Am I the only one who finds this disrespectful?

[klone]

Right now there are two threads (one which was closed) devoted to "things you should know before coming into our department" and the tone of the thread is thinly-veiled contempt at ignorant, uneducated or silly things patients or patients' families say or do. I've been hanging around this board for a couple years, and these threads are a regularly occurring thing.

I haven't said anything in these threads, instead I just close the thread and move on. But whenever I read them, I can't help but feel how disrespectful these threads seem. I understand people are "blowing off steam" and all that, but I don't know. It still really bothers me, and makes me wonder if these people who are so contemptuous are really able to mask their feelings very well.

These threads often get SO big, which makes me wonder if maybe I'm alone in thinking that it's inappropriate and disrespectful to mock the patients we see, even if it is behind their backs.

[ILoveNursing82]

I Agree.There's a time to laugh, a time to cry, a time to be happy, a time to be sad...etc. In situations where someone's life is in your hands, laughter and sarcasm shouldn't be involved.There are just some things we don't joke about.I don't think those who are guilty of talking about other patients would appreciate it if the same thing was being done behind their families' and friends' backs, or EVEN their own backs.This world lacks alot;maybe this is why we are at war.hmmmmm.Everyone has stress in their lives.Is stress a good reason to make people a laughing joke? Dont think so....Just my 2 cents guys!

[CritterLover, BSN, RN]

as much as i vent about charity patients, it is their attitude that bothers me much more than the circumstances of their insurance coverage. the medicaid patients who are rude and have this attitude that the world 'owes' them do their fellow medicaid recipients a great disservice.

exactly. i think this is what bothers most of us about medicaid patients more than anything else.

i do realize that some health care workers have come to have a bad attitude about anyone receiving medicaid, and i do think that they often let their feeling show through when dealing with patients. but i don't think this is the majority of us. and sometimes i think patients are sensitive to receiving assistance, and may hear contempt that isn't there. i had a fairly young patient a few weeks ago who had medicare. i glanced at the info the doc's office had sent, and asked her if medicare was indeed her primary insurance. in response, i got a very long, somewhat defensive explanation as to why she now had medicare and how everyone keeps asking her about it. i only wanted to know because i was trying to figure out which forms needed to be filled out. medicare has special forms.

i don't have a problem with a patient who has medicaid and needs it. but what kills me, and most nurses, is the entitled attitude some have, and how some are just flat-out working the system. when told that their medicaid carrier is out-of-netwok (we have medicaid hmos in one state near me), they will bring out their cigna/blue cross card and give you that. um, i think medicaid is for people who don't have insurance. not for those who want the option to not have to pay the er copay. that is where most of our frustration lies.

[LydiaNN]

the op is entitled to her opinion. perhaps she could have been kinder, but perhaps we do need to tone it down a bit. perhaps we do need to be careful not to cross the line when we are venting.

for the record... in nursery, we must know the patient's insurance to choose the correct pku/nbs slip and fill it out. private ins. and 'self pay' get 'paid' slips, and medicaids get 'charity'. if we choose the wrong one, the hospital does not get reimbursed. this is why we are more aware of insurance issues in ob, i suppose.

i cared for a patient last night who was a g9 p7 - a drop-in with limited prenatal care at a clinic. she was to the point of tears telling the interpreter that she didn''t want any more babies and wanted her tubes tied. it would have been a perfect oportunity since she was having her first c-sec due to breech (baby got tangled in cord), but the on-call doc couldn't do it. he was afraid, since she'd had care in the clinic, that she must have medicaid but was telling us she didn't to try and persuade him to sterilize her. this woman wasn't just being slick and trying to put one over on us, she was weary and just plain desperate.

apparently medicaid patients must sign a form 30 days in advance or medicaid won't pay the hospital bill. this is to prevent sterilization being forced on them. he said if he sterilized her anyway, medicaid would refuse the entire hospital bill. the system is really broken. i realize that these women need to be protected from forced sterilization (at least the law abiding ones anyway - established druggies & child torturers are a different story), but there has got to be a better way to do it.

