maybe its just me, but i get very bothered when someone says "i'm a nurse," and their not, their a cna, or nurse aid, or have no schooling at all and just worked their way up in a clinic. i work at a local emergency clinic 30 hours a week to gain experience in my field, and i just got accepted in ns, and i'v worked darn hard to get here! and i find it bothersome when one of the girls at work say "i'm the nurse" or something along those lines...i feel that when i graduate and pass my nclex that, only then, will i be able to say "i'm a nurse." the other day my doctor said "jamie, will you get a nurse?" i said "im sorry doc, i dont think we have any of those working here." he actually laughed and said "you know what i mean"......but is this just me?????
Specializes in icu, er, transplant, case management, ps.
Woody, it's admirable that you show respect for education. Unfortunately if you read the many ADN vs. BSN threads in our profession that's not always true. Tom isn't necessarily the lone ranger in his disrespect here.
Tweety, when you reach the age of 62 or older, you grow tired of the same old argument that a diploma program is better then an AD program. And that an A.D. program is better then a B.S.N. program. I attended a diploma program. My program required us to spend our first year taking courses at a local four year college, four days a week and one day in nursing classes at our school. We did our clinical time when everyone else had time off from their education programs. And this was in 1964, long before any diploma program ever thought about such a requirement.
I attended a two year program, that really was a two year program. You entered it and completed it in two years. The one exception was failure of the clinical aspect. And you could fail and recomplete inly once before you were booted out.
My BSN program took me only two summer sessions and a fall semester to complete. And it was not because I was a super student. I had done a year of liberal arts in California. I had done a fall, spring and two summer sessions, while in my diploma program. And I returned to the same university I had attended while in my diploma program.
I am sorry but I have little rolerence for someone who claims that their two year program or their diploma program is better then a four year program. I also tolerate the three entry levels with much less tolerence that I once did. As a matter of fact, I believe there should be only one entry level to being able to sit for the RN licensing board-a four year degree. All those AD graduates should be grandfathered in as R.N.'s. LPN's should be made to complete a two year technical nursing program. Do I think it is going to happen? No. There are too many associate programs out there, filling a need, allowing employers to keep salaries low. There are too many people teaching in such programs that are not willing to increase their own requirements, let alone other's requirements. And there are too many nurses, who do not have a problem with other's identifying themselves as nurses, giving out information and advice.
In fact, I'm glad I no longer work. I don't have to put up with the attitudes, the poor pay, the poor hours, the weekends, the 12 hour shfits. Now all I have to worry about is does the nurse that is taking care of me, have sufficent basic nursing education, so that she/he will not make a mistake.
Tweety, when you reach the age of 62 or older, you grow tired of the same old argument that a diploma program is better then an AD program. And that an A.D. program is better then a B.S.N. program. I attended a diploma program. My program required us to spend our first year taking courses at a local four year college, four days a week and one day in nursing classes at our school. We did our clinical time when everyone else had time off from their education programs. And this was in 1964, long before any diploma program ever thought about such a requirement.
I attended a two year program, that really was a two year program. You entered it and completed it in two years. The one exception was failure of the clinical aspect. And you could fail and recomplete inly once before you were booted out.
My BSN program took me only two summer sessions and a fall semester to complete. And it was not because I was a super student. I had done a year of liberal arts in California. I had done a fall, spring and two summer sessions, while in my diploma program. And I returned to the same university I had attended while in my diploma program.
I am sorry but I have little rolerence for someone who claims that their two year program or their diploma program is better then a four year program. I also tolerate the three entry levels with much less tolerence that I once did. As a matter of fact, I believe there should be only one entry level to being able to sit for the RN licensing board-a four year degree. All those AD graduates should be grandfathered in as R.N.'s. LPN's should be made to complete a two year technical nursing program. Do I think it is going to happen? No. There are too many associate programs out there, filling a need, allowing employers to keep salaries low. There are too many people teaching in such programs that are not willing to increase their own requirements, let alone other's requirements. And there are too many nurses, who do not have a problem with other's identifying themselves as nurses, giving out information and advice.
In fact, I'm glad I no longer work. I don't have to put up with the attitudes, the poor pay, the poor hours, the weekends, the 12 hour shfits. Now all I have to worry about is does the nurse that is taking care of me, have sufficent basic nursing education, so that she/he will not make a mistake.
Woody:balloons:
I am only 5 yrs behind you
the three entry levels 1. LPN
2. RN
3. Nurse Practitoner
Those are the onle three entry levels.
I have never stated an AD is better than a BS, but its quailies you for the same entry. AS an RN.
Now me I am a very tolerant individual
What poor pay are you talking about that AD RNs help maintain
I have been making over a 100 K a yr for over 15 yrs now. I dont see that as keeping pay rates down. I think thats almost fair.
Specializes in icu, er, transplant, case management, ps.
I am only 5 yrs behind you
the three entry levels 1. LPN
2. RN
3. Nurse Practitoner
Those are the onle three entry levels.
I have never stated an AD is better than a BS, but its quailies you for the same entry. AS an RN.
