Fired for False Workplace Violence Accusation - Feeling Humiliated and Shamed

[Kooky Korky, BSN, RN]

On 10/31/2019 at 1:01 PM, mariahlily said:

This answer was a joke, right?

”Think about your role in this conflict”? When she was falsely accused and wrongfully terminated.

You think she had no role in it?

She touched the guy, she reported him. She trusted the other tech enough to talk to her about the matter. All not good.

[TitaniumPlates]

Good God am I sorry that this happened to you.

A couple of things come to mind. First, unfortunately, it is a "he said, she said" sort of situation. You were alone with this person. No one can corroborate your story, or the techs' story. It's much like charting---if it wasn't documented, it never happened.

Second, I am not sure about the context. The reason I am bringing this up is that you don't mention if there is a clique that this person is a part of (which matters), if you are the "newbie" and no one has had the chance to know and therefore trust you (which matters)---and not to say that either of these things makes the situation right. It's simply human nature--and in nursing---the high school of highschoolers---this is common behavior. Cliques and backstabbing and gossip and nastiness. The crab bucket---remember? You might have been making it to the top of that crab bucket---and someone or someoneS are trying to drag you back down to the bottom of the bucket.

True story.

I started at a place that was very small. <60 beds inpatient. The unit was small--12 people. All worked together forever, with the exception of 2 of them. I mean---20+ years together.

I came in with 20 years of huge teaching hospital experience, ICU and ER and lived all over the country as a traveler---have two advanced degrees in two different healthcare specialties. I had zero intention or plan to do anything other than to do my job and go home.

But the reaction to me was, to say the very least---violent. Emails pounded out to the director of the facility, slandering me and calling into question my credentials and licensure, fabricating "admissions" by me to them (as if I would ever do this to even someone I knew intimately) that I wasn't qualified to do my job.

When this didn't work to make me quit--I was involved in a procedure with a patient and a 32 year veteran of the unit. Everybody's pal. A really good guy. Nice as could be. Looked like the Miner from "Toy Story", even spoke like him.

I drew up a drug for the procedure and asked for an identifying sticker (my other places of employment had them as a rule)--and I was told "we don't use those". I guess I came across all "teaching hospital snooty" or something (basic safety measure, isn't it?)---because it just irked this guy.

He was my "superior" and he suddenly told me to "go to lunch". I don't like handing off medications to anyone---ever---but I had torn a piece of silk tape and written the drug name, dosage, time and my initials and placed it on the syringe. I handed it to him, looked him dead in the eye and told him..."This is X drug. This is the dosage. This is for when you need to administer the drug to the patient." He said "Trust me. Don't worry. Go to lunch."

I did. 30 minutes later---I returned to the unit where a physician approached me and asked me if I had drawn up X medication for the procedure. I stated that I had.

At which point the other nurse leaned over and looked him in the eye "knowingly" and said, "But I injected it." I was told that whatever it was in the syringe did not have the expected effect---and that other medications had to be emergently administered.

Was I sure that I had drawn up the right thing? Did I "inadvertently" draw up saline? Are you sure you drew up X medication?

All eyes were on me. I could see the smirk on this guy's face as I sat there---he expected me to melt into a puddle on the floor.

I didn't. I stated that not only was there no other drug, including saline in the entire room when I drew up the proper drug, but that I had stuck the bottle in my pocket (as I always did when I would use it for Lot and Exp date while charting later).

I pulled the bottle from my pocket and showed it to the physician.

He literally turned around and walked away. The nurse turned away and no words were spoken for the remainder of the shift between us.

I did, however---write a medication error report in the self reporting system---and named the nurse of 32 years. I followed that up quietly with an email to the Director of Nursing and Risk Management.

Because---even if this nurse had injected saline--- at best, he still injected something that was never ordered into this patient. At worst? He injected something that nobody knows what it was.

All to get me into trouble.

This person you had the unfortunate experience to engage with---is a psychopath. And these types of people are very, very good at manipulating and grooming the people around them. If you cannot or will not be a party to it---they destroy you.

I was in the path of this "nurse" who had felt (as I later found out after an investigation was launched at my insistence) that I was a "spy for administration" and a threat to his job with my advanced degrees.

He couldn't believe I kept hammering at the issue---wanting to find out the truth. Many who were in his "group"---begged me to "let it go". The physician actually amended his report to suggest that "perhaps X drug was actually given" (after he had dictated that it had not) upon "further review of the case". This physician actually walked into the nurses' station smugly boasting that he had "found a way to make that case go away" but that they had to find out "who told".

Honey---the world is full of these types of people. I don't minimize your pain---it's very real and you won't ever forget it. You will have trouble trusting anyone because of it.

