I was at work a couple evenings ago and had a resident continue to ask for toilet paper, which is a common behavior for her. I went into her room and saw that she had a full roll and I advised her that she had enough for the evening and that once I found someone in housekeeping (they keep the toilet paper locked up) that I would get her more. She continued to argue that she needed more right now and I kept explaining that I was unable to get her more right now. She began to literally scream that she wanted more toilet paper and was making a huge scene in the hallway.
I charted on the behavior and was very detailed in it, making sure I stated that I went to her room to ensure that she had enough toilet paper, and that I assured her that I would get her more once I saw someone from housekeeping. I stated in my charting that she was yelling and that since we could not get her to calm down using reassurance, we began to ignore the BEHAVIOR (not her).
I was told by my DON and administrator that they have to turn that in for potential abuse, and now I am absolutely freaking out that I’m going to lose my license. Has anyone ever had to deal with anything like this? I’m in Illinois. I’ve only been a nurse for 2 years. I really hope I didn’t just ruin my career
Specializes in Psych (25 years), Medical (15 years).
11 hours ago, summertx said:
I would not speak to your DON or administrator, avoid them at all costs, keep a low profile and try to get out of there.
I was also suspended, with pay, back in '98 for insubordination, while employed at a community mental health facility.
Basically, I felt harassed by two supervisors during a meeting. I stated, "I can't take this right now". One of the supervisors said, "You will take this right now!" I got up and walked out.
I was informed shortly thereafter that I was suspended with pay until further notice. I asked, "With pay?!" and when that fact was affirmed, I said, "I'm outta here!"
I did seek the advice from an in-law who was a lawyer. My presence was requested at a meeting with the assistant administrator of the facility, and I asked the lawyer if I should attend. He advised me to attend the meeting, say as little as possible, and take notes.
One interesting statement the admin said during the meeting, while I was taking notes, was, "...and you can also tell your lawyer..."
All's well that ends well, as I received full pay and benefits during my eight-working day suspension. I was also given a new position in the facility, of which I had previously applied, under a different supervisor.
In the problem-solving process, the second step is to gather data. If we learn what the opposition has in mind, it better prepares us for dealing with the situation. The unknown can be terrifying, as it leaves us to our imagination for what will come.
I again respectfully disagree with the avoidance technique. If we gather data, thereby a feeling of power, we can more comfortably deal with any situation more lucratively. However, we need to avoid giving any subjective information, just the objective facts. That is one reason why I suggested writing everything about the incident down- to be better prepared for what will come.
I have actually texted my administrator twice now, once Saturday and once today, and he has not replied to me. I feel I have the right to stay in the loop, but maybe I’m wrong .
he did text me on Friday and said “everything will be alright”, but I don’t know what that is supposed to mean .
according to another nurse that works there, state has been called several times recently, so they are trying to cover themselves. They’ve even had a couple IJ tags.
Specializes in Psych (25 years), Medical (15 years).
I hadn't thought about texting, Jess, as that resource was not available when I dealt with my situations. Texting is good in the sense that there is documentation of communication. Texting could be counterproductive if not objective, thereby open to interpretation.
I may be splitting hairs here, but this is an essence of my approach: I avoid using the word "feel" unless it pertains to matters of the heart. Feelings are emotional and usually not based in logic.
If I believe something is objectively factual, I don't even use the word "believe". Hence my statement might read, "I have a right to stay in the loop". End of story.
"Everything will be alright" is reassuring and can be used to an advantage. A request to expand upon that statement would be an appropriate maneuver. This is a technique to keep the others on their toes and on the defense, as they have to support their statements. More information can be obtained, which is, again, an advantage.
I, too, have been written up over a facility attempting to cover themselves and lived to tell the tale.
OP, I can’t advice you one way or the other. I don’t work nor do I live in the U.S. But I noticed that you are receiving conflicting suggestions regarding the situation you’ve found yourself in. First of all, I’m sorry this is happening. I imagine that it’s stressful.
