ADN's being pushed out

Nursing Students ADN/BSN

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I work for a large Magnet hospital. As nursing becomes more popular, and nurses not in short supply, I have noticed something ominous has being going on lately. Several of our older and very seasoned ADN nurses are being fired. The excuses for firing are ridiculous. I have sadly seen some excellent nurses lose their jobs. I am wondering if they want to get rid of the ADNs so they can look "better" with an all BSN staff. Or perhaps they want rid of older nurses who have been there longer because they are higher on the pay scale. Either way, it is very scarey. I myself am BSN, and i am not ashamed to say that what I know does not hold a candle to these fired nurses. Any thoughts?

Specializes in critical care, ER,ICU, CVSURG, CCU.

after diploma school grad. i went directly into critical care ccu, eighteen months later i was director of ER, and nurse clinician program, where i took select critical care nurses, and with enhanced physical assessment skill, taught by me and ER docs, we preformed all the ER PATIENT HISTORY abd PHYSICALS! the only time a physician saw the patient, was if we felt admission to inpatient was not warranted.......we also had them sign prescriptions for medications etc.... later i was director of ER in Wash.DC, head nurse at texas heart center st. lukes in houston, director of nursing at several LTCs..... no telling what I coukd have acheived if I had a BSN......... :yes:

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I think that we had better leadership when those at the top had already put in their time and had been a bedside nurse....and was promoted because of their experience and exemplar reputation as a nurse first that learned how to be a boss.....than someone who couldn't stand bedside nursing so they went back to school to become the boss and tell everyone what evidence based practice is even though they have never practiced the evidence.

Only those who worked during this time can truly appreciate the difference.

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When the ADN-BSN becomes something more than the ability to write papers, I may consider one. For now, my BS in another field will do as will my MBA. I had BSB embroidered on my scrubs so I can look as ridiculous as people who put BSN on theirs since nursing is the only field I know of that actually puts they have a B.S. on their title.

That 1 article that states better outcomes for BSNs can be explained by social class. ADNs with BS in another field probably have just as good as outcomes as BSNs. Things have changed since that study. When it was done, BSNs probably had better outcomes because BSNs at the time probably came from higher social class families where caring and good parenting were easier for parents because they had better resources. Today, you have ADNs such as myself that are career changers and we have BS in other fields and we came from good social class too. I'm guessing our outcomes just as good and probably better because ADNs are better clinically trained than traditional BSNs.

Nursing education has been hijacked by scholars who like to write articles, books, and hear themselves talk. ADN-BSN is the only degree I know other than journalism where writing is so important. Me, like other scientific minds don't give a toot about the ability to write a paper and I simply don't write them. I can't enter any class where a paper is more than 5% of the total grade. That way, I can get an F on the paper, and still get an A in the class. Us ADHD males hate papers.

Since 60% of new grads are ADNs, I think any hospital that accepts Medicare/Medicaid payments should be forced to hire ADNs. ADN programs are giving people a new start on life; it gave me 1 after 15 years as a pharmaceutical rep. State governments interested in training it's residents would be wise to force hospitals to abandon the useless Magnet crap and hire ADNs. Hospitals are already talking dropping magnet over cost and absolutely no increase in business. Magnet is a waste of resources.

You know, I'm going to say it. I think Magnet status is racist and I'm Caucasian. I live in Chicago burbs and when I think of all the African-American ADNs that graduated from city colleges that can't get jobs in hospitals and they're trying to better their lives. I think I figured it out.......Magnet is pure racism!

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
When the ADN-BSN becomes something more than the ability to write papers, I may consider one.

*** that will never happen.

That 1 article that states better outcomes for BSNs can be explained by social class. ADNs with BS in another field probably have just as good as outcomes as BSNs. Things have changed since that study. When it was done, BSNs probably had better outcomes because BSNs at the time probably came from higher social class families

*** I m EXTREMELY skeptical that high nurses from higher social classes are in some way better or result in lower mortality among their patients.

Nursing education has been hijacked by scholars who like to write articles, books, and hear themselves talk.

*** Yes it certainly has.

Since 60% of new grads are ADNs, I think any hospital that accepts Medicare/Medicaid payments should be forced to hire ADNs. ADN programs are giving people a new start on life; it gave me 1 after 15 years as a pharmaceutical rep.

*** We need to stop marketing nursing as a field were people can count on getting a new start in life, regardless of the number of people for whom that is true (including me). There are so many people being deliberately lured into nursing with the false and self-serving "nursing shortage" propaganda that soon it won't be able to offer that new start in life. That of course IS the goal of those putting out the false propaganda.

