Becoming an NP with little to no nursing experience??

[Blurr156]

Hello to all!!! I have worked as a parmamedic for 20 years, have a B.A. in Economics, and I wanted to advance my career in healthcare. I was originally looking to pursue the PA route, but for certain practical reasons (including my union not helping to pay for it) I have been looking at other options, nursing/NP.

I was very excited to learn of a school near me that has a combined BSN/NP program for people with non-nursing bachelor degrees. I was about to start looking deeper into this program when a good friend of mine who is a member of an interview committee at a nearby hospital told me that I shouldn't do the program because I would have trouble getting a job.

The reason stated was because I wouldn't have been seen as having "paid my dues" as a nurse first.

Is this true?

I could understand why someone might feel that way about someone who went through this type of program never having worked in healthcare before. However, I like to think that to a certain degree I've paid my dues (I know it isn't nursing, but from a time in healthcare perspective).

My friend did say that I might be considered an exception to that rule. The program is at a VERY well known school and I was told by my friend even then it wouldn't matter. I was wondering what people here thought regarding this topic.

Thank you for any guidance you can provide.

[JerseyGir1]

I am getting ready to graduate from FNP school in a few more months. I have talked with preceptor who have said they will not take on NP students who were not nurses first because they are not willing to teach you the basics before teaching you the advanced skills. NPs are Nurses who have advanced their skills from the basic nursing but without the basic nursing knowledge it is much harder to advance to the next level.

Did you work as an RN during FNP school? I am just wondering if employers would count that year or two as experience. I guess if it was full time, they would have to... but what about part time? Does anyone know??

[DutchgirlRN, ASN, RN]

vanderbilt university will take a person with a bs in any field into their np program and you come out in 2 years ready to work....prescribe...etc.....i think that's irresponsible. my pcp had one such np working for him and shall we say it did not last long....she was fired after a couple of weeks.

tuition per semester, not including books is $32, 287.00 now that's per semester. room and board is another $11,446 per semester.

[noneil680]

I thought that you had to be an RN for 2 years before you can start an actual NP program, have I been misinformed?

[PMFB-RN, RN]

I thought that you had to be an RN for 2 years before you can start an actual NP program, have I been misinformed?

*** Yes you have. While many would recommend two years of RN experience, you can get accepted into an NP program without it. A girl I went to nursing school with went directly into an ADN to MSN FNP program.

[elkpark]

I thought that you had to be an RN for 2 years before you can start an actual NP program, have I been misinformed?

Different schools have different requirements. Since the direct-entry programs have been springing up like mushrooms after a spring rain, obviously TPTB in nursing have decided that no experience whatsoever is required to become an NP ... However, some (traditional, non-direct-entry) programs do require (a minimum of) two years of RN experience to apply. Others require less experience, or none at all. Each individual school is free to set its own standards.

[LeapofFaith]

Is experience as an RN necc to become a competent NP?

I don't have a definitive answer, but here is my line of thinking...

to become a PA, you don not have to have any prior health care experience. In fact I know 3 people off the tip of my head who are PAs that went to a university took the pre -reqs and went straight to PA school, w/o finishing a bachelors degree. All found jobs before they graduated.

Why are nurses held to a different standard?

[jjjoy, LPN]

Is experience as an RN necc to become a competent NP?

I don't have a definitive answer, but here is my line of thinking...

to become a PA, you don not have to have any prior health care experience. In fact I know 3 people off the tip of my head who are PAs that went to a university took the pre -reqs and went straight to PA school, w/o finishing a bachelors degree. All found jobs before they graduated.

Why are nurses held to a different standard?

I wouldn't say that nurses are held to a different standard. It just reflects the unique development of the NP role and NP education. There's no great master plan about how NPs came into being; it's a continuing work in progress. Maybe PA students *should* be required to have more experience. Maybe NP students *should* be allowed to enter programs without any previous experience. More important is whether or not the programs effectively educate their students for their future roles. I've gotten the impression that much of clinical nursing education at various levels tends to be "teach yourself" and "sink or swim" as opposed to a step by step educational process. From what I've heard about PA programs, they seem, in general, more clearly organized and consistent in their content, in providing an adequate DEPTH of education in medical knowledge (which nursing education can *sometimes* be rather shallow in) and in preparing students to FUNCTION in their future roles.

