Calling staff "nurses" who aren't nurses!!

Nurses General Nursing

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I just need to get this off my chest and ask for opinions from anyone here. What do you think about staff ie., MA and back office asst (that works under the "grandfather clause") being referred to as a "Nurse" to the patients, etc. I'm having such trouble with this and can't get over it :angryfire

I work in an office with 3 doctors - one doctor has a MA - the other doctor has the asst (under the grandfather clause :uhoh3: ) - and my doctor has me (the only RN in our office!!) :p It angers me so much when they are referred to as nurses - this happens all day, everyday.

First, why should they get credit for a title they never worked for (and I mean worked for!) - secondly, when you are referred to with a specific title, you are expected to have atleast that basic knowledge and held up to that standard - third, if a mistake is made or a complaint is filed on the MA or asst, won't our practice get into trouble for having unlicensed staff doing the work of a nurse, and being referred to as a nurse to the patient? Our patients are in our office believing that they are being treated by a RN!! Its just not right!!

I've spoken to the office staff and expressed my feelings but of course they are still being called 'nurses'. I worked so hard for my title and am so very proud of myself for my accomplishments and I wear my RN proud. I just don't think it is right that they don't have to put any blood, sweat, and tears into their "title"!!

Am I being tooooooo petty????? :rolleyes:

Thanks so much

you could not be more mistaken. read your Nurse Practice Act if you think it's harmless. It's not. And it's not legal. :angryfire

deb,

isn't there a difference between being called a nurse vs.identifying yourself as one? if the ma is calling him/herself a nurse, then it's illegal. but for the (sexist) md to call the ma a nurse is erroneous, but don't think it would be illegal.

leslie

Specializes in Specializes in L/D, newborn, GYN, LTC, Dialysis.

I was referring to the "sticks and stones" post, Leslie. And if one does not correct the mistaken perception, or the use of the title of "nurse" is encouraged or allowed by the employer, then yes, I believe it would be illegal.

I'm sorry, I didn't intend to offend you. I didn't mean to sound like I thought ALL MAs tried to pass themselves off as nurses, just some of the ones I have seen in the office. I had no idea that there are AA degrees in Medical Assisting. What kinds of courses do you take? What is your scope of practice?

Thanks for the nice reply pricklypear. I appreciate that! I know there are alot of MA's out there who don't hesitate to use the "nurse" title. They seem to think that they can get away with it without having gone to nursing school, and this gives the rest of the MA's who DO know their scope of practice a bad name. There are actually people out there who WANT to be an MA, myself included! At this point in my life, I prefer to work in a clinical setting because I like the duties that I have. I love being able to work directly with the doctor (I've learned so much), and the doctor will use his discretion as to what I am able to do. I would never perform any duty that I did not feel comfortable with. Yes, there is an AA degree available for MA's. Some of the courses I've taken include Pharm, Pathology, A&P, Med Term, Law and Ethics, Psych, Abnormal Psych, medical transcription, coding and billing, plus our own clinicals. After graduating, we may take our state exam to become certified. We are required to obtain CEU's and must recertify every 5 years. Our scope of practice includes setting up pt's, taking vitals, phlebotomy, injections (no IV), assisting the physician with minor office surgery, sterilizing surgical packs, ECG's, suture and staple removal, wound care, making patient appointments and referrals, scheduling procedures and surgery's, and most anything that has to do with the front office. We are completly trained to work front office and back, so we can basically "do it all". Unfortunatly, I think this is one of the reasons that MA's are being hired in more and more clinics, and I know there are some physicians who do cross the line and allow MA's to perform duties not in their scope of practice. Maybe this is why some MA's think of themselves as "nurses". Where I live, positions for clinics are advertised for CMA, LPN, or RN, which are called "clinical assistants", and all are paid the same (usually what an MA would make). I don't think that this is fair, but like I said before, it all comes down to money. I hope this gives you all some insight as to what an MA does (or is supposed to do)! :)

I think once the distinctive uniform was lost, then this became a problem. Pts don't bother to read name tags, don't understand about the way a hospital works, and just appreciate anyone who is there for them. So, in my setting as a hospital nurse, they'll refer to the CNA as a nurse. Sometimes I'll say, "Oh, that was Janet, she's the nurse's aide tonight", or sometimes I'll just not say anything. But, with everyone wearing scrubs these days, what's a pt going to think?

So, it doesn't bother me, but I do introduce myself as their nurse, telling them how long I'll be there, etc. They like that.:)

I think once the distinctive uniform was lost, then this became a problem. Pts don't bother to read name tags, don't understand about the way a hospital works, and just appreciate anyone who is there for them. So, in my setting as a hospital nurse, they'll refer to the CNA as a nurse. Sometimes I'll say, "Oh, that was Janet, she's the nurse's aide tonight", or sometimes I'll just not say anything. But, with everyone wearing scrubs these days, what's a pt going to think?

