It's only fair to point out that Biden is also racist AF. (AF= as ... can't be mentioned on AN, because we're nurses and we don't swear, ever).
The Omicron variant has so far been detected in South Africa, Botswana, Israel, Belgium, Hong Kong, UK, Germany, Italy, and Czechia. But of those countries the US has implemented travel bans on only two of those countries; South Africa and Botswana. In addition to those two, travel bans have been enacted for eSwatini, Lesotho, Malawi, Mozambique, Namibia, and Zimbabwe, even though no cases of Omicron have been detected there.
Youseem to have forgotten that I asked that question in our exchange when I asked you who you trust rather than Fauci...
You seem to have forgotten that you actually asked Tweety, not me, whose advice that Fauci critics were following. I asked my questions to you immediately after.
19 minutes ago, toomuchbaloney said:
Whyshould I indulge questions offered as a cover for sharing your notion that FaucI is a liar and that there is some other expert voice that should be considered which offers pandemic guidance different from Fauci's.
He is a liar. When he told us not to wear masks, he didn't tell us the real reason as to why. He's has told us the NIH didn't fund the Wuhan lab gain of function testing. We now know that was a lie.
24 minutes ago, toomuchbaloney said:
....when I asked you who you trust rather than Fauci...presumably because they gave you different guidance about masks in 2020
Actually, since I'm an educated and experienced nurse, I followed my own different guidance on masks. Knowing that new, unknown virus was going around that was likely spread by droplets or was airborne, I wore a mask anyway. And made sure my parents and others did too.
28 minutes ago, toomuchbaloney said:
Who is it that the public should look to for covid guidance because they offer something different from Fauci?
It's not necessarily that at the present that any advice would be different. It's that to many he's not credible. For reasons I've stated, and also many of his messages have become political. That turns off many, and not just those on the right.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
45 minutes ago, Beerman said:
You seem to have forgotten that you actually asked Tweety, not me, whose advice that Fauci critics were following. I asked my questions to you immediately after.
He is a liar. When he told us not to wear masks, he didn't tell us the real reason as to why. He's has told us the NIH didn't fund the Wuhan lab gain of function testing. We now know that was a lie.
Actually, since I'm an educated and experienced nurse, I followed my own different guidance on masks. Knowing that new, unknown virus was going around that was likely spread by droplets or was airborne, I wore a mask anyway. And made sure my parents and others did too.
It's not necessarily that at the present that any advice would be different. It's that to many he's not credible. For reasons I've stated, and also many of his messages have become political. That turns off many, and not just those on the right.
Let me make certain that I understand the points that you've made. You believe that Fauci is a liar and admits to being a liar about wearing masks. You believe that there are other experts who have more credibility than Fauci but you won't name one that provided substantially different guidance than did Fauci early last year. Fauci didn't lie about that funding, according to an NIH spokesperson. The violation of the agreement, by the company funded by NIH, was unknown to Fauci at the time of his testimony.
Meanwhile, the person actively fomenting noncompliance with masking recommendations at that same time that Fauci was talking about masks was Trump. That same fellow was, in fact lying about covid routinely at that point...yet you are here insisting that Dr Fauci is the liar of note during the first year of the pandemic. Is Trump credible? Is Trump more or less credible than Fauci? Fauci was walking a fine line advocating for a mitigation strategy that Trump didn't agree with while knowing that Trump's pandemic team didn't have an adequate PPE stockpile for both health providers and the public.
You made the point that as a health professional you don't think Fauci is trustworthy and you know where to go for trustworthy guidance but you just follow your own guidance. As a health professional who would you recommend to your patient...a video from Fauci or a video from...?
Fauci isn't credible to you because your media made him a scapegoat and you bought into it. If the public shouldn't trust Fauci, who should they trust? Who?
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
9 hours ago, Beerman said:
I'm pretty well-versed on where to find reliable information and make my own decisions.
Whose advice are you following? When Fauci said the ordinary citizen didn't need to wear a mask, did you follow that advice? You still trusted him after he admitted he lied?
9 hours ago, toomuchbaloney said:
Case in point. Name your reliable sources that tell you something different from Dr Fauci about covid.
No, I wasn't responding to Tweety. I'm trying to get you to be specific.
Let me make certain that I understand the points that you've made. You believe that Fauci is a liar and admits to being a liar about wearing masks.
LOL...fine. He didn't admit to being a liar. He just has proven himself to be one.
27 minutes ago, toomuchbaloney said:
Youbelieve that there are other experts who have more credibility than Fauci but you won't name one that provided substantially different guidance than did Fauci early last year.
