Why do nurses constantly say they don't hire ASN?

Nursing Students ADN/BSN

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OK this is funny because every Magnet hospital I go to someone who doesn't work in HR or is NOT a hiring Manager just has to say they don't hire Associate Degree nurses. I have been asked to be hired at some other Magnet hospitals. Reasons like this, bullying, bad staffing, etc. have made me just complete my assignment and go to the next one. I started liking working where I am now, at a Magnet hospital, probably one of the ones who started the trend. It came up as a discussion because my contract was extended after only two weeks of starting. Then a couple of nurses who were overhearing the conversation said I would never get hired due to my lame degree status. Le sigh... :no: Some of the ASNs themselves. Just for the record. I am a 8 year experienced ASN with great references so it isn't like I am new at this kind of thing.

It just doesn't happen there, I have seen nurses do it on here to others. It is harder to get in I guess, but when you have experience it isn't so hard. At least for me. I am not sure about a New Grads, but hey what do I know. Maybe in the universe there is a New Grad ASN out there who did get hired with persistence at these Magnet hospitals! Especially, if they are enrolled or attending a BSN program.

Listen unless if you are not a hiring person don't say this. Why? I just don't understand it. Does it make you feel better? If someone has an Associate's Degree gets hire in a Magnet hospital, is willing to upgrade their education status, what they heck is it to you?

Just a rant I guess. Hopefully, this will be the last stop so I can continue on with my education. But, I won't ever be like, "They don't hire your kind here." :sarcastic:

This topic has more moving targets than a U-Boat hunting an convoy, and truth be told only those in charge of setting hiring policy know the *real* deal behind BSN preferences or mandates. Everyone else simply takes their marching orders from there and moves onwards."

Esme12 has provided her perspective, here on this thread, as an ex hiring manager.

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*** When I was a kid my mom never accepted the "everybody else was doing it" argument whenever I was caught doing something stupid. Her standard response was "if everybody else was jumping off a cliff would do it too?".

My mother and myself also say the same thing; sadly neither of us are in the position of making employment decisions or policies for a major hospital or anyplace else for that matter.

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
My mother and myself also say the same thing; sadly neither of us are in the position of making employment decisions or policies for a major hospital or anyplace else for that matter.

*** Speak for yourself.

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*** Speak for yourself.

Ok, I did say neither of *us*, how much more specific does one have to get? *LOL*

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Specializes in They know this too!.

Lol wow...

I guess most of the answers speak for themselves. Still no right or wrong answer IMO.

Sorry, I did not mean to start a ASN and BSN war on who is better then who based on Statistics. Blah... that isn't what this topic was about.

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Specializes in Pediatrics, Emergency, Trauma.
Lol wow...

I guess most of the answers speak for themselves. Sorry to bust bubbles... No matter what emails, letters, or telephone tree rumors you have heard from your CEOs and Administrators they are still hiring ASNs at Magnets x2,3, and 4s.. Lol. We aren't getting the WHOLE story. Just like many topics in this world. I am not sure why they have to or want to flabbergast it for.

Sorry, I did not mean to start a ASN and BSN war on who is better then who based on Statistics. Blah... that isn't what this topic was about.

The issue, for me, is that HR recruiters ARE telling people who are new grad ASNs they are NOT hiring nurses with associate degrees. Many of the community hospitals that are affiliated with a particular Magnet hospital is not hiring BSNs AT ALL. Our of the dozen hospitals in my metro area-there were at least 50% more hospitals about 15 years ago, until the unfortunate corporate take over of healthcare reared its ugly head- there are only THREE that will not take an individual with a BSN over one with an ASN, and one is a Magnet Hospital with an ADN program, the other is a non-Magnet hospital and has a DN nursing program as well.

I was at a career fair last year...not many appearing because of the economy. There were about 800 in line for a particular Magnet Hospital, because of their reputed new grad and transition programs. 200 were ADNs, a few groups came together...I witnessed the last 25 in line with me be informed that they are not hiring ADNs UNLESS they are enrolled in a BSN program and have at least two years experience...they are welcome to join their transitional program after they get experience.

It may be due to the market in my area, but there is no love for new grads, but ADNs get treated like the proverbial stepchild...just outright neglect-no LOVE for them.

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Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.
Where does it say that hospitals will be required to pay for all tuition if their current RN's are mandated to get a BSN by 2020? Would like to know more? I sure don't want to go back to school and take out student loan debt when I'm near retirement!

It's a federal fair wage and labor law....that once established in a position the employer cannot "mandate" more and more education of the employee to maintain the same position with out that education being paid for by the employer.