Now me I am a very tolerant individual
What poor pay are you talking about that AD RNs help maintain
I have been making over a 100 K a yr for over 15 yrs now. I dont see that as keeping pay rates down. I think thats almost fair.
Since you bought it up, I had completed half of the requirements for a Family Nurse Practitioner. I had to drop out when I developed clots down here, in Florida, and was forbidden to travel by my doctor. He may have been a bit over protective, but he had taken care of me for twenty years and I trusted him. I dropped out of the program. Sent my SIL up to pack up my apartment and put my things into storage.
I have never said a word about you or your education. And I made $85,000 in 1988. That is considered quite a tidy sum, back in 1988. And today, given the increase in pay rates, I would guess I would be making about $130,000 to $135,000. But I made my money because I had an advanced degree. You are making your money because you have an advanced degree. BSN's are rarely paid much more then AD's. My B.S.N. was so under-valved down here, I made $6.10 an hour in 1980. Another R.N., with an AD got $6 an hour.
I suppose you would be against requiring Nurse Practitioners to obtain a PhD to practice. After all, what additional knowledge could they possibly attain.
This thread makes it sound like anyone with less than a PhD are chopped liver. Well I'm a LPN so I guess I'm real bad. Good thing opinions are like a--holes, everyone has one. I personally choose not to belittle or judge people base on the amount of letters after their name, it's competence and compassion that earns my respect in the healthcare field. JMO
Since you bought it up, I had completed half of the requirements for a Family Nurse Practitioner. I had to drop out when I developed clots down here, in Florida, and was forbidden to travel by my doctor. He may have been a bit over protective, but he had taken care of me for twenty years and I trusted him. I dropped out of the program. Sent my SIL up to pack up my apartment and put my things into storage.
I have never said a word about you or your education. And I made $85,000 in 1988. That is considered quite a tidy sum, back in 1988. And today, given the increase in pay rates, I would guess I would be making about $130,000 to $135,000. But I made my money because I had an advanced degree. You are making your money because you have an advanced degree. BSN's are rarely paid much more then AD's. My B.S.N. was so under-valved down here, I made $6.10 an hour in 1980. Another R.N., with an AD got $6 an hour.
I suppose you would be against requiring Nurse Practitioners to obtain a PhD to practice. After all, what additional knowledge could they possibly attain.
Woody:balloons:
This thread makes it sound like anyone with less than a PhD are chopped liver. Well I'm a LPN so I guess I'm real bad. Good thing opinions are like a--holes, everyone has one. I personally choose not to belittle or judge people base on the amount of letters after their name, it's competence and compassion that earns my respect in the healthcare field. JMO
about this kind of topic. So please lets not go there here.
Let try to keep on track with the original post which was about a non-licensed personnel referring to themselves as a nurse.
I've been trying Tweety. I do not believe that anyone who does not hold a license as an L.P.N. or R.N., should ever be allowed to refer to themselves as nurse. And I don't care if they are working in a doctor's office, clinic, hospital, LTC, HHA, a person's private home. They are not nurses. They should never be allowed to refer to themselves as nurses. They should be charge with a felony, when caught using the term nurse, and if found guilty, put in prison. Does this s mean that I am serious about individuals using a term to describe themselves as someone they are not? I sure hope it does.
I've been trying Tweety. I do not believe that anyone who does not hold a license as an L.P.N. or R.N., should ever be allowed to refer to themselves as nurse. And I don't care if they are working in a doctor's office, clinic, hospital, LTC, HHA, a person's private home. They are not nurses. They should never be allowed to refer to themselves as nurses. They should be charge with a felony, when caught using the term nurse, and if found guilty, put in prison. Does this s mean that I am serious about individuals using a term to describe themselves as someone they are not? I sure hope it does.
Woody :balloons:
Tottering off to have a long, cold one
I don't know about a felony charge but I agree with you. That is on topic. But when we go off on tangents like the BSN being undervalued, PhD's and blah blah blah, that stuff can off on the other forum where we like to keep such topics, since they can be heated.
Specializes in icu, er, transplant, case management, ps.
I don't know about a felony charge but I agree with you. That is on topic. But when we go off on tangents like the BSN being undervalued, PhD's and blah blah blah, that stuff can off on the other forum where we like to keep such topics, since they can be heated.
So, am I forgiven:lol2:
Woody:balloons:
Tottering off for another cold one, and one to keep on the night table
Since you bought it up, I had completed half of the requirements for a Family Nurse Practitioner. I had to drop out when I developed clots down here, in Florida, and was forbidden to travel by my doctor. He may have been a bit over protective, but he had taken care of me for twenty years and I trusted him. I dropped out of the program. Sent my SIL up to pack up my apartment and put my things into storage.
I have never said a word about you or your education. And I made $85,000 in 1988. That is considered quite a tidy sum, back in 1988. And today, given the increase in pay rates, I would guess I would be making about $130,000 to $135,000. But I made my money because I had an advanced degree. You are making your money because you have an advanced degree. BSN's are rarely paid much more then AD's. My B.S.N. was so under-valved down here, I made $6.10 an hour in 1980. Another R.N., with an AD got $6 an hour.