Yes, there probably were. I don't know who they were. At the time, we all just learned who Fauci was, and he seemed like he was the one to pay attention to. I'm supposed to know who others were who should have been in the job?
40 minutes ago, toomuchbaloney said:
Faucididn't lie about that funding, according to an NIH spokesperson. The violation of the agreement, by the company funded by NIH, was unknown to Fauci at the time of his testimony.
BHAHWAWA......he didn't know??? Sure, OK. Let's say he didn't know. Even though the virus came from Wuhan, and a year plus later he didn't know, and he was to testify before Congress....haha....I wonder who got fired for not briefing him??? LOL
That's all can deal with for tonight. Maybe I'll feel like taking part in this ludicrous discussion tomorrow.
3 minutes ago, toomuchbaloney said:
No, I wasn't responding to Tweety. I'm trying to get you to be specific.
What BS is this? My reply involving Tweety was about you incorrectly stating you asked me questions first, when actually you asked Tweety. So desperate you seem. It's sad, really.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
36 minutes ago, Beerman said:
LOL...fine. He didn't admit to being a liar. He just has proven himself to be one.
Are you talking about the masks or the gain of function issue? Regardless, it's not established fact that Fauci lied about either...it's simply a belief among social conservatives.
38 minutes ago, Beerman said:
Yes, there probably were. I don't know who they were. At the time, we all just learned who Fauci was, and he seemed like he was the one to pay attention to. I'm supposed to knowwho others were who should have been in the job?
You said that you knew that Fauci was lying and that implies that you knew the truth, presumably not because you have higher security clearance but because you read or heard that somewhere. Why were you just learning who Anthony Fauci is in 2020? That lack of previous knowledge makes me wonder why you consider yourself well informed about the scientist's character at this late date. If you think that Fauci is a liar that shouldn't be trusted who do you trust to get pandemic information. Like I said, if not Fauci then who is giving your reliable information about Covid?
44 minutes ago, Beerman said:
he didn't know??? Sure, OK. Let's say he didn't know. Even though the virus came from Wuhan, and a year plus later he didn't know, and he was to testify before Congress....haha....I wonder who got fired for not briefing him??? LOL
That's what the NIH indicated. The report that revealed the beach of contract regarding gain of function had not been made available to Fauci prior to his congressional testimony. The two important points there are that 1) Fauci didn't lie, rather he was ignorant of the truth per his employer's official statement and, 2) the funding was not INTENDED to support gain of function. The gain of function aspect was a breach of the funding contract according to the NIH letter to Congress. I'll let you worry about whether or not someone got fired.
I clearly asked you to clarify where you were getting your information if you thought others were providing different or more credible information on covid mitigation. You seem desperate to not answer that. Oh well. I don't care about others reviewing...I'm interacting with you here and I quoted the remarks to refresh your memory. If you stopped trusting Dr Fauci last Spring, who have you been getting your information from and how does it differ from Fauci's guidance? I have a suspicion as to why you won't answer my questions about your beliefs and practices.
But conservative anti-covid people are spinning and trying to use Omicron to make Fauci look bad, rather than being relieved it might not be that bad.
11 hours ago, toomuchbaloney said:
Who are they taking covid guidance from? Joe Rogan? Scott Atlas? Tucker Carlson?
10 hours ago, Beerman said:
Whose advice are you following? When Fauci said the ordinary citizen didn't need to wear a mask, did you follow that advice?
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
3 minutes ago, Beausoleil said:
And the point goes to……..Beerman.
Beerman should answer the question that I asked him regarding his comment. I didn't quote Tweety when I asked Beerman to clarify his stance.
Further, the question about masking that troubles Beerman wasn't terribly confusing for most people who aren't looking to scapegoat someone. I followed the public health guidance that Fauci promoted at the time, millions of us did. This was all discussed up, down and sideways months ago along with the conservative outrage about Fauci's emails. All of it is evidence of a right wing smear campaign yet the "Fauci is a liar" is something that people want to believe. And so, just like the election lies of 2020, this stuff gets thrown around as if it's true...because people believe it.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
@Beerman
Let me answer your question directly. Yes, I followed Dr Fauci's recommendations. We discussed previously that many/most of us did not cherry pick Fauci's remarks looking for confusion. Many/most of us listened to his remarks and recommendations in total, paid attention to the reporting on the shortage of masks (did you notice the boom in home made masks) and followed the CDC guidance on masking and social distancing.
I get the impression that you believe that Fauci might be responsible for some of the anti-mask sentiment in this country. I would argue that anti-mask individuals are generally trying to blame Fauci for the Trump effect on masking. They aren't Fauci fans deeply influenced by Fauci's wisdom or words. They are Trump fans deeply influenced by his fabrications and projections.