But you can turn this to your advantage. You can now spot these types of people---and you can defend yourself against them. You will learn to control yourself at all times---whether you "trust" someone, or not. You keep your own counsel--and you act the professional at all times.

Work is not a place for you or anyone else to bring in their emotional baggage. These people exist and they thrive on targeting someone in their weakest moments.

My situation panned out for the best....at least...for me. The patient still was injected with something that no one, to this day, knows what it was---because "nurse" denies that he switched syringes or drew up something else or just never injected the drug. If he would---he'd lose his license and maybe be up on charges of assault.

These people exist. They are nurses. And doctors. And technicians. And housekeepers. And police officers. It's a good lesson for everyone here to learn well. Go to work and do your job. Keep your personal crap out of the workplace. You're not there to make besties. You're there to do a job.

If my situation had gone the way yours has---I would do exactly what you're being advised to do---keep your description of the experience to "not a good fit"---find a few good friends who will be your references---and move on from this place.

Suing the employer isn't a great choice. Just my opinion. There is absolutely no proof that you didn't assault this person. None. It doesn't matter in the eyes of the law that you say you didn't do it. You were alone with this jerk and nobody saw the incident.

My best advice is to move forward---and from this day on---if your neck hairs raise when someone is around you---start documenting every hinkey thing that happens with them. If there is something substantial---you write a complaint to Risk Management or whomever. Whether it is acted upon---doesn't matter---what matters is the paper trail that you create, showing that you have had your misgivings about said person.

I hate it that this happened, and that people like this guy exist. Best of luck to you.

[TitaniumPlates]

P.S. Just as a warning for you. Domestic Violence or Workplace Violence is one of those things that can get your license pulled permanently.

This jerk would have to go and file charges against you in court--similar to a domestic violence charge---and then you go defend yourself. It's a very high burden of proof for an accuser to prove this. Extremely high bar. There has to be such irrefutable evidence---that it's actually unbearable to watch a battered victim who kept DV a secret---try to get protection from an abuser.

However. You admitted to touching this person to "redirect" them--and you also were angry when you related the incident to another person.

It's unfortunate, but in this day and age of PC and litigiousness---"perception" is all that matters. If the person you touched perceived your hand as a threat---that is all that matters in the eyes of the law.

It's much like "Castle Doctrine". If I perceive that you, as my houseguest, are a threat---I can kill you and most likely get away with it.

It's not right or fair. It just is the law. I can imagine this guy's lawyer saying that you had so many other avenues to pursue other than to lay hands on this person---that you didn't choose to do so. You didn't have this person's permission to touch him.

It's a brutal accusation and it's just shite that your employer let you go---but you need to protect yourself now. You need to know whether or not your employer is going to report you to the BON for workplace violence---a.k.a. assault.

You may also want to visit an attorney that has experience in dealing with the BON.

This can get ugly if this person decides that getting you fired isn't enough. The employer may want to avoid all legal entanglements---but this technician---you just don't know.

PROTECT YOURSELF.

[JKL33]

3 hours ago, Kooky Korky said:

She was trying to return to the OR. He was blocking her egress.

I can read just fine, thank you. Sorry if I offended, I thought my comment might serve someone in the future. My theory is that there's no way that bozo would have stood there for one second if someone was making a call to report his behavior. He would have bolted.

One thing is for sure, if you put your hands on someone, you're done.

[Johnnyb2000]

Once management thinks they made the right decision, they not only stand behind it but defend it with a vengeance even if they are wrong.

When my employer finally crossed the line with mandatory overtime and improper staffing, violating state health regulations, I finally said something to my manager. I was written up in retaliation by my manager and her manager. HR stood by the managers decision even though I showed the law on paper and demonstrated how my excellent performance was tarnished in retaliation.

The point is, I prepared for this in advance. I lined up another position prior to resigning that position. I turned my findings over to the state inspector who agreed with all my findings, including retaliation. I could have a case if I wanted, but it isn't worth the headache. Thay company can battle out their violations with the state. I want no part of it.

[Walti, LPN, LVN, RN, EMT-I]

Sometimes you eat the bear and sometimes the bear eats you. I have had the misfortune over the years to encounter GOG networks, Same as the Good Ole Boy networks that some areas of the country were (are) famous for. Working as registry and the employer told not told send me again while 3 of the other hospitals I was doing shifts at were trying to hire me to full time status. Usual complaint abut hospitals not wanting me back was I was too slow sending patients to the floor from the ER. If they were in pain I wanted to treat it because I knew if they hit the floor in pain it was not going to be quickly treated due to intake assessment, pharmacy stocking meds for pt, etc.

