their iPhones if they know all they have to do is stay out of your sight to avoid working.

I disagree with the statement I bolded. I think the reason so many people are saying the OP should've just covered the IV site is because he was already there & instead of making the family wait & hunt down the tech who was on her lunch break, he could've just wrapped it & it would've been over with.

We all know family members/patients may say one thing when they really feel differently. They *said* they were fine with waiting but we all know that if they were kept waiting too long they would run to a charge nurse or nurse manager in a heartbeat. So why couldn't the OP who was literally standing outside of the patient's door who needed his IV to be wrapped just do it himself instead of hunting down the tech & creating all of this drama? I see zero reasons why the OP couldn't do it himself.

[GermanCookie, ADN, BSN, RN, EMT-P]

To clarify: I would not bother apologizing after the incident report has been filed because it would be giving fodder to the complainant (in this case, the CNA). I do not know about you but I would not want to give someone more ammo against me.

This was my thought process as well...

[Sour Lemon]

I disagree with the statement I bolded. I think the reason so many people are saying the OP should've just covered the IV site is because he was already there & instead of making the family wait & hunt down the tech who was on her lunch break, he could've just wrapped it & it would've been over with.

We all know family members/patients may say one thing when they really feel differently. They *said* they were fine with waiting but we all know that if they were kept waiting too long they would run to a charge nurse or nurse manager in a heartbeat. So why couldn't the OP who was literally standing outside of the patient's door who needed his IV to be wrapped just do it himself instead of hunting down the tech & creating all of this drama? I see zero reasons why the OP couldn't do it himself.

You are not allowed to disagree with my disagreement. I don't care if the family was pretending to be fine. Unless they want to spend the $$$ for a personal 1:1 nurse, they're going to have to wait occasionally.

[JBudd, MSN]

People are making too much of "why didn't you just do it". The OP said he his hands were full of meds, he needed to call RT, etc. Sticking your head into a break room and asking when a CNA would be available (remember he said it was nearby, he didn't have to chase down anyone) is brief. Wrapping an IV meant putting down what he was doing (can't leave meds out), gathering the supplies and coming back, delaying a respiratory treatment, etc.

No, you don't block someone, already acknowledged as wrong. The CNA was totally inappropriate from this description (one side of the story), but I've run into that attitude before. If you make asking you to do something such an ordeal, people will begin to avoid asking you.

[OrganizedChaos, LVN]

You are not allowed to disagree with my disagreement. I don't care if the family was pretending to be fine. Unless they want to spend the $$$ for a personal 1:1 nurse, they're going to have to wait occasionally.

LOL! í ½í¸‚ That's true, they will have to wait. But was it really worth it for him to go through all of what he went through when he was right by the patient's door & all he had to do was wrap the IV? I bet he took longer looking for the tech than it would've taken to cover the IV.

Was it worth it & was it necessary?