I've said before that I trust Fauci and his guidance and have from the start. I was well aware of him and his expertise before he made your radar. Your question seemed like a rehash.
Now let's cover some new ground. Since you don't trust Fauci and believe that he isn't credible relative to covid, who do you trust and what information have they provided that's different from Fauci's?
Let me answer your question directly. Yes, I followed Dr Fauci's recommendations. We discussed previously that many/most of us did not cherry pick Fauci's remarks looking for confusion. Many/most of us listened to his remarks and recommendations in total, paid attention to the reporting on the shortage of masks (did you notice the boom in home made masks) and followed the CDC guidance on masking and social distancing.
I get the impression that you believe that Fauci might be responsible for some of the anti-mask sentiment in this country. I would argue that anti-mask individuals are generally trying to blame Fauci for the Trump effect on masking. They aren't Fauci fans deeply influenced by Fauci's wisdom or words. They are Trump fans deeply influenced by his fabrications and projections.
I've said before that I trust Fauci and his guidance and have from the start. I was well aware of him and his expertise before he made your radar. Your question seemed like a rehash.
Now let's cover some new ground. Since you don't trust Fauci and believe that he isn't credible relative to covid, who do you trust and what information have they provided that's different from Fauci's?
So, you don't believe Fauci is never wrong, and has never been untruthful to us?
Anyway, I know how to find and analyze data. I've taken and continue to gather information from a variety of sources, including Dr Fauci. I can assess my own risks, and those around me. I don't need Fauci to tell me if I can gather my family for Christmas.
That reminds me of his latest flip-flop. Go to the 2:40 mark. He'll tell us it's too soon to tell if we can gather for Christmas. The next day on another show, he said his remarks were misrepresented, and that vaccinated people can gather for a normal gathering.
Other then his approval rating, what else might have changed his mind?
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
20 minutes ago, Beerman said:
So, you don't believe Fauci is never wrong, and has never been untruthful to us?
Anyway, I know how to find and analyze data. I've taken and continue to gather information from a variety of sources, including Dr Fauci. I can assess my own risks, and those around me. I don't need Fauci to tell me if I can gather my family for Christmas.
That reminds me of his latest flip-flop. Go to the 2:40 mark. He'll tell us it's too soon to tell if we can gather for Christmas. The next day on another show, he said his remarks were misrepresented, and that vaccinated people can gather for a normal gathering.
Other then his approval rating, what else might have changed his mind?
Did I say that I believe that anyone is never wrong or are you changing the argument. You don't say that Fauci was wrong, you said that he was a deliberate liar with no credibility when it came to covid, right? Now all of a sudden it's not a matter of lying for you, it's a matter of not getting something right...oh yeah...and there's that untruthful part again. Because you are quite convinced that if anyone was untruthful about covid in 2020 it was surely Fauci...right?
Yes. You've said that you don't trust or need Fauci (presumably because you believe he is a liar that got things wrong and ruined his credibility) yet you just can't specify who you get covid guidance from specifically, since you don't trust Fauci, and you can't specify how the information that you get from sources other than Fauci is different from Fauci's guidance.
Gosh...don't you think that emerging data and evidence from a new variant of a novel virus is the primary driver of evolving scientific opinion? Why do you think that an approval rating would matter to Fauci? What is the other expert telling you about omicron and mitigation strategies that are different from Fauci?
Gosh...don'tyou think that emerging data and evidence from a new variant of a novel virus is the primary driver of evolving scientific opinion? Why do you think that an approval rating would matter to Fauci? What is the other expert telling you about omicron and mitigation strategies that are different from Fauci?
He said one day it was too soon to say, and literally the next day said all is good if you want to gather for the holidays. Other then the backlash he heard, what other emerging data do you suppose there was?
Beerman, BSN
4,415 Posts
You seem to have forgotten that you actually asked Tweety, not me, whose advice that Fauci critics were following. I asked my questions to you immediately after.
He is a liar. When he told us not to wear masks, he didn't tell us the real reason as to why. He's has told us the NIH didn't fund the Wuhan lab gain of function testing. We now know that was a lie.
Actually, since I'm an educated and experienced nurse, I followed my own different guidance on masks. Knowing that new, unknown virus was going around that was likely spread by droplets or was airborne, I wore a mask anyway. And made sure my parents and others did too.
It's not necessarily that at the present that any advice would be different. It's that to many he's not credible. For reasons I've stated, and also many of his messages have become political. That turns off many, and not just those on the right.