Breastfeed or else

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Specializes in Adolescent Psych, PICU.
Wait, hold the phone. Because there is disagreement, it signifies people are not thinking? I beg to differ...

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Yes! I posted a similiar post, I love our discussions, I love this "group" we have here. Disagreement is a good thing IMO. It gets you to thinking. I can tell you from this very discussion, I have certainly learned a few things.

You can't really talk about this stuff in real life, we would lose all our friends! LOL

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Specializes in Specializes in L/D, newborn, GYN, LTC, Dialysis.

I just did that in my last post. You can connect the dots, I am sure, as a very articulate and intelligent person you have already proven yourself to be. I outline the many advantages of breastfeeding to my patients/significant others. Then I let them decide what is best for them and their families. End of story. It's not a play, here, we discussing, just interaction (among many I might add) between myself as a nurse and my (potentially very vulnerable) patient, for whom I am obligated to advocate.

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Specializes in NICU/Neonatal transport.

edited to add: No, smilingblueeyes, you gave vague references to informing her and not making her feel guilty. Actually type out the conversation you would have with a new mother, verbatim, to show me how it's done.

But as medical professionals, aren't we supposed to base our practice on more than just our personal experiences? Isn't evidence-based care the gold standard?

And if I recall correctly, I have stated, on at least three occasions, that it is perfectly acceptable for mothers to make their own decisions based on their own needs, and it doesn't make them bad mothers. Done. Said. Multiple times.

And so, clearly, since I'm now just repeating myself ad nauseum, please feel free to look at one of my many responses on this thread to any future replies. It will likely have the pertinent issue addressed, and if anyone would like to discuss this in an intellectual manner, without the emotional baggage that is too often brought to the table, please, feel free to PM me.

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Specializes in Pediatrics, Geriatrics, Call Center RN.
But, no one is thinking, they are reacting emotionally. They aren't reading the studies, the essays, the articles. I'm feel like I'm talking to a wall. People aren't responding to my analogies as to why they feel they are incorrect or how to improve them, they aren't answering the questions I pose.

All that has been said is: tell moms to breastfeed. It's better. But don't tell them why, because that could make them feel bad. If you tell them why, you're guilting them and horrible.

And people wonder why women aren't breastfeeding.

You said in an earlier post that you are a nurse to be. So that implies that currently you are not a nurse and rather in school or planning on attending school. One thing you will learn in school is that the patient does have a right to hear the information. BUT, they have the right to chose to do things their way, and as a nurse you must support them, even when you don't think it is the right thing. You will feel like you are talking to the wall, remember it's all in the presentation. Do you think a Mom fresh from delivery wants to hear about essays, studies and articles? Give the facts and let them decide. But they don't need the guilt if they decide differently then what you want them to.

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Specializes in Specializes in L/D, newborn, GYN, LTC, Dialysis.

Evidence-based care IS the gold standard. I never argued against that, nor is anyone else here from what I see.

But there is more to it than that. (being a patient advocate/nurse)

As a nurse, I can write reams about the ART of nursing, as well as the science, to which you seem to be very drawn. To be a good nurse, you need to be able to practice BOTH. Now, I am sorry but, I am not going to type out an entire interaction here. I told you what I say. You yourself, know as well if not better than anyone, the advantages to breastfeeding, as do I. I am very pro-breastfeeding and have personally breastfed both my kids for all these "right reasons".

These reasons FOR breastfeeding, are what I communicate to patients who are either undecided or say they think they will bottle feed. If after I have said my piece, if they still want to bottlefeed, then I have to move on. I have only so much time to express or encourage any agenda or point, as well-meaning as I might make it to be.

As a nurse, I have a LOT of educating to do...and care to give in 24-48 short hours' time. Breastfeeding is but ONE issue on my plate as an obstetric nurse, albeit a hugely important one. But like I said, it is ONE of the issues I deal with as a nurse, advocate and educator of my patients. I have only so much time for each issue/situation facing my patients, families and myself as their nurse. I would hope you understand.

And at the end of the day, I want them going home confident in their abilities to care for themselves and their babies competently and completely. That is my overall goal as a nurse.

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Specializes in ICU, ER, Hemodialysis.
Tell me exactly how you do this, roleplay it with me if you will. I'm definitely willing to learn and I'd love to see how this is properly approached so the mother doesn't feel guilty, but is fully informed.

wouldn't it be appropriate to say "it is perfectly fine to bottle feed if that is your choice, but as your nurse i want you to be completely informed first...did you know that studies suggest that breast milk has many wonderful benefits such as...(quote your many studies and give them a pamplet with said studies on it)

this way you have informed them, but not offended them. now they know about the studies and if they choose to breast feed then great, but if they choose to bottle feed then you did what you feel like you should have and they did what they felt was best for their family!