Call the Labor Board or your states attorney General. Yes that includes ACLS...I fought it one because a facility made me angry and they had to pay back all the monies they took from employees for MANY years.....they didn't like me much after that.....:sarcastic:. What they do now is "make it " a requirement before you get hired or to make you more "competitive" is truly to not have to pay for it themselves.

To "advance" your position that is different. They also cannot take away your license once you are an RN you have passed the licensing exam you are an RN.

This is why so many attempts in the past have failed ...... how would the economy tolerate the closing of all these other schools......what would these schools do? Sue the boards for this.

I believe that someday it may come....but not in the foreseeable future. Do you need the BSN in the furture to advance these days....I'm going to say ...yes.

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Specializes in CVICU.

A BSN is a stepping stone to grad school and nothing more. There is no reason to spend the money on a BSN unless you want grad school or an admin position. It's a real shame that nursing is pushing this garbage as if to say that a BSN prepared nurse is somehow more qualified or able to actually take care of patients than an ADN nurse. Complete garbage.

TX911, NREMT-P, RN, BSN, CCRN-CMC-CSC

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I'm in a very different boat than most. I already have my bachelors in biology. Im about to start an ADN program. I'm pretty sure that I will not go off to get my BSN, instead I'm going to jump straight to a MSN when the time comes. I refuse to invest in a year long program that makes me a BSN. In reality this makes no sense. Both programs take 4 years essentially (prereqs and major courses). The point of taking another year long program to be at the same standard and same level as a person with a BSN in which the same core subjects are being taught just baffles me.

I think it's great that nursing is establish itself with an actually BS, but I don't think it's doing much good. It isn't the the degree that makes the good nurse, it's what's being taught in courses and in clinicals that counts. The debate shouldn't be BSN vs ADN, it should be the course standards to get into nursing school and what's being taught in classrooms.

I don't regret getting my bachelors in biology, I think the classes I took and what I learned is going to help me become a better nurse and one day a better NP. I took the same prereqs as MDs, DOs, PharmDs and DMDs.

From what I see it's the name of the degree that's changing not the standards or what is being taught that changes? How can that be taken seriously? I'm not hating on Bsns, they worked hard, it's not them it's the nursing association that's the problem. You can't sell a BSN if the same main subjects are being taught in an ADN program.

Change the standards. You want MDs to take NP programs seriously, you want them to take bed side nurses seriously, then offer the science courses to back it up. Show them. That we belong not because we are not only needed but because we have the knowledge to back it up.

Yes I might not know much, but this is what I've observed and seen.

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
I'm in a very different boat than most. I already have my bachelors in biology. Im about to start an ADN program.

*** Actually i think that is pretty standard. All of the ADN students who have come to precept with me have all had previous backelors degrees. According to the instructor who I cordinate with about half of their ADN students have bachelors or masters degrees. One of my last students had a bachelors and masters in architecture. My current student has 2 bachelors degrees in chemistry and spanish from U of Minnesota. Boggels my mind that all these educated people want to be nurses but I don't think you are different than most.

I'm pretty sure that I will not go off to get my BSN, instead I'm going to jump straight to a MSN when the time comes.

*** Exactly. Why bother with the BSN if you can jump strait to MSN.

I refuse to invest in a year long program that makes me a BSN. In reality this makes no sense.

*** I agree, however you could likely do it in 6 months.

Both programs take 4 years essentially (prereqs and major courses). The point of taking another year long program to be at the same standard and same level as a person with a BSN in which the same core subjects are being taught just baffles me.

*** Just as I am baffeled by people with degrees in biology and chemistry and many other things who want to become RNs.

I think it's great that nursing is establish itself with an actually BS, but I don't think it's doing much good. It isn't the the degree that makes the good nurse, it's what's being taught in courses and in clinicals that counts.

*** Far more than that where you spend your first couple years an an RN counts.

I don't regret getting my bachelors in biology, I think the classes I took and what I learned is going to help me become a better nurse and one day a better NP. I took the same prereqs as MDs, DOs, PharmDs and DMDs.

*** Just curious, why choose nurisng rather than one of those other fields you mentioned above?

Change the standards. You want MDs to take NP programs seriously, you want them to take bed side nurses seriously, then offer the science courses to back it up. Show them.

*** Our practice is NOT about earning physician's respect. I could give a darn about physician's opinions. I have been in nursing long enough to know that most of them do not deserve the exaulted position they hold in our society. The meanest, most petty, lazy, uncaring people I have ever met where physicians. (obviously lots of great ones out there too). That said there is no problem with a lack of physician respect for bedside nurses and NPs. Not in the real world. A shift never seems to go by when a physicians doesn't ask my opinion or for my help.

