i'm still just in shock. Some had been there for 30 plus years. Everyone was called into HR and told they were no longer needed and would not be working another shift. So much for my educational loan assistance....
So we were good enough to take teams of patients and make half RN pay while doing the work before, but as soon as the hospital had budget issues, we were suddenly not good enough nurses anymore apparently.
Obviously it was impossible to work on hospital layoffs throughout the entire hospital rather than targeting one class. (sarcastic)
This is a perfect example of Nurses not sticking together. If the RNs would help by boycotting when this happens it would show unity instead of proving the problem we have of the RN-LPN complex. If 100 RNs put in a 2 week notice when this happened it would show that the LPNs were appreciated by the people(Real nurses as the hospital would say) they worked with. Societies "fend for yourself" mentality is such a dissapointment. When I started this career I thought that all nurses were a tight-knit group... Guess not?
Specializes in Community Health, Med-Surg, Home Health.
This is a perfect example of Nurses not sticking together. If the RNs would help by boycotting when this happens it would show unity instead of proving the problem we have of the RN-LPN complex. If 100 RNs put in a 2 week notice when this happened it would show that the LPNs were appreciated by the people(Real nurses as the hospital would say) they worked with. Societies "fend for yourself" mentality is such a dissapointment. When I started this career I thought that all nurses were a tight-knit group... Guess not?
I agree with you, totally. What happens is that nursing is too whiney...the "this is the job for the nurse (or RN)" can get you in trouble. I have read scenerios where instead of helping the RNs, now, they take away their supportive staff. They may get better nurse:patient ratios, but they take away the CNAs, LPNs and then, the RN is doing EVERYTHING...bathing, giving meds, doing respiratory care, charting, etc...and still leaving no time for real patient interaction. I always supported the team nursing work ethic, because there IS enough at the table for all to partake, but that is too much, I assume. I am supportive of RNs, because whatever affects them will eventually bleed down to us, but this silly LPN-RN war, it makes it hard and forces nurses to take sides. It is not like allowing the RNs to keep their jobs will make things easier for them...it may get worse in some cases, because they will be the butcher, the baker and the candlestick makers.
Hey, flowerbudd, I noticed you were in Missouri also. I'm located near St. Louis...mind PMing me with who you worked for? I'm trying to keep track of the trends in state so I know what my options will be if anything similar happens to me.
I'm interested in knowing where this is, too, since I'm in MO. I'm so sorry for you and your colleagues. :paw:
My hubby's aunt works for BJC, and she told me yesterday that they shifted all of their LPNs to the extended care facility. I knew that they weren't hiring in the hospitals for LPNs anymore, but I didn't realize that they had reassigned them to just BJEC. She said that some of their LPNs had been there for 20+ years.
I got a PM from someone in the Columbia area that a hospital system down there had also laid off all LPNs.
Hoping that this trend doesn't hit where I'm at, or I'm screwed. Thankfully we've given up on the whole Magnet status thing, so that may help...apparently no one ran the numbers prior to the initial drive for Magnet and didn't realize until after they had sunk a bunch of $$$ into it how many nurses they'd have to get rid of and replace with BSNs. So now we're all being pushed to go back to school, and they are offering BSN bridging on site. If I can just last out for another couple of years....
What I don't understand, is why it is a budgetary issue in the hospitals to have LPN's around? I can do everything an RN can including starting IV's, hanging IV meds, foleys, passing meds...everything except hang blood and do IV pushes. All this for the bargain price of almost half as much pay as the RN I work with does. So, if you can get 2 LPN's for the price of 1 RN, why not utilize LPN's for the majority of work, with RN's in sort of a supervisory role?
Laying off LPN's in a hospital has little to do with budget. That is myth in my estimation. It is the excuse used as some feel we LPN's have no place in a hospital anymore.
Worse still some of the Lpn's who have gone on to become RN's help to perpetuate this myth. I excuse it as most of them have little experience behind before they go on for their RN's so of course they felt not ready to handle a hospital or were convinced they were of little use.
I have seen this happen on and off for years. 30 to be exact.
Specializes in Community Health, Med-Surg, Home Health.
laying off lpn's in a hospital has little to do with budget. that is myth in my estimation. it is the excuse used as some feel we lpn's have no place in a hospital anymore.
worse still some of the lpn's who have gone on to become rn's help to perpetuate this myth. i excuse it as most of them have little experience behind before they go on for their rn's so of course they felt not ready to handle a hospital or were convinced they were of little use.
i have seen this happen on and off for years. 30 to be exact.
i am hearing that more hospitals are being sued due to using techs to do the work of nurses. where this may be a problem is that most hospital administrators seem to not know how to utilize their lpn staff. in addition, the description of the rn is that they are able to make assessments of patients that are unstable and unpredictable outcomes (allegedly). i am in agreement with kimmie; i do believe that lpns can be utilized in hospitals within their scope of practice if the team nursing approach is used. the rn is supposed to be the manager and delegator of patient care and takes the ultimate responsibility of the results of that care. i don't see a problem with rns supervising care and performing the tasks that are not within the scope of practice for lpns. there is enough at the table for all to partake.
not sure what you mean about lpns advancing to rns as perpetuating this myth because of lack of experience, though. what i see is that some of them go on because they feel limited in practice, are threatened in some cases to do so (hence the origin of this thread...not wishing to be laid off), or there are some lpns who forgot where they came from, so to speak by berating lpns that work below them. some of them do it because of peer pressure from rns, and others that seem to want to lord over them that they should have also become registered nurses.
what i find particularly distressing when reading things like this is that it seems that cnas/techs are not as affected by this as lpns are, and we have more training and experience. some rns are greatful to have cnas, but have annoyance when lpns work below them. yes, there are some facilities that are laying off their cnas as well, and forcing the rns to take total responsibility for patient care, but it seems that the role of the lpn in many areas (according to these forums) are severely affected by these changes. it is horrible that people who wish to make an honest living are threatened with their very livelihoods, being reduced to the position and pay as a cna after years of nursing experience. yet, adding more responsibility and accountability to rns is not the answer to me, either, because it doesn't matter, degree and all, they are just as human as we are, and an overwhelmed person is prone to mistakes and ommissions. scarey stuff, no?
Let me see, I as a LPN at my hospital can do everything a RN can except replace an epidural drip and "officially" be a charge nurse. They love me because I only cost them half what a RN does!! No one has ever made me feel that I am "only a LPN" and in fact when I jokingly say it, they always correct me. I am proud to be a LPN, but I am in the process of becoming a RN one because of the money and two because of what a lot of you are stating that options as LPN's are extremely limited.
In the four years I have been working at my job the only two people to get fired for errors were RN's and one had been so for over 20 years. No one is perfect and perhaps it is just the law of averages, only 4 LPN's vs. 20 plus RN's.
When I asked my boss about hiring a LPN friend of mine the boss was all gung-ho until she brought it before the hiring committee and they said (to the effect) that LPN's were too much work for the RN's because the RN's had to go behind and sign all computer documentation of the LPN's, so instead they combined the LPN position and a tech position and hired another RN.
One of the hospitals in our area has gone to RN only and no CNA/tech's. I love our tech's. As it is now I have no time to actually get to know my patients the way I'd like. Most of the time I feel like I run up and down the halls passing meds and charting. If I were bathing and changing linens I guess I would surely have a chance to get to know my patients a whole lot better and really up close!!
May I lighten the mood and bit and present some realitity. LPNs do not make half of an RNs wage. It does get annoying hearing that. Well...maybe I should rephrase this... where I live LPNs do not get half an RNs salary. LPN by me make maybe 5 or 6 less an hour.
That's all I have to say for now. I just don't like hearing it said that way. It upset me like some how it is my fault that I make a little more because of my creditentials and education.
Specializes in Community Health, Med-Surg, Home Health.
