CRNA, Anesthesiologist Relationships

[cristianomiguel]

To any SRNAs and CRNAs,

I am an RN starting CRNA school later this year. Anesthesia intrigues me, and I have highly enjoyed every shadowing experience I've had with CRNAs. I have spent years of my life committed to joining this field. While preparing for school, I've perused the internet regarding the state of the field of anesthesia, and it is worrying. I've seen so much animosity between physicians and nurse anesthetists.

I hate drama. I don't like politics distracting from the quality of patient care. I know people can be entirely different behind the computer screen (e.g. keyboard warriors), but I am still worried. Are these online wars of malicious opinions a true reflection of the field? Is there animosity in the clinical setting? Maybe it is all over-exaggerated, but I've seen so many negative opinions of the field of anesthesia and the direction it's heading from both sides (nurses and physicians). I just don't want to join a field that is in the middle of a huge war.

I respect physicians and the years of their lives they've spent dedicated to the practice of medicine. I equally respect nurses and APRNs who've done the same. Any reflections and experiences would be appreciated.

[No Pain No Gain]

But we are nurses so why say we are something else.
‘what other professions in nursing are APRN...SEEMS like the same thing.
I have a friend who went to AA,school because the city her husband did his surgical residency in only had an AA but not a CRNA program. She worked in icu as a nurse before going to AA school. She says her crna colleagues look down on her. But in my eyes she is equal to a Crna cos she has nursing training. The MDA she works with in a rural hospital has trained her to do regional blocks and she covers for him at nigh placing all the labor epidurals

[DO_question]

I mean AAs were created to address the perceived lack of training for CRNAs of the day. Your friend is equal regardless of her nursing experience.

[wtbcrna, MSN, DNP, CRNA]

11 hours ago, DO_question said:

I mean AAs were created to address the perceived lack of training for CRNAs of the day. Your friend is equal regardless of her nursing experience.

The official reason AAs were invented was to address the supposed lack of anesthesia providers. The real reason AAs are in existence is to maintain anesthesiologists control of the anesthesia market.

12 hours ago, No Pain No Gain said:

But we are nurses so why say we are something else.
‘what other professions in nursing are APRN...SEEMS like the same thing.
I have a friend who went to AA,school because the city her husband did his surgical residency in only had an AA but not a CRNA program. She worked in icu as a nurse before going to AA school. She says her crna colleagues look down on her. But in my eyes she is equal to a Crna cos she has nursing training. The MDA she works with in a rural hospital has trained her to do regional blocks and she covers for him at nigh placing all the labor epidurals

When AAs have and can practice independently while having the same proven outcomes as independent CRNAs or anesthesiologists then we can talk about AAs and CRNAs being equal.

[BigPappaCRNA]

14 hours ago, No Pain No Gain said:

But we are nurses so why say we are something else.
‘what other professions in nursing are APRN...SEEMS like the same thing.
I have a friend who went to AA,school because the city her husband did his surgical residency in only had an AA but not a CRNA program. She worked in icu as a nurse before going to AA school. She says her crna colleagues look down on her. But in my eyes she is equal to a Crna cos she has nursing training. The MDA she works with in a rural hospital has trained her to do regional blocks and she covers for him at nigh placing all the labor epidurals

She is equal in no way, because she is dependent completely on the MDA. She cannot work independently. It is a completely untrue statement to say they are equal.

Additionally, her placing blocks at night by herself is a big no no. She and her MDA are placing the hospital and themselves in a position of tremendous liability.

13 hours ago, DO_question said:

I mean AAs were created to address the perceived lack of training for CRNAs of the day. Your friend is equal regardless of her nursing experience.

Now that, is hilarious.

[No Pain No Gain]

According to her there have been no such lawsuits on record

[guest478081]

Still never seen theee AA people in my neck of the woods. Doesn’t seem to have taken off much

[BigPappaCRNA]

On 11/4/2019 at 1:29 PM, No Pain No Gain said:

According to her there have been no such lawsuits on record

It is not allowed. Period. This is crystal clear, and illustrates just one of the ways that AAs and CRNAs are in no way equal. As much as your friend may like their new found autonomy, being on call at night so the MDA can sleep (classic, textbook MDA behavior), they are not allowed to do so in any of the 17 states that AAs are currently allowed to exist. And again, they are setting up themselves, their lazy MDA, and their facility for tremendous liability, not to mention fraud and CMS issues.

[loveanesthesia]

On 11/3/2019 at 7:03 PM, No Pain No Gain said:

The MDA she works with in a rural hospital has trained her to do regional blocks and she covers for him at nigh placing all the labor epidurals

If he is billing for the epidural, then he is committing fraud.

[subee, MSN, CRNA]

On 11/3/2019 at 8:57 PM, DO_question said:

I mean AAs were created to address the perceived lack of training for CRNAs of the day. Your friend is equal regardless of her nursing experience.

Is this a joke? Nurse anesthetists existed before anesthesiologists. You may have heard of the surgeon George Crile; A nurse anesthetist solely provided anesthesia for him at the turn of the century - in 1900, not it 2000:) That nurse anesthetist opened the first school of anesthesia. So, no, AA's were not created to provide a better provider but a provider that could never be autonomous and would remain under the control of the MDA.

[IndiCRNA]

Never a concern for me. There isn't an MDA practicing within 100 miles of here. All anesthesia in all local hospitals is provided by CRNAs. I'm 1/3 owner of an anesthesia practice group made up of three CRNAs. We provide all the anesthesia, and some critical care medicine & pain management consulting for a 53 bed community hospital and 2 very small rural critical access hospitals.

I have no issues getting along with the physicians we work with. I have, in the past, had to suggest one or two stay in their lane. Those were the exceptions.

[Subee2, BSN, MSN, CRNA]

On 5/15/2019 at 6:03 PM, DO_question said:

To both the above,

Exactly. The term "anesthesiologist," was termed due to the confusion (everyone went by anesthetist prior) and now you can see CRNAs pushing to use Anesthesiologist. I'll take your word on the copy right issue.

Please walk in anywhere and state "I'm an anesthesiologist," and ask the surgeon, tech, other physicians, nurses etc whether they think you're a physician or a nurse...

I don't know any CRNA's who call themselves anesthesiologists....the term is NURSE anesthesiologist. That would be fraudulent. After all, nurses consistently rate as the most honest profession and work to stay in the top if that list.

[DO_question]

Anesthesiology is the study and practice of medicine as it pertains to anesthesia, analgesia, sedation, etc. In order to be any sort of anesthesiologist you'd need a medical degree of some sort, since medicine and nursing are distinct, a nursing degree would not suffice.

It should be fraudulent whether you throw nurse in front of it or not.