One job was clinic work at a detention facility and an inmate dislocated his shoulder. Orders from the director in town were to give Ibuprofen 800mg and transport by facility car to a contracted hospital. This was an hour and half away. The inmate passed 4 ERs to get to contracted facility. I protested the care and was on probation as a new hire. I was taken off of the schedule. I contacted state and I'm not sure of the completed outcome but do know the director was no longer employed there several months later.

[DallasRN]

Nurse Beth, I very much do not like your reply. This situation as told may well have ended the career of this nurse. Certainly she can go with the "not a good fit" thing but as soon as this hospital is called for a reference and it's determined she's not eligible for rehire the game is over. Let's face it...most hiring HR people would be real skeptical of a long-time OR nurse suddenly "not eligible". Beyond that, how horribly demeaning for this nurse.

Personally, I like the recommendation of legal recourse. If nothing else, being contacted by an attorney might wake up this hospital and force their hand in terms of making all parties aware of exactly why this particular decision was reached. Who knows...maybe surgical tech was a relative of someone? Had a relationship with someone? And I can't help but believe an experienced RN has more "value" than a surgical tech. I'm disappointed.

Best of luck in your job search!

[DolceVita, ADN, BSN, RN]

I’m so sorry for what you’re going through. I was accused of bullying a new staff member a year ago when I reviewed her work and gave her feedback. Even though I was training her I was told it was not my job to review her work while training her. It was apparently the manager’s job. Therefore I was a bullying her because I went out of my scope of duties. I’d never heard of training someone and not checking what they were doing. But there it was. No previous complaints. In fact I’d just had my review from my direct supervisor and told that my colleagues said I was “sunny” to work with and helped create a good working atmosphere.

The whole thing made me feel sick and in fear of my job. It turned out the new woman also knew our new manager. I learned later she didn’t like feedback from anyone. She also quit. She’d been a nurse for 6 months before she came to us and then left after 3 months. I felt somewhat vindicated. You can bet I don’t offer to train new people anymore. I never talked to a soul about it. It made me completely paranoid.

[Nunya, BSN]

If someone of the opposite sex deliberately blocks my way out of a confined area (actually, it could be someone of the same sex) this could also be considered sexual harassment imo. Did he block her because he's a jerk or was he going to assault her, who knows? I would advise her to consult a lawyer. This is a good post in that it makes us all think about what we should do if this ever happens to us, I like the idea of pulling out your phone to call for help, either your supervisor or 911. Also taking a picture might be a good idea...

[NurseKM1956]

Wow, this is pretty much what I am going through!! I don't work in the OR. But I have been at this facility for a while. There are a few people that call the shots there, I was written up before because of arguing. And I was found to blame. But they decided to keep me, why? At that point I knew my time was limited. I kept looking. I found something for now while I evaluate my options.

My advice, FWIW is this, are you young just starting out? Walk away, it's tough. If you're older and feel that your options will be limited, talk to a lawyer. Why in all honesty they took this person's side I have no idea. People are irrational and insecure.

Good luck!

[Nurse Beth, MSN]

19 hours ago, DallasRN said:

Nurse Beth, I very much do not like your reply. This situation as told may well have ended the career of this nurse. Certainly she can go with the "not a good fit" thing but as soon as this hospital is called for a reference and it's determined she's not eligible for rehire the game is over. Let's face it...most hiring HR people would be real skeptical of a long-time OR nurse suddenly "not eligible". Beyond that, how horribly demeaning for this nurse.

Personally, I like the recommendation of legal recourse. If nothing else, being contacted by an attorney might wake up this hospital and force their hand in terms of making all parties aware of exactly why this particular decision was reached. Who knows...maybe surgical tech was a relative of someone? Had a relationship with someone? And I can't help but believe an experienced RN has more "value" than a surgical tech. I'm disappointed.

Best of luck in your Job Search!

Thanks for your point of view. While employers have to provide length of employment, rate of pay and title, disclosing re-hire status is not required.

She could go to HR and ask them to change the status, and if that doesn't work, she could contact an attorney.

She can also put "No" when asked if her previous employer can be contacted for a reference.

Litigation has its drawbacks and can backfire. Suing a former employer is a red flag for potential employers. Deciding to sue is a big decision because it's emotionally and financially draining, and holds you back from moving forward.

She would need to be clear on what she hopes to gain, is it worth it, and how much of a chance would she really have in a "he said, she said"?

[Johnnyb2000]

Today, too many employers have too much latitude with how they test their employees. Employers are trusted over employees. Employers need to be in fear of being shutdown for any form of retaliation, but they get away with this behavior all the time. I realize there are different personalities and there is always going to be differences of opinion. But when the team breaks down, the is ineffective communication and people don't want to do extra work, these unfortunate problems arise. Companies prefer harsh decisions instead of fair decisions for fear of appearing weak. We need to prevent companies from treating people unfairly by preventing them from taking sides in a situation like this.