The way that this Covid vaccine works is quite different from the flu shot. The Covid vax. is not a (dead) bacteria or virus being injected into your body. (With Pfizer & Moderna) RNA (called messenger RNA) that's been coded in a lab goes into your arm. The RNA has instructions, or a code, that gets deposited on the cell. The ribosomes of the cell make a spike protein. It looks similar to the spike protein on the surface of the actual Corona virus. Then your body is supposed to make antibodies (antigens) that goes after the spike protein and neutralize it.
The problem is that this has not been tested in any long-term studies, so, this is more of an experiment. We don't know whether or not the DNA gets permanently changed (possibly bad). We're talking about something that's not supposed to be in your body (made in a lab) that can bind to the surface of your cells and possibly may not be able to be reversed.
Also, since the drug is still being evaluated for long term adverse effects, pregnancy, etc., the FDA would not license the drug, but instead, put out as EUA... Emergency Use Authorization.
Scientific method, observation, hypothesis, experimentation, conclusions, revisions of hypothesis if necessary. I'm just saying that I'm choosing to not be vaccinated because we are in fact in the experimental phase of this. I don't feel comfortable in participating in this stage. I respect those that do have the courage to go out on a limb and try to fix the problem. But I feel that it's not right to try to insult and be right on the fence of calling someone ignorant because of a personal choice they made about their body. Or criticizing them for having their own beliefs of what is true, untrue, biased,unbiased. To say that I'm making this all about me and insinuating that I don't care about my patients or the public is a pretty raunchy gesture. I currently work on a covid unit and I give my sweat, blood, and tears to those patients and that hospital, and I feel really good about that. I truly hope that some people have a better bedside manner than the disrespectful way they carry themselves here.
I am new to this forum and was actually really stoked about signing up here because of how intriguing I found the content to be. But honestly I think it's discouraging to see the condescending behavior that some members have displayed. Discouraging, yet okay. A few bad eggs don't make or break the basket.
Well said! The level of intolerance here to differing points of view is shameful. Anyone who takes caution, and is deciding to wait for safe evidenced based results to be established is mocked as ignorant of Microbiology, a conspiracy theorist, or apathetic to people dying from covid!! It does worry me though, that a lot of our healthcare workers are blindly rushing to inject themselves with experimental technology, despite having no knowledge of it’s potential longterm effects; all on the “hope” that it works. Some even attempt to strengthen their pro-covid vaccine arguments by posting literature straight from the manufacturers, who have a huge financial interest in pushing this vaccine, and who are ultimately shielded from liability from any harm that it causes.
Well said! The level of intolerance here to differing points of view is shameful. Anyone who takes caution, and is deciding to wait for safe evidenced based results to be established is mocked as ignorant of Microbiology, a conspiracy theorist, or apathetic to people dying from covid!! It does worry me though, that a lot of our healthcare workers are blindly rushing to inject themselves with experimental technology, despite having no knowledge of it’s potential longterm effects; all on the “hope” that it works. Some even attempt to strengthen their pro-covid vaccine arguments by posting literature straight from the manufacturers, who have a huge financial interest in pushing this vaccine, and who are ultimately shielded from liability from any harm that it causes.
You’re another relatively new poster and I don’t know if you’re a nurse? Anyway, I’ll think you’ll find that posters very seldom get mocked for simply choosing to not take a vaccine. The reason they get a healthy dose of pushback is that the decision to not vaccinate is often accompanied by misinformation, disinformation and outright lies. It shouldn’t come as a surprise that medical disinformation is met with a certain degree of negativity on a nursing forum.
Speaking for myself, I don’t find differing points of view on the pandemic or vaccines in the least bit intellectually interesting if those points of view aren’t anchored in reality or supported by science.
I respect people’s right to have an opinion, but I don’t have to respect the opinion itself.
Would you get into a taxi if you knew the driver has no insurance? Using basic logic, what does an uninsured taxi driver say about him? Are there any other shortcuts he may have taken?
Comical that you use the analogy of a taxi driver with no insurance. Is this like a vaccine manufacturer who is not liable if their product hurts or kills you? Using your logic about the taxi driver, what does this say about the vaccine maker? Did he take shortcuts in testing? Is his product actually safe? Why has he sought for monetary protection against potential harm? Does he know something we don’t?
But in the case of the taxi driver, I can choose to get out of his cab. But once injected I cannot choose to get the foreign material out of my body.
Comical that you use the analogy of a taxi driver with no insurance. Is this like a vaccine manufacturer who is not liable if their product hurts or kills you? Using your logic about the taxi driver, what does this say about the vaccine maker? Did he take shortcuts in testing? Is his product actually safe? Why has he sought for monetary protection against potential harm? Does he know something we don’t?
But in the case of the taxi driver, I can choose to get out of his cab. But once injected I cannot choose to get the foreign material out of my body.
Well that sorted me out! Who can argue with such a well thought out line of reasoning?
Just wondering if you thought of all the domestic and international regulatory bodies involved in the eventual signing off, or the numerous professionals obeying ethical and moral codes during the research or the amount of provable science that most vaccines are based upon etc?