Looking at the two different courses of action that have been voiced here, I’m trying to think of the consequences if you follow one of them and they turn out to be the wrong choice. If you contact a lawyer and it turns out you didn’t need one, I would assume that the damage done would be primarily financial? Unless you have some type of insurance that allows you to consult one at no or low cost? Or is there some other potential drawback that I’m not seeing? If you don’t consult one and it turns out that doing so could have been helpful, then I guess that could possibly have career implications?
Since I can’t really contribute much at all in the way of advice, I hope that I haven’t just managed to confuse you. The point I’m trying to make I guess is that you need to weigh your options, compare upsides and downsides, and choose whatever course of action that makes the most sense to you and your situation.
Best wishes and I hope the situation resolves itself soon!
On 1/8/2022 at 3:36 PM, Davey Do said:
I've gone as far as telling a patient something along the lines of, "If you continue this behavior, you are persona non gratia to me. And unless you're bleeding from one or more offices, you don't exist to me".
"Desperate times..."
Davey Do, did you actually say things like this to your patients or is this for dramatic effect? I honestly can’t think of any situation where I think it would be appropriate or acceptable for a nurse to tell their patient that unless they start bleeding from one or several orifices, they don’t exist. Was your employer really okay with their employed healthcare professionals addressing patients like this?
I hadn't thought about texting, Jess, as that resource was not available when I dealt with my situations. Texting is good in the sense that there is documentation of communication. Texting could be counterproductive if not objective, thereby open to interpretation.
I may be splitting hairs here, but this is an essence of my approach: I avoid using the word "feel" unless it pertains to matters of the heart. Feelings are emotional and usually not based in logic.
If I believe something is objectively factual, I don't even use the word "believe". Hence my statement might read, "I have a right to stay in the loop". End of story.
"Everything will be alright" is reassuring and can be used to an advantage. A request to expand upon that statement would be an appropriate maneuver. This is a technique to keep the others on their toes and on the defense, as they have to support their statements. More information can be obtained, which is, again, an advantage.
I, too, have been written up over a facility attempting to cover themselves and lived to tell the tale.
BTW:What is IJ?
IJ is “immediate Jeopardy” which is apparently the worst of all tags to get
Specializes in Psych (25 years), Medical (15 years).
Thanks for the info, Jess.
I also wondered if a complaint has been filed with OIG-the Office of Inspector General. This would be assuredly done if a state hospital were involved, yet probably not with a non-governmentally funded facility.
I again respectfully disagree with the avoidance technique. If we gather data, thereby a feeling of power, we can more comfortably deal with any situation more lucratively. However, we need to avoid giving any subjective information, just the objective facts. That is one reason why I suggested writing everything about the incident down- to be better prepared for what will come.
LTC's, or psych facilities are shady places. When the DON and administrator mentions abuse, the nurse will get thrown under the bus. The OP's facility has many IJ tags, that means shadiness from the top down.
Also, as for the term BON, or state department of health, whatever you choose, they're all regulatory agencies.
Specializes in Peds/outpatient FP,derm,allergy/private duty.
I'm sorry this is happening to you, Jess. Over the years I have seen nursing become more and more punitive with regards to write-ups, suspensions, threats of reports to the BON for abandonment when the real issue is short-staffing, the attitude toward medication errors, reporting to any or all governing bodies for relatively minor or common incidents, etc and I just wonder if I would choose this for my life's work if the atmosphere was then like it is today.
Can't give official advice, either. But I am 99.9999% sure that I would be finding a different place to work unless this place was my only option for not being homeless.
Pardon my language but in my book this is a 'F around and find out' situation. These people do know that this is not abuse, it is not the kind of scenario where a patient needs to be protected from someone, no one is in danger because of this falsely accused nurse. Them reporting this is not covering their hiney on a single freaking thing, because there IS nothing here.
Well, I just won't be toyed with like that. I would be out of there. With proper timing of course. Like after I was cleared.
Davey Do
10,666 Posts
Acting on common sense to one can be viewed as an exercise in futility to another.