Descrimination: A full hot meal or soup and a sandwich

[Truth66]

Just when I thought our management couldn't get any more pathetic. Well, they have pushed the envelope even further.

At the begining of December the dietary manager decided (without notice) that the meal times during the day were going to change. Staff were not going to be served a full hot meal until after 12:30 pm, after the residents have all eaten their lunch. However, there are two categories of workers that usually have their lunch earlier which is 10:45 am and 11:15 am. They are the Practical Nurses and the Care Aides. For these workers they will only be entitled to have hot soup and a sandwich.

Well this didn't sit too well with these workers. So they decided on their own to change their lunch times in order for them to have the same full hot meal options that the rest of the workers were having in the building. Well the Director of Nursing got wind of this and she was not impressed. She ordered the Practical Nurses and the Care Aides to go back to their previous meal times and any change in staff meal times must go through proper channels and put to a vote with the union.

I have since filed a descrimination grievance and nothing will be looked into until after the first week of January. However, with this particular union's lousy track record of not wanting to hold the employer accountable on anything, I'm not holding my breath. So for over a month the Practical Nurses and the Care Aides will be served the equivalant of a soup kitchen at lunch time, even though their shift starts the same time as other departments (including the R.N.'s) in the building and will be treated as second class health care workers. This has created enourmous amounts of unnecesary tenstion through out the building.

[racing-mom4, BSN, RN]

And, don't quit just because of this. Wait until something worth quitting for comes along.

Ya know what--I say just quit. because it sounds like your not happy there and if your not happy then the negative attitude you have taken on is spreading to others---once that happens it is all down hill and your residents will be the one to suffer.

So quit, I know this is more to you than just soup and a sandwich--and I agree we should NOT let mgmt walk all over us. your right. You win. but odds are they are not going to change and this is important to you so leave. Hold your ground tell them if your not going to get a hot lunch with in the next 2 weeks then your out of there and then do it.

Good luck in your job search!!

[Freedom42]

Ya know what--I say just quit. because it sounds like your not happy there and if your not happy then the negative attitude you have taken on is spreading to others---once that happens it is all down hill and your residents will be the one to suffer.

So quit, I know this is more to you than just soup and a sandwich--and I agree we should NOT let mgmt walk all over us. your right. You win. but odds are they are not going to change and this is important to you so leave. Hold your ground tell them if your not going to get a hot lunch with in the next 2 weeks then your out of there and then do it.

Good luck in your job search!!

If the OP quits, she gives management exactly what it wants: It gets to continue violating the contract at the expense of her co-workers.

Besides, she doesn't have to quit. The employer signed a contract that legally binds the company to provide the benefit that was negotiated. The union could grieve, the employer could resume providing the benefit as required, or it could be presented to an independent arbitrator who would likely order the employer to resume.

But it doesn't have to come to that, either. Grievances can be expensive. If it were my union, I'd ask the shop steward to have a friendly chat with management to find out the reasons for the change and to let them know that employees are unhappy. The steward could also remind them that contract changes need to be negotiated. That just might be enough for someone over the DON's head to realize that the company doesn't want to incur a grievance, and they could find a way to restore the benefit.

The point is, both sides can work together to resolve the problem. A grievance can be used as a last resort.

[Susan9608]

Does your contract specifically state that everyone is entitled to buy a full hot meal or just that everyone is entitled to purchase food?

If the wording is more towards the latter, I think you'll probably have a hard time prevailing, no matter how "right" you are, because by providing soup and a sandwich, the facility is still allowing the purchase of food.

[Truth66]

Does your contract specifically state that everyone is entitled to buy a full hot meal or just that everyone is entitled to purchase food?

If the wording is more towards the latter, I think you'll probably have a hard time prevailing, no matter how "right" you are, because by providing soup and a sandwich, the facility is still allowing the purchase of food.

