Alternative to AA?

dirtyhippiegirl, BSN, RN · Oct 21, 2016

I am not a fan of mandated AA but it's not really a fight I want to pick, either. They have Atheist/Agnostic AA meetings that reword the steps a bit. There is also a version of AA based off secular Buddhist teachings. (One Breath At A Time is a good book on that.)

There are secular group alternatives to AA but they aren't as prevalent. SMART, LifeRing, Refuge Recovery.

I went to the guy who runs my state's program and he is fine with alternative versions of AA. I never asked about alternative versions of AA...realistically there wouldn't be enough meetings in my area to meet my program requirements.

sallyrnrrt, ADN, RN · Oct 22, 2016

Your higher power could be anything, As 110 electrical outlet, I'm serious

dirtyhippiegirl, BSN, RN · Oct 22, 2016

Your higher power could be anything, As 110 electrical outlet, I'm serious

That's disingenuous at best. The most succinct response (I'm on my phone ya'all) being that if Atheists and Agnostics were comfortable praying to doorknobs - which is advice that open non-believers get by the bushel in a meeting, ever - they wouldn't have felt the need to form splinter groups that reword the steps, take the serenity and lord's prayer out of a meeting, and focus on adjunct literature like Sober Living.

Meriwhen, ASN, BSN, MSN, RN · Oct 23, 2016

Hi all! I was wondering what your take was on being an atheist and being mandated to 12 step meetings. I am open minded but are there secular groups? Thanks!

The Higher Power is whatever YOU determine it to be. For many people, it's God, but it doesn't have to be a religious deity or spirit. There is no right or wrong answer to the Higher Power question--it's whatever means something to you.

That being said, SMART Recovery is the most common alternative I think of. It is cognitive-based, so those who are uncomfortable with the idea of a Higher Power may find SMART more comfortable.

CattyWampus · Oct 23, 2016

Some areas offer Buddhist 12 step programs...and Buddha is NOT a diety; Buddhism is a philosophy not a religion.

catsmeow1972, BSN, RN · Oct 23, 2016

I personally do not like the idea of being mandated to something with religious overtones to keep my state issued license. i just think there is something very wrong with it. It does not even have anything to do my own religious convictions. This business of "well your higher power can be a doorknob" is utterly ridiculous.

I go because i have to go. I have nothing useful to contribute. My personal opinion of the whole 12 step methodology notwithstanding, I find my being there by force to be insulting to the people for whom that is a lifeline. All i do is warm a chair, in the back or corner, admittedly read a book and scoot out as soon as I can without being obviously rude.

Yeah granted we can do anything that constitutes a support group, but there is nothing in my area that has the subject matter for my issue.

i feel like the mandate of 12 step meetings as a contract stipulation forces a methodology onto someone for whom it may not even remotely be relevant, merely because, like much of these programs, it's easier to dump a person into a generic set of stipulations. That way there's no need to spend the time (or $$$) to consider what might do the person the most good.

CattyWampus · Oct 23, 2016

I agree -- there's something wrong with a State Board giving an imperative directive to attend a spiritual program. And AA will definitely tell you it is a SPIRITUAL (not religious) program. While everyone at AA talks about their "higher power," quite frankly, many of them then go on to talk about God, Jesus, church, etc. Which is not to say I'm not a believer, myself ... I just don't think the STATE should insist on it. I went mentally ballistic yesterday when at a discussion meeting someone said "Nothing in this world happens that is not part of God's plan." Oh, really, the 9-month old that was raped to death by a grown man is part of God's plan? Ain't buying it nor do I want a God like that.

Graduatenurse14 · Oct 23, 2016

I feel very strongly that the courts (or administrative law entity like the BON) should NOT mandate anyone to attend anything that has spiritual overtones. It's fundamentally wrong but I'm not sure it's going to change anytime soon. At the very least give all of the options so there is something for everyone.

BTW, for those who want a truly Christian-based program, there is Celebrate Recovery.

catsmeow1972, BSN, RN · Oct 23, 2016

I hear ya, about the "God's plan" issue. Even my mother (who is a priest, ironically) snorts at the whole "spiritual, not religious" crap. I wonder if whoever coined the "spiritual, not religious" word salad, even knows the difference. According to Roget's thesaurus, "spiritual" and "religious" are synonyms.

Okay, i'll stop with the grammar policing now....

FolksBtrippin, BSN, RN · Oct 23, 2016

AA should be a choice. The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. That means you choose, someone else doesn't choose for you. Because of the whole "desire" part.

If you don't fulfill this requirement, you aren't a member. A drunk person who wants to stop drinking fulfills the requirement. A currently sober person who has no intentions to stop drinking but has to go to meetings to keep a professional license is not a member.

If you do not want to stop drinking, you should go to open meetings only, out of respect for the members.

If you do want to stop drinking, then don't worry about the steps. The steps are things that happen or don't, and there is no requirement to fulfill them, or to get them done in some amount of time, or any of that. You could be a member for 50 years, and only do the first step or not even really ever complete the first step. And that would be absolutely fine.

The idea of a higher power doesn't even come into play until the second step.

Why worry about that before you do the first step, or even decide that you are a member?

First decide whether you are a member (that you have a desire to stop drinking) or just a visitor getting requirements in. Either is fine. Just decide and then attend only open or both open and closed meetings as necessary.

If you are not a member, that is all you need to do.

If you ARE a member, it might be time to think about the first step. The first step is: 1. Admitted we were powerless over alcohol-- that our lives had become unmanageable. That is a big thing to happen. You can want to stop drinking and still not think that you are powerless over alcohol and that your life has become unmanageable. If that has happened for you, then you are ready to think about the second step. If not, no problem. Just keep going to meetings and see what happens. Maybe you will never get there, that is okay. As long as you have a desire to stop drinking you are on track. It could take 30 years and that is fine. You could die before the first step happens for you and that is fine also.

No need to believe in God. No need to pretend to believe anything at all. Best wishes!

catsmeow1972, BSN, RN · Oct 23, 2016

I agree with all of the above. My gripe is with the standard boilerplate set of stipulations. I don't and never have drank (can't even gag the stuff the down). and do not do drugs. I cannot "have the desire" to stop doing something I don't do in the first place. Essentially I am forced to attend meetings in a "club" for which I am not a member and don't even meet the qualifications for membership.As I've said before, i feel my presence is an insult to the people who want to be there.

AA (or other incarnations of 12 step things) are what they are and are great for some folks, but the legal (court ordered) and contract ordered stuff is inappropriate and an abuse of the AA, etc. system. Just my opinion.