Most NPs began as experienced RNs who - from experience and not specifically from their nursing education - came to a level of expertise such that they could essentially take on some of the roles of the MD. If a student CAN train directly as an NP, then NP education needs to take that into account. However, if RN experience isn't needed, then NP education needn't include the complete RN curriculum, which is primarily focused on inpatient bedside nursing care. If that's not the role the student is going to play, why bother? But if the NP doesn't NEED nursing experience or RN education then what part of *nursing* are they bringing to the table as an NP? Direct entry NP programs would have to teach *all* necessary medical content (to be able to diagnose and treat) as well as including nursing content (the more holistic angle). In that case, shouldn't NP training be LONGER than PA training, at least for those without previous nursing experience?

[LeapofFaith]

well said JJJoy, I have to admit that I posted my comment after reading the first couple of pages of this thread. After doing more reading I think I have a better understanding of both sides.

Thanks

[morganvibes]

I am in an acellerated NP program and have no previous nursing experience.

I know a lot more now about the whole situation then I did last year when I was reading all these posts and trying to figure it out.

I would say now that there needs to be some kind of meeting of the minds for the whole mid-level practitioner designation.

As someone with no intention of working as a bedside RN , I feel that it is plain silly to be learning about bed-making and hanging IV's and learning how to designate to a care partner etc. Not because it is beneath me, but because it is taking time away from learning skills I WILL be needing and using as an NP. The point is, the time could be used to have classes on what I WILL be doing instead of doing this back door way of becoming a mid level provider.

Just because the mid level title "Nurse practitioner" has the word nurse in it, does it have to forever mean that you started out as a nurse? I really think it needs to become it's own job with its own training.(or even give it another name ML practitioner?) And yes, that would mean you couldn't work as a nurse I guess, but for those who don't care, that would be fine.

Actually, this might help the animosity between real nurses and NP's like I will be, who aren't "really" nurses. I totally understand why they wouldn't be thrilled with this situation because it kind of belittles what it means to be a nurse. And at the same time it gives less training in being an NP. So it ends up that the PA has the most training for what they will actually be doing in the mid-level role.

Seems to me that the PA programs MUST learn a lot more pertinent information since they aren't spending half of the program training for the NCLEX.

Just my opinion, what's yours?

[ghillbert, MSN, NP]

My opinion? You can't be an advanced practise nurse without first being a nurse.

[SWR PA-S]

I am in an acellerated NP program and have no previous nursing experience.

I know a lot more now about the whole situation then I did last year when I was reading all these posts and trying to figure it out.

I would say now that there needs to be some kind of meeting of the minds for the whole mid-level practitioner designation.

As someone with no intention of working as a bedside RN , I feel that it is plain silly to be learning about bed-making and hanging IV's and learning how to designate to a care partner etc. Not because it is beneath me, but because it is taking time away from learning skills I WILL be needing and using as an NP. The point is, the time could be used to have classes on what I WILL be doing instead of doing this back door way of becoming a mid level provider.

Just because the mid level title "Nurse practitioner" has the word nurse in it, does it have to forever mean that you started out as a nurse? I really think it needs to become it's own job with its own training.(or even give it another name ML practitioner?) And yes, that would mean you couldn't work as a nurse I guess, but for those who don't care, that would be fine.

Actually, this might help the animosity between real nurses and NP's like I will be, who aren't "really" nurses. I totally understand why they wouldn't be thrilled with this situation because it kind of belittles what it means to be a nurse. And at the same time it gives less training in being an NP. So it ends up that the PA has the most training for what they will actually be doing in the mid-level role.

Seems to me that the PA programs MUST learn a lot more pertinent information since they aren't spending half of the program training for the NCLEX.

Just my opinion, what's yours?

I totally agree with you! I am a physician assistant student and actually know of friends that took the nursing route and never practiced actual nursing and we accepted into NP programs. They don't have any intention on practicing bedside nursing. They actually feel that NP programs should start accepting people into their programs WITHOUT having a nursing degree.

[bluesky, BSN, RN]

I feel that it is plain silly to be learning about bed-making and hanging IV's and learning how to designate to a care partner etc. ?

You must not need to learn advanced assessment, critical thinking or time management skills ... or see complexe and rare cases through either... because those are all skills a bedside nurse hones over the years.