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Alright, so then give examples of how you propose to educate a woman about breastfeeding, without "guilting" her.

Please, give me something to read that supports your point of view. Be it essay, article or study. Respond to a question I've posed. Respond to a study I've posted. Respond to the essay I posted.

But, just blindly saying someone is wrong does not a thoughtful argument make. I'm reminded of the Monty Python skit.

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Just because I don't blindly believe in every study I read doesn't make my argument any less thoughtful. I have never said that breastmilk isn't the best... I said it is not for everyone and is certainly not our choice to make. I would definitely educate my patients about the pros and cons of BF vs FF... and YES there are cons to breastfeeding. Our job as nurses is to support our patients in adapting be it by education or by just standing by their decision. I am a EMT and if someone calls the ambulance and obviously needs medical attention and then decides not to be transported... we cannot force them to go with us if they are of adequate mental status. We can actually be charged with a crime if we force someone into doing something they don't want to do. This is the same principle. Having a baby should be the happiest time in your life, the stress that is put on pregnant women is horendous. Not to mention the total lack of sleep that is thrust upon you. So it's doesn't take much to figure out why FF became so popular. Haven't even mentioned the fact that many women HAVE to go back to work after only 6 wks. Darn that women's lib... it has made us all slaves to the almighty dollar. I know if I had the means I would stay home and be super-mom, but in reality it just wouldn't work for me or the majority of other moms. I personally would be much happier being June Cleaver. Neglecting my duties at home and loosing all that time with my daugther makes me very crabby.

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wouldn't it be appropriate to say "it is perfectly fine to bottle feed if that is your choice, but as your nurse i want you to be completely informed first...did you know that studies suggest that breast milk has many wonderful benefits such as...(quote your many studies and give them a pamplet with said studies on it)

this way you have informed them, but not offended them. now they know about the studies and if they choose to breast feed then great, but if they choose to bottle feed then you did what you feel like you should have and they did what they felt was best for their family!

You are going to make a GREAT nurse!

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Specializes in NICU/Neonatal transport.

Ok. Because I am a sucker, loser and whatnot else and I cannot just let this patronizing, condescension slip by, I must address it.

You said in an earlier post that you are a nurse to be. So that implies that currently you are not a nurse and rather in school or planning on attending school. One thing you will learn in school is that the patient does have a right to hear the information. BUT, they have the right to chose to do things their way, and as a nurse you must support them, even when you don't think it is the right thing. You will feel like you are talking to the wall, remember it's all in the presentation. Do you think a Mom fresh from delivery wants to hear about essays, studies and articles? Give the facts and let them decide. But they don't need the guilt if they decide differently then what you want them to.

Please point to a post where I say I think moms are terrible for FF? Please point to a post where I think women should be guilted AFTER the fact. Please point to a post where I think this is a discussion to be had in the delivery room. Please note this was supposed to be an intellectual discussion on a nurses board. Please note that many people have said that by stating any of the truths about BFing, moms are being made to feel guilty.

Oh yeah. I've never said any of that. Much to the point where I've asserted the exact opposite of what you are claiming to me.

Yes, I enjoy walking down the street and squirting breastmilk in the faces of those horrible horrible mothers who give that poison they dare to call formula. I hate them will all my body and soul. They are terrible people and don't deserve to have children. Only me and my kind should be allowed to have children and you definitely are not part of that group. FF moms are lazy and uncaring who hate babies.

You people act like because we want moms fully informed prior to giving formula, we want to whip them for the rest of their lives.

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Specializes in Specializes in L/D, newborn, GYN, LTC, Dialysis.

Just a caveat: Using inflammatory language like "you people" will put up a barrier to their understanding any points you are trying to make. Just something to think about. We all have points we want to make but it won't help to become derogatory or inflammatory to do this.

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Specializes in NICU/Neonatal transport.

*scratches head* Isn't that exactly what I've been saying?

Fully inform them prior to the initiation of infant feeding. Yeah. I'm pretty sure that's what I said. And I'm pretty sure I also never mentioned harrassing mothers who chose differently.

But as glaringly obvious from this board, any mention of deficiencies of FF are an automatic accusation. Maybe the mom already FF a previous child. By what you just told her, you're guilting her.

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Specializes in Adolescent Psych, PICU.

dbl post

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