The collective agreement does not specifiy what type of meal that the employees are able to purchase. However, we have the detailed memo from the dietary manager which states what types of meals will only be available for purchase prior to 12:30 pm (soup and sandwich) and the same memo describing which type of meal availalable for purchase after 12:30 pm. We have the memo from the DON ordering the PN's and the Aides to back to their previous meal times of 10:45 and 11:15, denying them the opportunity to purchase the same type of full hot meal as all other departments including the R.N.'s. An important reminder that up untill this memo came out from the Dietary Manager, all staff were equally entitled to purchase the same full hot meal, just at different times.

There is a paper trail of these memo's and it has all been forwarded on to the union officials. The Union officials did contact the DON, but nothing will be ironed out, if at all, until after January 5th, 2009.

Regardless of how this matter gets resolved, if at all, I will post it here, as I'm sure many want to know how this turns out.

Happy New Year to all.

[Susan9608]

I'm curious about this (and it really has nothing to do with the original subject) but how does your facility manage if all the members of a particular profession take their break at the exact same time?

My unit couldn't survive if all of a particular type of personnel went to lunch at the exact same time ... neither could my hospital. So how does that work?

[MAISY, RN-ER, BSN, RN]

Thus why it appears segregated. I am assuming the CNAs and LPNs have specific jobs in the facility that must be completed by a certain time....they take their breaks, then take the residents to lunch. Again, (only assuming) the RNs and whoever else can only take break while the residents are breaking, leaving those that took break earlier on the floor. If I am incorrect I apologize; however there is always another side to the story. I have been wondering if this is it.

As far as lunch, or any meal break enjoy whatever you get, I think perks will become few and far between in the next few years.

[Truth66]

I'm curious about this (and it really has nothing to do with the original subject) but how does your facility manage if all the members of a particular profession take their break at the exact same time?

My unit couldn't survive if all of a particular type of personnel went to lunch at the exact same time ... neither could my hospital. So how does that work?

I think I answered this before, but I'll answer again in more detail.

I'll use my unit as an example. One Practical Nurse and and two Aides would go for first lunch while another Practical Nurse and the Aide who was scheduled for a half shift would stay on the unit. The R.N. would float betwen a couple of units when ever needed. Then when those who were on first break returned, the half shift would be going home and the other Practical Nurse would go for lunch.

When staff attempted to change their breaks, (as a result of the dietary memo) one Practical Nurse and one Aide would go to first lunch and when they returned the other Practical Nurse and Aide would leave for their lunch.

When staff are going for these early lunches at 10:45 & 11:15, it is so that all staff were back on the unit to assist with meal time for the residents such as assisting those residents who needed to be physically fed. When staff attempted the time change of starting their meals at 12:30 instead of 10:45, it was after the residents have already had their lunch.

In case anyone is wondering about the staffing level on this unit, it's 33 Residents on a unit with resident's who have various forms of dementia and there are many who have behavioural and wondering challenges. The unit is also a secured unit, meaning that the residents can't wonder off outside, or else where in the building.

[Magsulfate, BSN, RN]

I wouldn't leave just for this. I think there'd have to be something else driving me to leave besides soup. Maybe it is just because (like other posters said) I am not even getting soup for lunch. Maybe I'll get a graham cracker while I"m running down the hall to see what else I need to be doing.

I have left a hospital for reasons of ill treatment, but not because they FORCED me to eat a soup and sandwich.

To the OP, because it is a question of discrimination, just do a grievance, and let the system do it's job. They will come to an agreement. And, don't quit just because of this. Wait until something worth quitting for comes along.

I don't think you get it- they took away this benefit only to the practical nurses and the aides not the SW, not the RN, not the bookkeeper, not the secretary, and not the doctor.

The PN's and the CNA's obviously want this perk and tried to adjust their schedule to enable the hot lunch. They work the hardest (physically ) and probably make the lowest salaries and deserve the hot lunch as much (or maybe more) than the others.