You know, I'm going to say it. I think Magnet status is racist and I'm Caucasian. I live in Chicago burbs and when I think of all the African-American ADNs that graduated from city colleges that can't get jobs in hospitals and they're trying to better their lives. I think I figured it out.......Magnet is pure racism!

*** Yes Magnet is useless and the good news is that hospitals are already starting to drop it. However since Magnet DOES NOT require hospitals to hire only BSN grads, or any percentage of BSN grads and never has for staff nurses (geeze that myth just won't die).

If anything the push for BSN and entry to practice isn't racist, it's sexist. The vast majority of males entry nursing through ADN programs. Think how many of those pesky male nurses we could eliminate if we got ride of their primary way for them to enter the field.

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Specializes in Adult Internal Medicine.

Actually males are fairly evenly distributed across program types, unless you have different from what I have seen. The only reason I know this is because I was writing a paper for publication and needed hard numbers for the number of men in DE programs, which anecdotally, I believed was higher than other program types. Turns out its fairly even across the board.

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I think the push for BSN has much more to do with nursing still getting it's footing as a profession in its own right. There are still arguments that nursing is not a profession but just a job or career because it does not require a higher level of education. It lends more credibility to the field to require a BSN. I am not saying I agree with the viewpoint but I can understand it and it is what I have run into. I only recently went back to school for my BSN and am already finding that I have more job opportunities. When I was originally applying (as an ADN), I found new grads with a BSN being hired rather than an experienced nurse with an ADN.

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I think the push for BSN has much more to do with nursing still getting it's footing as a profession in its own right. There are still arguments that nursing is not a profession but just a job or career because it does not require a higher level of education. It lends more credibility to the field to require a BSN. I am not saying I agree with the viewpoint but I can understand it and it is what I have run into. I only recently went back to school for my BSN and am already finding that I have more job opportunities. When I was originally applying (as an ADN), I found new grads with a BSN being hired rather than an experienced nurse with an ADN.

Debate over nursing as a true profession has more fires than just education, being as that may nursing is already considered such in it's own right. Profession - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

However to a certain extent some do argue how true a profession nursing really is since it does lack many of the qualifications found elsewhere.

The most obvious is a single pathway to entry; professional nursing in the USA has three (diploma, ADN and BSN). Another is the level of autonomy especially for nurses below the graduate degree level.

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
Debate over nursing as a true profession has more fires than just education, being as that may nursing is already considered such in it's own right. Profession - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

However to a certain extent some do argue how true a profession nursing really is since it does lack many of the qualifications found elsewhere.

The most obvious is a single pathway to entry; professional nursing in the USA has three (diploma, ADN and BSN). Another is the level of autonomy especially for nurses below the graduate degree level.

*** There are at least 5 paths of entry to RN practice. If we only had one path would nurses no longer punch time clocks like ordinary factory workers?

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*** There are at least 5 paths of entry to RN practice. If we only had one path would nurses no longer punch time clocks like ordinary factory workers?

Probably not which goes back to the autonomy question. Hospitals and or healthcare facilities exert no small amount of control over the nursing profession, both directly and indirectly.

Case in point at least here in NY would be the near total demise of diploma programs and recent push in parts of the state to make the BSN almost de facto requirement.

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
Probably not which goes back to the autonomy question. Hospitals and or healthcare facilities exert no small amount of control over the nursing profession, both directly and indirectly.

Case in point at least here in NY would be the near total demise of diploma programs and recent push in parts of the state to make the BSN almost de facto requirement.

*** If we only had one path to entry to RN practice would we have more autonomy? In my experience those RNs with the greatest autonomy are the least likely to be have BSNs or MSNs, namely RRT and transport nurses.

NY isn't the center of the world, nor is it a trend setter in nursing.

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Specializes in Oncology; medical specialty website.

I'm looking at RN-BSN completion programs. I graduated from a diploma program, which makes me even more undesirable. I called one program and the person I talked to told me I wasn't an RN since I graduated from a diploma program. "You're an LPN and we don't accept LPNs." Eh, no I really am an RN and have been one for nearly 30 years. Guess which program I didn't pick?

(Before someone suggests it, no, this is no swipe at LPNs.)

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
I'm looking at RN-BSN completion programs. I graduated from a diploma program, which makes me even more undesirable. I called one program and the person I talked to told me I wasn't an RN since I graduated from a diploma program. "You're an LPN and we don't accept LPNs." Eh, no I really am an RN and have been one for nearly 30 years. Guess which program I didn't pick?

(Before someone suggests it, no, this is no swipe at LPNs.)

*** Wow! Amazing that a school with a nursing program would have such an idiot answering their phone.

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