May I lighten the mood and bit and present some realitity. LPNs do not make half of an RNs wage. It does get annoying hearing that. Well...maybe I should rephrase this... where I live LPNs do not get half an RNs salary. LPN by me make maybe 5 or 6 less an hour.
That's all I have to say for now. I just don't like hearing it said that way. It upset me like some how it is my fault that I make a little more because of my creditentials and education.
I didn't mean to say anything to offend RNs. I believe that you have earned your prudentials and should be recognized for it. You did take more in depth courses and have more responsibility, hence, deserve the title. I think that what most LPNs are saying is not to discount our talents and contributions to the health care team. Most of us were trained to do a great deal and are limited to do so, many times, not based on the state they reside in, but arbitary policy and procedures of the facilities that employ us, which cause confusion. This happens because when they are short of staff, suddenly, the LPN can do many of these things but, when the tide shifts, the Practical Nurse is pushed back and are told that suddenly they are incompetent.
Most LPNs start out with just wanting to make an honest living, maybe by taking the quicker road to becoming a nurse (maybe due to the stiff competition of RN programs, or a more immediate financial need), but, nonetheless, want to work and care for patients. It is the see-saw situation that is (from what I have heard and witnessed) that frustrates the average LPN. At times, the LPN is subtlely told that they don't count. Many times, job postings are not listed under nursing, but as supportive staff, also, even though we are performing nursing duties, are not counted on the daily supervisor staff roster as nurses...it would be worded as "We have 4 nurses and one LPN", adding more insult to injury.
In addition, policies written regarding what LPNs can and cannot do are asked to be broken when it is convienent, and then told that we are not being team members when we refuse. An example of this is for NY, LPNs cannot perform any skills on central lines, therefore are not even taught how to do it in school. My first day working per diem on a med-surg floor, I discovered that a patient I was assigned to medicate had a central line. The RN told me that "other LPNs do it", therefore, had issues with me refusing. I told her it is not within my scope of practice and if something were to happen, no one would back me up. I didn't back down, but there are many that are intimidated to do what is clearly not within their scope of practice in order to keep the peace and not face the hazing that does, in fact take place. I can go on with additional stories of this, but the point is there are reasons for some of the quandery. I know that most answers the LPN will receive is "Well, just go for your RN". That is not a choice available for everyone; and not a personal choice for me. Or, another observation I noticed is that when a person is an LPN, most comments are not congradulatory, but when a person moves from LPN to RN, then, the comment becomes "NOW, you are a NURSE". What does that say to the person who already valued themselves even before obtaining that title?
I don't place blame on individuals at all. I see RNs and all members of the health care team as just that-a team that should have a common interest. I believe that the plight of the LPN is simply "recognize us...we are nurses as well in our own right". Sorry, I know I went on a soap box...I guess I am trying to explain another side to it and hope that I was at least a bit successful.
Pagandeva2000, I think you did a great job explaining the other side.
OK so maybe I don't make exactly half of what the RN's make. I make $20 (not a bad living, I do appreciate it) in my position and when I get my RN I will be making $36. Not a far cry from half. A lot better than $20, but now I have to pay back all the loans I ran up to get my RN. I have said myself many times that it is only my fault, not going on to get my RN sooner. I realize that RN's are paid for the advanced schooling. Every situation is different, in my case I had a financial need and needed to wait to go on for my RN.
As was stated before teamwork is essential, down to the last person. The environmental service person who comes to empty the trash in the soiled utility room performs a vital job and needs to know they are appreciated as much as the physicians and nurses. There will always be the people who do not understand the concept of teamwork, regardless of the profession.
Divemaster
33 Posts
This is a perfect example of Nurses not sticking together. If the RNs would help by boycotting when this happens it would show unity instead of proving the problem we have of the RN-LPN complex. If 100 RNs put in a 2 week notice when this happened it would show that the LPNs were appreciated by the people(Real nurses as the hospital would say) they worked with. Societies "fend for yourself" mentality is such a dissapointment. When I started this career I thought that all nurses were a tight-knit group... Guess not?