Coming in late with a weird question

[Flare]

Hey gang - It's been a heck of a month. I'm still not dug out yet and the precious few minutes that I did have to take a breather were spent focusing on working on papers for my masters. No joke there. Anyway.

Has Anyone ever dealt with children of parents that claim they are sovereign citizens? I have that going on right now and while it seems they are giving the main office more issues than they are giving me, I can see where the issues are going to come in. I still have a license to protect and I still have a procedure to follow, despite how you may live your life. Anyone have any input?

[JenTheSchoolRN, BSN, RN]

I'd likely use the word "policy." Sure, you may not obey laws, but for your child to be a student at this school, you must comply with our policy regardless of your citizen status. If you cannot, you are welcome to enroll your child elsewhere.

(Of course, easier said-than-done with a public school, but maybe it would work for discussion?)

[Flare, ASN, BSN]

so far i've been pretty good with them. it's a simple point of if you want your child to attend here and have a public school education, then you must comply with x,y, and z. If you do not wish to comply then you are free to explore a number of options that are not free public schooling. Home schooling comes to mind. The thing that has me concerned is that they have the academic side on edge and they have a tendency to do some questionable things when backed into a corner such as forget that OPRA requires a written request and a process before a release of records. My records are fine. I have nothing to hide, but I'l also be darned if I am going to let a lawless bully make me put my license on the line because he feels like making waves.

[nursej22, MSN, RN]

Call ICE on them?

[dbabz]

I had to google "sovereign citizen." Basically your Tim McVeigh-Terry Nichols-Cliven Bundy anti-government type who believes that laws don't apply to them, that they don't have to pay taxes and that the local sheriff is the highest authority in the land. In a stunning display of cognitive dissonance, they don't seem to mind using federally maintained roads, post offices or public schools. Which brings me to my question, OP, are you employed at a public school? If so, why are they allowing their kids to be educated by the government they hate so much? Also, are they demanding something out of the ordinary?

I get a little frustrated with government overreach, the nanny state and rampant PC-ism myself sometimes. This movement, however, seems a little wacky.

[Flare, ASN, BSN]

exactly... they don't want the government except when it is convenient for them. Then they want it under their terms. Sorry, honey but it doesn't work like that. Something about cake and eating it too. I have a job to do. Your philosophies are yours to have on your time.

[TiffyRN, BSN, PhD]

I heard a podcast featuring a young lady whose parents kept her completely off the grid. She ran away as a 17 or 18 year old. She is not in a huge mess because she had virtually no records of her existence. Her parents never sent her to school, almost no doctor visits. She is truly undocumented. At least Dreamers tend to have some documents from their country of origin. She can't get a driver's license, can't vote, basically has no way to prove her citizenship. And, she's in Texas, where there is extreme concern about proper documentation. All her representatives have said they can't help her, she can't prove her citizenship (i.e. she's not a voter, not a concern). Her parents might could help by providing documentation or at least attestation about her birth circumstances but they are estranged since she ran away not being in agreement with their "sovereign citizen" stand.

Here's a link to the podcast page, Radiolab (I love their stuff). Great information if you are dealing with sovereign citizen stuff.

The Girl Who Doesn't Exist | Radiolab | WNYC Studios

[TiffyRN, BSN, PhD]

I heard a podcast featuring a young lady whose parents kept her completely off the grid. She ran away as a 17 or 18 year old. She is not in a huge mess because she had virtually no records of her existence. Her parents never sent her to school, almost no doctor visits. She is truly undocumented. At least Dreamers tend to have some documents from their country of origin. She can't get a driver's license, can't vote, basically has no way to prove her citizenship. And, she's in Texas, where there is extreme concern about proper documentation. All her representatives have said they can't help her, she can't prove her citizenship (i.e. she's not a voter, not a concern). Her parents might could help by providing documentation or at least attestation about her birth circumstances but they are estranged since she ran away not being in agreement with their "sovereign citizen" stand.

Here's a link to the podcast page, Radiolab (I love their stuff). Great information if you are dealing with sovereign citizen stuff.

The Girl Who Doesn't Exist | Radiolab | WNYC Studios

Wow, I didn't read all her updates but basically this girl has been through so much. She got a lawyer and did get a State Representative to help her out. They participated in putting together a law to allow a "delayed birth certificate" but this still required parental assistance. Her father decided to help her out. The law was enacted. She got a birth certificate, a passport, a driver's license and social security number. This poor kid has been through it. She just wanted to function in society (which goes against all her parent's beliefs). I remember a guy (no relation to her) they interviewed for the podcast talking about how her parents had given her the most perfect gift, complete anonymity and freedom from the tyrannical US government.

[Daisy Joyce]

Where do I sign on for that "don't obey laws" thing?

*goes off to fantasize about how to spend the money I won't be spending on taxes anymore*

[lifelearningrn, BSN, RN]

IIRC- They like to quote documents prior to the US Constitution and Bill of Rights. They don't believe in drivers licenses, or taxes, or any other societal rule they don't feel like following. These are usually US born citizens who have been sold a 'bill of goods' instructing them that they don't have to pay taxes, that they are legally allowed to take over a vacant property and make it their own (after living on it for a certain amount of time), don't have to have a license to drive nor have to show any ID when asked.

You and your school do NOT have to accommodate this family without proper documents. YOU do not have to put your license on the line. What are they doing that threatens you?

[Flare, ASN, BSN]

nothing yet. I'm not threatened by them. I want what I want when I want it. Their claim of sovereigenty is as meaningful to me as it would be to a police officer asking them for a driver's license. If they don't want to cough up vaccine records, then they better have some sort of medical or religious (ahem don't get me started) exemption letter to go with it. But i'm not about to instruct them on it. I haven't had anything unusual happen with them... yet. stay tuned, folks!

[lifelearningrn, BSN, RN]

nothing yet. I'm not threatened by them. I want what I want when I want it. Their claim of sovereigenty is as meaningful to me as it would be to a police officer asking them for a driver's license. If they don't want to cough up vaccine records, then they better have some sort of medical or religious (ahem don't get me started) exemption letter to go with it. But i'm not about to instruct them on it. I haven't had anything unusual happen with them... yet. stay tuned, folks!

I NEVER even mention exemptions... lol

[Flare, ASN, BSN]

me either. If i am pressed, i will answer questions about them, but not happily. I actually had a parent call me up to try and debate vaccines with me. The kicker - not even one of my students. Was seeking a second opinion because he didn't like what the school nurse at his kid's school told him. Some people have brass ones.