So, it doesn't bother me, but I do introduce myself as their nurse, telling them how long I'll be there, etc. They like that.:)

I agree with this. I think we all have a responsiblity to our pts to let them know our name, title, and what we are there for. We are all players on the same team, but with different duties! :)

Specializes in Telemetry, ICU, Resource Pool, Dialysis.

That is so interesting, Andi! I guess I'm behind the times...I always thought MAs were just minimally trained to do things like take vitals and stuff. Now, I totally see their value - it's like they're cross-trained with all the coding, and office training. And they can hold an AA degree, just like a nurse but with a slightly different scope - more geared toward clinic needs. I actually think that's a great idea. Now it bothers me that I'm assuming the pay scale is lower for an MA than a nurse. This doesn't seem fair for college educated MAs.

Specializes in med/surg, telemetry, IV therapy, mgmt.

(Daytonite said. . .The word "nurse" is only being used in a vernacular sense.)

you could not be more mistaken. read your Nurse Practice Act if you think it's harmless. It's not. And it's not legal. :angryfire

SmilingBluEyes,

I was not referring to anything about the Nurse Practice Act. Please consult a collegiate dictionary and read the definition of "vernacular" so you will understand what I meant. The word vernacular was meant as in "idiom", or as an accepted phrase or word within the common language of the people. Among those who work in the profession and are licensed, the meaning of nurse has one meaning. The general lay public tends to use the word "nurse" in a more broad sense.

I challenge you to look at your nurse practice act find where it says that just the act of calling someone "nurse" is illegal. This is the point I was making.

A physician can have anyone under his direct supervision perform tasks as long as he has given them instruction in how to do them. That has always been so. Hospitals don't permit it for liability reasons. However, MAs, doctor's family members, and just about anyone a doctor hires on to work in their offices have been doing nursing tasks for years under the doctor's direct supervision. The ANA doesn't like it, but there's nothing they can do about it.

Specializes in ER (new), Respitory/Med Surg floor.
you could not be more mistaken. read your Nurse Practice Act if you think it's harmless. It's not. And it's not legal. :angryfire
If the person is stating there profession is a nurse and being hired to care for a person and not licensed that's a different story and not right!
That is so interesting, Andi! I guess I'm behind the times...I always thought MAs were just minimally trained to do things like take vitals and stuff. Now, I totally see their value - it's like they're cross-trained with all the coding, and office training. And they can hold an AA degree, just like a nurse but with a slightly different scope - more geared toward clinic needs. I actually think that's a great idea. Now it bothers me that I'm assuming the pay scale is lower for an MA than a nurse. This doesn't seem fair for college educated MAs.

Pricklypear-Yes, we actually have alot of schooling for our degree, but as for the pay scale being lower for MA's I think is because of the different and more extensive training that nurses do have. Most nurses work in hospitals and have alot more responsibility than MA's have. Like pharmacology...I had to take the same course as did the nursing students which also covered the nursing process in content. I'm glad that I know the material, but I seriously doubt that I will deal with the extensive use of meds in a clinical setting as nurses would in a hospital setting. Nurses have been trained in critical thinking, and to watch for adverse reactions and contraindications. That's pretty involved in that respect and I think that a nurses level of training with meds continues well past the education that I recieved as an MA. But, I do know enough about the subject to watch for any interactions and allergies that the pt has and have always questioned the physician if I had any doubts about a med that was being prescribed. There are questionable schools out there who offer strickly on-line or accelerated programs and are not accredited like the CC I attend. What about clinicals! I think that's why many MA's haven't had a quality education and sadly, some are hired off the street and trained on the job. This is happening to often, and I think that MA's should at least be certified to work in a clinic. Some states are considering licensing for MA's which would definitley weed-out the untrained and protect the patient. :)

I agree, pts use the word 'nurse' very loosely about anyone who is providing some type of nursing care to them.

I challenge you to look at your nurse practice act find where it says that just the act of calling someone "nurse" is illegal. This is the point I was making.

New York

Nurse Practice Act: Section 6513

1. Anyone not authorized to use a professional title regulated by this title, and who uses such professional title, shall be guilty of a class A misdemeanor.

2. Anyone who knowingly aids or abets three or more persons not authorized to use a professional title regulated by this title, to use such professional title, or knowingly employs three or more persons not authorized to use a professional title regulated by this title, who use such professional title in the course of such employment, shall be guilty of a class E felony.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I am pretty sure this would apply to a physician allowing his/her office staff who are not nurses to be referred to as such. I also believe that a person who is not a nurse has the responsibility to correct anyone who refers to them as a nurse. To not do so is equivalent to using the title.

Specializes in Operating Room.

Anyone can nurse someone back to health, that is what "nurse" means in general, or even someone that helps the Dr.

Now, if someone says they are an RN, and they aren't, that is illegal.

Why don't you ask your clinic manager/Dr about getting nametags that clearly state Medical Assistant or Registered Nurse?

If it's really a big deal to you say, "I am Dr. ____'s RN, and actually the only RN in the office. Let me know if you have any questions."

This makes me wonder, who is your supervisor? A medical assistant? The Dr.? Someone without any medical training at all????

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