I suppose you would be against requiring Nurse Practitioners to obtain a PhD to practice. After all, what additional knowledge could they possibly attain.
Woody:balloons: [/QU
Im only an ADRN, yes I have other training and a lifetime of experience. I get paid more than most because I have earned it.
ive encountered this problem with acouple ma's who claimed they are a nurse but never a cna. the cna's i work with are great and i respect the job that they do. out of all the jobs in healthcare, cna's are the most underpaid and overworked. i dont know, maybe i havent run into this program cause ive only been an lvn for a year now.
Specializes in icu, er, transplant, case management, ps.
ive encountered this problem with acouple ma's who claimed they are a nurse but never a cna. the cna's i work with are great and i respect the job that they do. out of all the jobs in healthcare, cna's are the most underpaid and overworked. i dont know, maybe i havent run into this program cause ive only been an lvn for a year now.
I have a very dear, old friend that teaches both CNA students and Student PNs. One of the first thing she teaches to each class is their place and role in the health care field. To the CNA students she tells them, 'you are a certified nurse's assistant when you complete this course successfully. You are not a nurse.' And to the PN students, 'you will be a licnsed practical nurse when you complete this course and pass your licensing exam. You are not an R.N. And you are limited to what NYS NPA says you are.' She also instills pride into each group, in what they do, in what they contribute.
Like I have said before, I cannot understand why anyone wants to call themselves something they are not, unless it is envy. I would love to call myself doctor but I hold neither an M.D., D.O. or a PhD, so I cannot.
All states require a nursing education and a license, in order to call yourself a nurse. And BON take a very negative view of anyone calling themselves a nurse without a license. And your doctor should know it. I wonder if he would feel the same way, if a physician assistant referred to himself as a doctor. I bet he would have a very negative attitude towards the P.A. who calls himself a physician.:angryfire
Woody
Woody et al: Keep fighting the good fight. Florida has had two opportunities to pass a law similar to SC's, one did not make it out of committee and the other stalled and was not voted on befor the legislative session ended. Each state needs this clarification because consumers of health care have an expectation created by the word "nurse" and no one other than a nurse is trained to meet that expectation.
Actually, I looked into this for my own State when this turned into a lengthy thread a few months ago. It is NOT 100% illegal to call oneself a nurse in all 50 States. In fact, in NY, it is ONLY illegal to call oneself a "Registered Professional Nurse"(or "Registered Nurse"), or "Licensed Practical Nurse" if one does not hold either of those licenses. It is only the full title that is protected.
Probably the reason why we still have "baby nurses" (AKA nannies or babysitters!) and "office nurses" (those people who wear scrubs in your pediatrician's office and take your kid's height, weight, and walk you to rooms). The "office nurse" is usually an MA, but even then not always. Anyone off the street that is hired into a physician's practice and answers the phones suddenly becomes the "office nurse".
And it is 100% legal. How infuriating is that?
Like the vet tech greeting me with the informationthat she was my dog's nurse today, :angryfire :angryfire :angryfire BMA!
IN SC it is indeed illegal for a person who is not a nurse to represent him/herself as one. This law was passed years ago by the State Legislature and is enforcable, albeit rarely done.
Great work in SC, Poppa D. How do we get a copy of the legislation?
woody62, RN
928 Posts
Tweety, when you reach the age of 62 or older, you grow tired of the same old argument that a diploma program is better then an AD program. And that an A.D. program is better then a B.S.N. program. I attended a diploma program. My program required us to spend our first year taking courses at a local four year college, four days a week and one day in nursing classes at our school. We did our clinical time when everyone else had time off from their education programs. And this was in 1964, long before any diploma program ever thought about such a requirement.
I attended a two year program, that really was a two year program. You entered it and completed it in two years. The one exception was failure of the clinical aspect. And you could fail and recomplete inly once before you were booted out.
My BSN program took me only two summer sessions and a fall semester to complete. And it was not because I was a super student. I had done a year of liberal arts in California. I had done a fall, spring and two summer sessions, while in my diploma program. And I returned to the same university I had attended while in my diploma program.
I am sorry but I have little rolerence for someone who claims that their two year program or their diploma program is better then a four year program. I also tolerate the three entry levels with much less tolerence that I once did. As a matter of fact, I believe there should be only one entry level to being able to sit for the RN licensing board-a four year degree. All those AD graduates should be grandfathered in as R.N.'s. LPN's should be made to complete a two year technical nursing program. Do I think it is going to happen? No. There are too many associate programs out there, filling a need, allowing employers to keep salaries low. There are too many people teaching in such programs that are not willing to increase their own requirements, let alone other's requirements. And there are too many nurses, who do not have a problem with other's identifying themselves as nurses, giving out information and advice.
In fact, I'm glad I no longer work. I don't have to put up with the attitudes, the poor pay, the poor hours, the weekends, the 12 hour shfits. Now all I have to worry about is does the nurse that is taking care of me, have sufficent basic nursing education, so that she/he will not make a mistake.
Woody:balloons: