Elizabeth Warren says doctors, nurses don't treat black women same way as other women

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Is it bash medical professions month and I just didn't realize it?

Don't get me wrong I do believe that prejudice exists but according to Ms. Warren, the only concievable reason for the increased materials deaths in African American women is due to doctors and nurses being prejudice. This is absolutely ludicrous.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/politics/elizabeth-warren-doctors-nurses-black-women.amp

Specializes in Pediatrics, Pediatric Float, PICU, NICU.
41 minutes ago, KonichiwaRN said:

My point exactly!

How dare she alleges and claims that we, nurses, have prejudice in our minds when it comes to our patient care?

And people actually defend her. Which astonishes me.

Because “we” do. And when I say we, I mean healthcare as a whole and as a generalization. This isn’t a personal attack on you, so no need to take it like one.

For what it is worth, I am not pro-Elizabeth Warren. But statistics and research have backed up her claims for years, period.

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White, male nurse here...

I hate to echo what has already been said, but there's plenty of data that backs up what Warren says.

There's also plenty of nurses on here who have said they've witnessed this phenomenon first hand. I worked for two years in an ER in the deep south and currently work on an inpatient psychiatric unit, and believe me I've seen in plenty.

So, with that said, why are people still arguing that this doesn't happen...? I'm confused.

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Specializes in OB.
20 minutes ago, rldubz said:

So, with that said, why are people still arguing that this doesn't happen...? I'm confused.

Because people don't want to admit that they could have internal biases. They see research like this and feel accused of being overtly racist, so they deny that the research could possibly be true.

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4 minutes ago, LibraSunCNM said:

Because people don't want to admit that they could have internal biases. They see research like this and feel accused of being overtly racist, so they deny that the research could possibly be true.

Internal biases. Oh yes. The subjective variable that cannot be sensed, seen, or quantified but is claimed by countless of case studies.

Yes. I'm biased against such "studies." ? And I'm a "ethnic minority" living here in this country, as a first generation American.

She crossed the line when labeling professionals as practicing our care with prejudice in our hearts.

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Specializes in OB.
7 minutes ago, KonichiwaRN said:

Internal biases. Oh yes. The subjective variable that cannot be sensed, seen, or quantified but is claimed by countless of case studies.

Yes. I'm biased against such "studies." ? And I'm a "ethnic minority" living here in this country, as a first generation American.

She crossed the line when labeling professionals as practicing our care with prejudice in our hearts.

You clearly have no interest in considering other points of view in this conversation. I'm glad that you are free of all possible internal biases. Good luck!

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Just now, LibraSunCNM said:

You clearly have no interest in considering other points of view in this conversation. I'm glad that you are free of all possible internal biases. Good luck!

How can a ethnic minority, have a internal bias in this nation? You are automatically placing sin on a group of population (nurses and doctors) that we are treating our patients with PREJUDICE.

I don't care who my patients are or what they did..what their language is or the color of their skin are.

They are OUR patients, and I will defend them.

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Specializes in ICU/community health/school nursing.
On 4/28/2019 at 12:30 AM, bug2621 said:

*sigh* Her political motives aside...she has a point. Now to generalize and say that all nurses and doctors treat black women differently, is far reaching but there is implicit bias out there, not only have I seen it, I’ve experienced it.

I worked PRN at a hospital and went in around 2 am with 10/10 colicky abdominal pain and I’d had n/v/d for hours. I went to that ED because it was closest to my house. The nurses were nice enough but didn’t seem to take me too seriously. The MD comes in and does an exam and when I wince as he’s palpating, he actually asked “ are you sure that really hurts” with a very condescending tone. They were treating me like a drug seeker, even after I told them I was a nurse there. They finally ordered a CT and gave me a bag of fluids and protonix, saying it was acute gastritis. The MD even said my CT was negative. The pain went away but returned with a vengeance that afternoon. This time I went to the hospital I worked full time at. One of the residents recognized and pulled my records from the hospital. He told me that everything I was experiencing sounded exactly like gallstones and when he pulled my CT (from the other hospital) it confirmed it. I went to surgery that night because it was so inflamed.

So whether you believe my story story or not, take a moment to do some research on this matter and you’ll see that lots has been done, especially in regards to the AA are treated for pain by providers.

