Full Practice Authority of Nursing

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Do you think that doctorates in nursing (DNP, PhD) help contribute to full practice authority for the profession? I think that as more nurses obtain their terminal degree, this furthers the profession and helps expand scope of practice. 

What are your thoughts?

Specializes in Family Nursing & Psychiatry.
12 minutes ago, PMFB-RN said:

I think your embarrassment is well founded. 

    However that is a totally different topic. The DNP programs don't add a single clinical hour or practice related class.

     The NP and CRNA DNP program I'm familiar with simply added 9 months of DNP classes on the to front of their program,  then out the students through the exact same preperation as when it was an MSN program.

Do you have a masters degree or a doctorate degree? It’s quite hard to speak about post-baccalaureate degrees when you don’t have one. For those of us who have completed at least an MSN, we have a good understanding how they try to compact NP education and training in the 2 year curriculum. For many of us who actually completed this, some would argue that the training is close to doctoral level compared to other health disciplines. APRN education is called “advance practice” for obvious reasons and should be reflected with the profession’s terminal degree. 

It’s not degree inflation, it’s the reflection of the education and training advance practice nurses earn and deserve.

 

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
18 minutes ago, matthewandrew said:

Do you have a masters degree or a doctorate degree? It’s quite hard to speak about post-baccalaureate degrees when you don’t have one. For those of us who have completed at least an MSN, we have a good understanding how they try to compact NP education and training in the 2 year curriculum. For many of us who actually completed this, some would argue that the training is close to doctoral level compared to other health disciplines. APRN education is called “advance practice” for obvious reasons and should be reflected with the profession’s terminal degree. 

It’s not degree inflation, it’s the reflection of the education and training advance practice nurses earn and deserve.

 

I don't have a graduate degree. I'm in a masters program at a state university right now and will graduate in May.

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Specializes in Family Nursing & Psychiatry.
1 hour ago, PMFB-RN said:

I don't have a graduate degree. I'm in a masters program at a state university right now and will graduate in May.

Good luck on your studies! I actually graduate in May as well for PMHNP certificate. 

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Specializes in Community health.
7 hours ago, PMFB-RN said:

I think your embarrassment is well founded. 

    However that is a totally different topic. The DNP programs don't add a single clinical hour or practice related class.

     The NP and CRNA DNP program I'm familiar with simply added 9 months of DNP classes on the to front of their program,  then out the students through the exact same preperation as when it was an MSN program.

I think you’re mostly right. At my university, there ARE some extra clinical hours for the DNP students, but it isn’t a whole lot more. 

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Specializes in oncology.
23 hours ago, CommunityRNBSN said:

here ARE some extra clinical hours for the DNP students, but it isn’t a whole lot more.

The DNP no where equates with the rigor of a PhD. The "capstone" projects I have learned of were not even an MSN level. Yeh, it is a 'clinical degree' but I don't even know anyone who did something in the actual clinical practice setting for the 'capstone". They had a clinical subject. 

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On 11/4/2021 at 7:09 AM, CommunityRNBSN said:

I’m not trying to start up the same old debate again. But. I am currently enrolled in a well-regarded local brick-and-mortar MSN program to become an NP. It is one of the best programs available in my area. But I, and the other students, have real concerns about the level of preparation that we are getting. It’s pretty half-assed in the classroom. And for clinicals, students can arrange them ourselves or elect to have help from the university. You can imagine the total lack of standardization there. If you arrange it yourself, the only interaction the Univ really has with the process, other than approving the site, is keeping track of your hours. The students themselves are absolutely top-notch, experienced nurses, but our level of preparation is just so so far off from what an MD receives, I’m embarrassed. I DO think that a well-prepared NP is worth their weight in gold, and I’ve been treated by many NPs in the past, so I trust them. But I think that the profession needs to get its act together if it really wants NPs to continue expanding their scope. (For the record, I do live in a state where they can practice independently!  Only after a few years of working under an MD, thankfully.)

Edited to add: I don’t want us to be “just like MDs” btw. The strength of nursing is that it is NURSING, so a different approach to education is a good thing. But the clinical preparation for practice needs to be more rigorous than it is. 

Just imagine for 1 second how prepare University of Phenix grads NP will be. Why are we doing that to ourselves?

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Specializes in Occupational Health.
On 10/26/2021 at 1:25 AM, matthewandrew said:

If you don’t think doctorates are too costly, what do you think will help nurses get full practice authority?

Legislation

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Specializes in CTICU.
On 10/25/2021 at 11:20 PM, matthewandrew said:

Do you think that doctorates in nursing (DNP, PhD) help contribute to full practice authority for the profession? I think that as more nurses obtain their terminal degree, this furthers the profession and helps expand scope of practice. 

What are your thoughts?

I think you sound very naive and defensive. It's quite ironic that you are advocating for further education in the form of doctoral degrees "advancing the profession", but can give no evidence for such opinion. The whole point of doctoral study is to be able to make and support a hypothesis... with evidence.

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Specializes in Nephrology, Cardiology, ER, ICU.

Nope, DNP is fluff and PhD is for teaching. 

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Specializes in oncology.
49 minutes ago, traumaRUs said:

Nope, DNP is fluff and PhD is for teaching. 

I attended a final project review for a DNP candidate who mailed surveys out, collated responses (with extremely poor response rates)  and thought she as a DNP candidate contributed to the  essential body of nursing, when in reality all she did contribute was to the profits of the USPS service. Frankly, she was extremely difficult to work with (a know it all attitude) and I was so glad she left our college for the 'more prestigious pastures of a local university' where she 'retired' after a couple of years.... may be in her 50s

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Specializes in Nephrology, Cardiology, ER, ICU.

Teaching anything is something you have to be passionate about. While colleges demand at least a graduate degree usually, if you don't have a passion to teach, it doesn't matter what degrees you hold. 

I was in a DNP program but my goal was increased clinical knowledge so eventually I dropped out because I came to realize that my additional clinical knowledge was better learned via experience. I don't have a passion for teaching so I knew teaching was not for me

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