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*** Actually i think that is pretty standard. All of the ADN students who have come to precept with me have all had previous backelors degrees. According to the instructor who I cordinate with about half of their ADN students have bachelors or masters degrees. One of my last students had a bachelors and masters in architecture. My current student has 2 bachelors degrees in chemistry and spanish from U of Minnesota. Boggels my mind that all these educated people want to be nurses but I don't think you are different than most.

*** Exactly. Why bother with the BSN if you can jump strait to MSN.

*** I agree, however you could likely do it in 6 months.

*** Just as I am baffeled by people with degrees in biology and chemistry and many other things who want to become RNs.

*** Far more than that where you spend your first couple years an an RN counts.

*** Just curious, why choose nurisng rather than one of those other fields you mentioned above?

*** Our practice is NOT about earning physician's respect. I could give a darn about physician's opinions. I have been in nursing long enough to know that most of them do not deserve the exaulted position they hold in our society. The meanest, most petty, lazy, uncaring people I have ever met where physicians. (obviously lots of great ones out there too). That said there is no problem with a lack of physician respect for bedside nurses and NPs. Not in the real world. A shift never seems to go by when a physicians doesn't ask my opinion or for my help.

I'm not well versed in terms of what is really going on with people jumping into nursing. I never meant to say that nurses are trying to gain the respect of others, what I meant was the ANA in its mission to push the BSN and DNP and NP. They can't sell the concept of "it's the same but better" in terms of all 3, it doesn't add up. I'm not saying that NPs aren't needed or incapable of providing care. I'm not even stating that nurses should walking around begging for respect from physicians, nurses have their own merit and respect. I don't even believe MDs should be called doctors in the first place same goes for the dentists, DOs, pharmDs. If you want to be called doctor go get your PhD (my dad and I joke about this all the time, he has his PhD). I was just saying that if the ANA wants to flaunt that concept then they need to revamp things to make it so and justify it.

Idc if it took me 6 months or a year to get that BSN in conjunction with my ADN. Heck no. I will not be pushed into some scheme to make me feel degraded because I don't have a BSN. I have a bachelors in a hard science, that will do. I will have the knowledge of a nurse with an in depth knowledge of biology to apply in caring for my patients. As Bart Simpson would say they can "eat my shorts".

I chose nursing for a myriad of reasons. I love biology, love love love it. I had issues with doing research in a lab for hours with little social contact. Couldn't stand the thought. I love science I love to learn, but I wanted to use my knowledge to help people. I have always wanted to help people, I felt I couldn't do that in a lab. I had taken care of my grandmother for 10 years, she couldn't speak English, and was always in the hospital. If she was in the hospital, one of us was in the hospital with her. I have seen a lot in terms of the level of care being provided. During the last few years of her life while I was in college, she became really sick, and practically lived in the hospital or rehab unit of a LTC facility. My parents couldn't visit her as much as they would have liked too, and I was the closest to her in proximity. I used to visit her everyday and was absolutely appalled by the care she was being given by the nurses and physicians. I had one nurse hand me a printout of a medication from the manufacturers website when asked what kind of medication they were giving her, the nurse gave me no explanation handed me the sheet and walked away. If I had known that, I wouldn't have bothered asking her to kill trees. I became my grandmothers nurse while she was alive. So I know the type of care that can be given and the type of care that should be given but isn't. I'm not going to say all her nurses were bad, one of the ER nurses was amazing. She was sweet, smart, and she had her ADN too.

I ended up in the hospital for bad chest pains and my feet were oddly really cold, when I brought this up to a nurse she looked at me and said "that's a circulatory problem not a heart problem." *facepalm* Oh how wrong she was, I ended up seeing a cardiologist and was diagnosed with a type of Orthostatic intolerance that brings about chest pains, cold feet, etc. I had massive issues with the way physicians treated their patients, it disturbed me, it was just so inhumane and somewhat degrading. I felt nursing treated a person as a person and not a problem that needed to be fixed. When i started school I wanted to pursue a career as a pharmacist, I almost had my foot in the door and worked as a pharm tech for 2.5+ years and absolutely despised it. I didn't feel like I was helping people, I just typed prescriptions and made phone calls, I wasn't doing much of anything. It just wasn't enough. I wanted to be able to use science, caring, technique, and good social skills to help people, and allopathic

Medicine does not do that.

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Specializes in Management, Med/Surg, Clinical Trainer.

What is real is that an employer can ask for a higher degree. The crummy economy allows the employer to pick and choose. And often they can ask for a higher degree and get it. Period. This applies to all fields, not just nursing.

I do not think it has ever been a question of who is the better nurse. That is a divide and conquer strategy that keeps ALL of nursing from working together to achieve loftier goals --- such as better ratios or pay.

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