Thank you for sharing your story. I'm sorry it happened this way. I cannot imagine being treated like this but I see it and hear it and have occasionally gone to a hospital to mediate for a friend who has been misdiagnosed/ignored/treated differently because she was a woman of color.

To the other posters - if you don't like Warren, fine. Just don't dump this story because you don't like the messenger.

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Specializes in OB.
Just now, KonichiwaRN said:

How can a ethnic minority, have a internal bias in this nation? You are automatically placing sin on a group of population (nurses and doctors) that we are treating our patients with PREJUDICE.

I don't care who my patients are or what they did..what their language is or the color of their skin are.

They are OUR patients, and I will defend them.

You can't possibly be serious. You're saying that ethnic minorities are all perfect human beings simply by way of being ethnic minorities, and could not possibly harbor any internal biases? Bias is unique to whites?

No one is saying all nurses and doctors are racist. What the studies show is that human beings are flawed, and as such, often harbor internal biases that are a result of our upbringing, level of privilege, and culture.

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Specializes in Pediatrics, Pediatric Float, PICU, NICU.
5 minutes ago, KonichiwaRN said:

How can a ethnic minority, have a internal bias in this nation? You are automatically placing sin on a group of population (nurses and doctors) that we are treating our patients with PREJUDICE.

I don't care who my patients are or what they did..what their language is or the color of their skin are.

They are OUR patients, and I will defend them.

You are completely and absolutely missing the point and the research.

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1 minute ago, LibraSunCNM said:

You can't possibly be serious. You're saying that ethnic minorities are all perfect human beings simply by way of being ethnic minorities, and could not possibly harbor any internal biases? Bias is unique to whites?

No one is saying all nurses and doctors are racist. What the studies show is that human beings are flawed, and as such, often harbor internal biases that are a result of our upbringing, level of privilege, and culture.

So let us say that I will agree with you slightly on this "non quantifiable verifiable" variable of internal prejudice.

How do you solve it? People have it automatically, right? You are placing a dogma that everyone is guilty, because the outcomes (result) for a population is such and such.

Instead of assessing more variables that may be at play.

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Specializes in OB.
1 minute ago, KonichiwaRN said:

So let us say that I will agree with you slightly on this "non quantifiable verifiable" variable of internal prejudice.

How do you solve it? People have it automatically, right? You are placing a dogma that everyone is guilty, because the outcomes (result) for a population is such and such.

Instead of assessing more variables that may be at play.

Thank you for deigning to agree with me "slightly." ?. How to solve it---that's the question, isn't it? If there was an easy, single answer we probably wouldn't be facing the problem, but my personal belief is that the first step is to simply have this conversation. That getting people to stop being defensive and think they're automatically being labeled as KKK members when we're talking about bias is important. That a little self-reflection goes a long way in the journey towards ending the larger, systemic, institutional racism that feeds into health disparities.

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2 minutes ago, LibraSunCNM said:

Thank you for deigning to agree with me "slightly." ?. How to solve it---that's the question, isn't it? If there was an easy, single answer we probably wouldn't be facing the problem, but my personal belief is that the first step is to simply have this conversation. That getting people to stop being defensive and think they're automatically being labeled as KKK members when we're talking about bias is important. That a little self-reflection goes a long way in the journey towards ending the larger, systemic, institutional racism that feeds into health disparities.

I point to the part where I'm saying, let us "assume" that I agree with you.

You can't control bias. There will always be people that decide to be biased, or prejudiced, or racist. It's their choice.

I'd be the first one to cry out foul if I saw a Hospital actually practice, as a whole entity, with prejudice or bias. Trust me on that one.

What we need to do, is not simply point the finger at a supposed "racism" that is happening somewhere but instead go back to the nursing process.

Assess the variables.

Which population was involved? Which doctors and nurses, and which hospitals? Which diagnoses and comorbidities? What was the lifestyle of the patient and what age group? Smokers or nonsmokers? Alcohol users or non users? What was their discharge plans? How were the discharge plans carried out? Where was the followup? etc.

So many variables..and Elizabeth Warren decides to point the finger. Bam! That's it. It's the health care system! The nurses and the doctors! She saw a few case studies so that explains the entire picture.

This is why such news got my blood boiling a little bit. It was really offensive.

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