i felt so bad for this poor woman. she came by ambulance with no support person. she didn't speak a word of english and was just trusting us to take care of her. she was stoic and appreciative of our care. regardless of my intense feelings about the illegal imigration problem in texas, my heart went out to her as a person. it must have been scary for her to have her first c-section like that. i made it a point to take her baby around the drape and let her see her and kiss her. i told her in my broken spanish that it was a girl, and that her baby was ok.

as much as i vent about charity patients, it is their attitude that bothers me much more than the circumstances of their insurance coverage. the medicaid patients who are rude and have this attitude that the world 'owes' them do their fellow medicaid recipients a great disservice.

i have pacific care. do the rude pacific care patients do me a disservice? i don't think so.

[33-weeker]

i have pacific care. do the rude pacific care patients do me a disservice? i don't think so.

perhaps you missed my point.

many healthcare workers are biased toward charity patients. when so many of them act rude and have such attitudes, it creates the basis for a steryotype, and the appreciative and deserving (meaning those who aren't scamming the system) charity patients are at risk of being lumped in with them. it's not fair, but it happens.

not sure what pacific care is, but if you pay for it, you are not at risk of getting lumped in with any group scamming the medicaid/charity system.

[LydiaNN]

perhaps you missed my point.

many healthcare workers are biased toward charity patients. when so many of them act rude and have such attitudes, it creates the basis for a steryotype, and the appreciative and deserving (meaning those who aren't scamming the system) charity patients are at risk of being lumped in with them. it's not fair, but it happens.

not sure what pacific care is, but if you pay for it, you are not at risk of getting lumped in with any group scamming the medicaid/charity system.

pacific care is a ppo. i didn't miss your point, i disagreed with it. it isn't other medicaid patients that are being done a disservice when an individual with medicaid behaves badly any more than i am being done a disservice when any other pacific care customer behaves like a donkey's patoot.

[SharonH, RN]

as much as i vent about charity patients, it is their attitude that bothers me much more than the circumstances of their insurance coverage. the medicaid patients who are rude and have this attitude that the world 'owes' them do their fellow medicaid recipients a great disservice.

i believe you when you say that it is their attitude that bothers you and others. they're just not humble enough, are they? after all if you're on medicaid or god forbid, uninsured, you darn well should be humble.....and apologetic. i'm talking hat in hand, eyes down, thank you for everything you do humble. after all, people on welfare are being supported by our tax dollars. that means that technically we own them and they should act accordingly. right?

[Cherish]

That means that technically we own them and they should act accordingly. Right?

Um PLEASE tell me that was SARCASM???

[firstyearstudent]

I have a college education and have been employed and insured most of my life in white collar jobs. Four years ago my husband was laid off from his job while I was a stay at home mom with our toddler. While my husband was scrambling to look for another full-time job while freelancing we paid for insurance through COBRA. Three months down the line were got a reimbursement check and a letter stating we were retroactively uninsured since the previous employer went belly up. In the meantime, I got pregnant.

Perhaps it is just paranoia, but I felt the medical treatment I got as a MediCal patient at a world-reknowned hospital was far below what I had experienced with my first birth. The staff seemed to treat me as if I was stupid. They were suspicious and sometimes rude -- for no reason that I could discern.

The staff who were most supportive were at the free clinic where I received my prenatal care. I remember breaking down during an early prenatal visit over the insurance issue and the doctor laughed and said, "People without insurance have a right to have babies, too."

The whole experience was very humbling and a real eye-opener.

[imenid37]

I believe you when you say that it is their attitude that bothers you and others. They're just not humble enough, are they? After all if you're on Medicaid or god forbid, uninsured, you darn well should be humble.....and apologetic. I'm talking hat in hand, eyes down, thank you for everything you do humble. After all, people on welfare are being supported by our tax dollars. That means that technically we own them and they should act accordingly. Right?