The message is clear-- we will try to get away with what we can- you won't complain and if you do- until the grievance gets worked out you will accept this.

I'm sorry - if it happened in my facility I would be ashamed and I would complain even though my benefits weren't touched.

Don't go treating my PN's and CNA's like second class citizens.

Yes, I get it.

It has been explained several times in this post, and I still get it.

Grieve it. Let the system work the way it's suppose to. It will be resolved.

There has to be a reason management wants the lpn's and cna's to break BEFORE the residents eat, and not after. I'm not sure what it is, but after the grievance is put into process, they will come up with it I am sure.

As far as someone saying cna's and lpn's work harder than rn's... I just got home from work, and I can guarantee you that I worked just as hard as my cna today, or any lvn on the floor. We are all vital "organs" in the unit. Take away one and it falls apart. If you leave, or quit, they will just fill your position with someone else. If for some reason they go through the grievance process and you all STILL have the problem, and you can't deal with it, then you have the right to leave.

Technically, soup is hot. I don't think I've ever eaten cold soup before.

[Fiona59]

In CANADIAN LTC facilities, the PNs and NAs do the direct patient care. The RN position is a management position, which usually involves very little patient contact (and I've worked in a few LTC's, so I know what I'm talking about). The RN's role is basically liasing between the facility and either/or the families and doctors. They process the orders and contact the physios and other services the residents might require.

In the type of facility the OP has discussed there will be NO iv meds, so the RN is not doing that.

The joke is the PNs here run LTC. It is very common to have one RN float between two or three units.

[achot chavi]

Yes, I get it.

It has been explained several times in this post, and I still get it.

Grieve it. Let the system work the way it's suppose to. It will be resolved.

There has to be a reason management wants the lpn's and cna's to break BEFORE the residents eat, and not after. I'm not sure what it is, but after the grievance is put into process, they will come up with it I am sure.

As far as someone saying cna's and lpn's work harder than rn's... I just got home from work, and I can guarantee you that I worked just as hard as my cna today, or any lvn on the floor. We are all vital "organs" in the unit. Take away one and it falls apart. If you leave, or quit, they will just fill your position with someone else. If for some reason they go through the grievance process and you all STILL have the problem, and you can't deal with it, then you have the right to leave.

Technically, soup is hot. I don't think I've ever eaten cold soup before.

We can agree to disagree- Everyone has a different perspective.

I just feel that it is wrong to take away an important perk like this to some of the staff and make them feel like they deserve less than the "elite" who still can get a full hot meal.

If you don't see the difference between a soup and sandwich and a full hot meal- I can respect that, but I don't think its fair. This is about so much more than a soup and sandwich.

I guess I see this as another example of how some workers this year will get a pen and a nice letter for the holidays and in the same corporation others get fat bonuses,

AS you pointed out everyone is an important part of the machinery that keeps the corporation going.

I also know that that hot meal might be the only one some of those staff members get for the day.

My other problem is that once perks are taken away- they are never given back and one leads to another and one facility sees that another "got away" with it so soon all the facilities will do it. If there is a fiscal crisis- find some other way of solving it.

I hope this works out for them- they work hard and deserve it.

I understand that "grieving it" is one way of handling this, But I know that there are unions and there are unions, I pray for the best.

No matter what it still gives a message that the CNA's and PN's are worth less than the rest.

[achot chavi]

BTW it doesn't matter what is written in the contract - if there has always been a hot meal then that becomes a service that the employer has to provide and if its taken away to part of the staff then a judge might not look kindly to that. I'm sure there are legal terms for this.

[MsTn81]

Wow im not even a nurse yet and i totally understand the point the OP is trying to make. Actually I got it in the very first post. Its not about whether u are able to take your lunch or if the meal is free or not. Its about further dividing the RN's, LPN's,& CNA's. Some of the comments being made are clear examples of why the nursing profession is so stressful. The lack of a support system from fellow nurses. That's jus my few pennies.....