You’re another relatively new poster and I don’t know if you’re a nurse?
Speaking for myself, I don’t find differing points of view on the pandemic or vaccines in the least bit intellectually interesting if those points of view aren’t anchored in reality or supported by science.
I respect people’s right to have an opinion, but I don’t have to respect the opinion itself.
SMH....Sorry, My apologies. I seemed to have failed to clear my nursing credentials with you before I posted. I guess I am not a real nurse until I do so, let me quickly notify my patients, employer, and BON.
As far as what stimulates you intellectually that is of no concern to me. What concerns me is your mention of science as if it is an unflinching, never changing authority that must never be questioned. However, history has often revealed to us that science is very fluid, always changing, and often wrong in its’ initial assertions. And that is reality, whether you choose to believe it or not. Medicine is no different. Without proper trials, and experiments there is always the potential for harm. Can you provide any known studies....that show this vaccine has been adequately tested and its’ longterm effects are know??
Keep in mind that the same people who are hastily saying today that the vaccine is safe and effective, are the very same people who not that long ago said the “science” showed that Covid was not transmissible between people, and masks and shutdowns weren’t necessary. Color me a skeptic if you wish.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
7 minutes ago, STelevation said:
SMH....Sorry, My apologies. I seemed to have failed to clear my nursing credentials with you before I posted. I guess I am not a real nurse until I do so, let me quickly notify my patients, employer, and BON.
As far as what stimulates you intellectually that is of no concern to me. What concerns me is your mention of science as if it is an unflinching, never changing authority that must never be questioned. However, history has often revealed to us that science is very fluid, always changing, and often wrong in its’ initial assertions. And that is reality, whether you choose to believe it or not. Medicine is no different. Without proper trials, and experiments there is always the potential for harm. Can you provide any known studies....that show this vaccine has been adequately tested and its’ longterm effects are know??
Keep in mind that the same people who are hastily saying today that the vaccine is safe and effective, are the very same people who not that long ago said the “science” showed that Covid was not transmissible between people, and masks and shutdowns weren’t necessary. Color me a skeptic if you wish.
You color yourself by embracing unfounded fears rather than the science. Why haven't you read the citations provided in this thread from credible sources that describe the efficacy and safety of these vaccines?
What are the long term effects of infection with this coronavirus? What are the long term effects of widespread immunization against a deadly contagion? Which pandemic has the human race overcome without vaccines?
Well that sorted me out! Who can argue with such a well thought out line of reasoning?
Just wondering if you thought of all the domestic and international regulatory bodies involved in the eventual signing off, or the numerous professionals obeying ethical and moral codes during the research or the amount of provable science that most vaccines are based upon etc?
Ethics? Really? IDK, seems unethical to sign off on experimental technology that couldn’t pass animal trials, and has no longitudinal studies. Most vaccines have those..just sayin.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
8 minutes ago, STelevation said:
Ethics? Really? IDK, seems unethical to sign off on experimental technology that couldn’t pass animal trials, and has no longitudinal studies. Most vaccines have those..just sayin.
There must be some evidence of those failures that have you avoiding the vaccine, right? It's curious that you feel better qualified to make these assessments than are the scientists charged with that responsibility...but in this era it's not uncommon.
SMH....Sorry, My apologies. I seemed to have failed to clear my nursing credentials with you before I posted. I guess I am not a real nurse until I do so, let me quickly notify my patients, employer, and BON.
You don’t know me so you have no way of knowing this, but I am quite immune to the tone in the above paragraph.
1 hour ago, STelevation said:
Can you provide any known studies....that show this vaccine has been adequately tested and its’ longterm effects are know??
SARS-CoV-2 was first discovered approximately 16 months ago. Asking for longterm studies is ridiculous and you know it.
How many more people do you think we should let die until you think we should start using the vaccines that we have?
1 hour ago, STelevation said:
What concerns me is your mention of science as if it is an unflinching, never changing authority that must never be questioned.
I agree that would have been concerning. If I had said it. IHAVENOT.
Ethics? Really? IDK, seems unethical to sign off on experimental technology that couldn’t pass animal trials, and has no longitudinal studies. Most vaccines have those..just sayin.
Please stop spreading disinformation. I have already posted several links to information on the pretrial studies done on mice and macaques earlier in this thread. I’ll post one more.
STelevation
8 Posts
Well said! The level of intolerance here to differing points of view is shameful. Anyone who takes caution, and is deciding to wait for safe evidenced based results to be established is mocked as ignorant of Microbiology, a conspiracy theorist, or apathetic to people dying from covid!! It does worry me though, that a lot of our healthcare workers are blindly rushing to inject themselves with experimental technology, despite having no knowledge of it’s potential longterm effects; all on the “hope” that it works. Some even attempt to strengthen their pro-covid vaccine arguments by posting literature straight from the manufacturers, who have a huge financial interest in pushing this vaccine, and who are ultimately shielded from liability from any harm that it causes.