I disagree w/ what you're saying. I also would tell you that MA patients don't who have a monopoly on rude. I worked at a facility where we had many "princess" patients who were annoying and demanding. These women were wealthy and many had nannies and housekeepers at home. They didn't get it that the nurses were not on their staff. For example, I see no reason for a woman to toss a soiled sanitary pad on the floor because it is too much trouble to put it in the trash and then expect the nurse to pick it up (not because the woman can't pick it up-but because she doesn't feel like it).Our MA patients were far preferable to these "princesses".

I will say that as taxpayers, we should pay what it takes for the expectant mother to have basic, safe, comprehensive care. We shouldn't have to pay for luxuries (I mean things like massages-not medical things like epidurals). There are too many people who truly need the basics that we can't afford to cover. I get sick of hearing from some of the MA patients who complain for example, that they have to wait a long time for the doctor. ALL of the patients in our town wait a long time. They all go to the same doctors. They might think they are being singled out for having MA, but it just isn't so. I also am perplexed by the few (it is not the majority by any stretch of the imagination) who abuse MA. I had a patient several months ago who had a large family w/ older kids involved in sports, dance, and cheerleading. The mom told me they spend hundreds of dollars every month on these activities. If they have hundreds to spend on all of these luxuries, then I ask what about having some health insurance, not having free medical care meant for folks who really need it. Most people on MA need it, there is no doubt about it. It is just as true that there are a certain small percentage of people who walk in covered w/ bling who are abusing the generousity of the system. As a taxpayer and a nurse, I am frustrated by this, as are many others. No one owns another, to say that is just silly. I don't think MA patients should be humble, they should be reasonable as should all patients. The healthcare system is really overloaded. It is absurd when you have someone who thinks it is all about them.

[StNeotser, ASN, RN]

I'm not that sure that's what SharonH was saying.

I don't really care how patients are funded, though some obviously do. Probably because I came from a country that had National Health Insurance.

Why I vent is because we get no support from management when a patient is just rude.

I took care of a man over the weekend who told me I didn't understand English when he kept pointing and flapping his hands towards things; for example, pointing towards the over bed table meant he either wanted a kleenex, glass of water or his radio turned on. He could speak perfectly, A&O x 3.

He also had full use of his hands, though had a pelvic fx. When I gave him his hand held nebulizer he wanted me to put it in his mouth, v. him taking it from my hand. The table was right where his hands were, and pain level was at a 1 on 1-10 scale. I will vent here about that type of patient, for that is the type of patient that gets nurses written up for no good reason. I am not mocking this patient, just irked by him.

He also had plenty to say about me, I was too short (in height), I had no command of English, (I am English) why was my hair in front of my eyes, you get the picture.

[adnstudent2007]

I understand that most of the "venting" posts are from excellent nurses who just need to let off a little steam (and some of them are pretty funny). However, there are some that I feel cross a line. I have had alot of experience with nurses (due to personal experience and also at my clinicals)--most of which was very positive and made me want to become a nurse. But there have been a few made me really wonder why they are nurses (grouchy, disrespectful to patients etc). A patient may not realize that they are asking a question you think is a no-brainer, and they don't know you already were asked it many times that day. Those nurses also left a lasting imprint on me. I know everyone has bad days and you shouldn't judge them on one day, but I also wonder when I read some of the really negative posts on those threads, if the nurses are not as good at hiding their feelings as they think they are.

Also, I don't understand why it seems like its okay to vent about patients, but if you vent about the venting, its not.

[SharonH, RN]

Um PLEASE tell me that was SARCASM???

Yes. The entire post was sarcasm.

I disagree w/ what you're saying. I also would tell you that MA patients don't who have a monopoly on rude.

Actually you and I are on the same page. My post was an over the top response directed at those who feel that medicaid or charity patients in particular seem to have an "attitude" problem. My suspicion is not that these patients have a sense of entitlement but that to the gripers, they have an attitude which is out of proportion to their life circumstance. In other words, who are they to ask for anything those who have nothing?

My position is the same as yours. Rude is rude. Patients in general have a Burger King approach to healthcare which is the belief that they can have it their way in 5 minutes or less. This attitude is encouraged by hospital administration and management. No need to single out so-called charity patients.