The Right to Die with Dignity- MD assisted suicide

Nurses Activism

Published

  1. Physician-assisted suicide is...

    • Allowable for the competent terminally ill.
    • Allowable for all competent people.
    • Allowable for all terminally ill and vegetative (decision can be made by family or patient if the patient is competent).
    • Never allowable.
    • Not Sure.

50 members have participated

With the recent ruling in New Mexico to allow physician assisted suicide for the mentally competent terminally ill, it made me wonder current views on physician assisted suicide. I found a topic on this from 2007, but a lot changes in 7 years.

I personally believe that every person has the fundamental right to choose if they want to die. As a nurse I would refuse to administer the medication but that is because I don't want to be responsible. As a future NP I would also refuse to prescribe it (for one because I think that's way out of an NP's scope) because I would not want the moral liability.

As far as suicide being a sin: What is a "sin" is determined by each individual person, and is between them and G-d. No one should be forced to suffer.

I wish there was a way to make it available to the incompetent also, patients who are in a persistent vegetative state or severely debilitated... I think PAS is much more humane than pulling someone's G-Tube and letting them starve to death... But that's just me.

What do you think?

Specializes in CRNA, Finally retired.

HBO did a documentary "How to Die in Oregon." Maybe it's still around. Highly recommend .

Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
Wow... That is not the response I would have given. I assume you have never seen a failed suicide attempt in the ICU before? I have seen many and they are very, very ugly. I'd say ONE person out of the 20-25 I've seen turned out okay (as in still functional). Every other one either died after being mechanically supported for weeks (prolonging their suffering and the suffering of their family) or ended up with SEVERE brain damage or disabilities. I'd especially never tell someone "just take all of your pills"... It's very common for that type of attempted suicide to fail... I've also seen failed self inflicted gun shot wounds and hangings fail, so awful.... So incredibly awful. An effective alternative should be available to those who wish to die... Definitely for the terminally ill.

So is your issue the fact that PAS is "euthanasia" or because "the person is including someone else in their decision"... They are very different reasons for being against it...

I've never worked in the ER, never seen what you've seen. I have worked in hematology and oncology, and have been quite liberal with the pain medication, even knowing it was shortening someone's life. I have no problem with that. As long as I can truthfully document that I was giving the pain medication for PAIN. Euthanasia is illegal -- I'm not doing that. I HAVE seen the aftermath of that, and the legal consequences.

As I've said before, I think everyone has the right to die in order to end their suffering -- but I don't think they have the right to suck someone else into that decision or that act. The patient DIES. The helper will have to live with it for the rest of their life. Some can, quite easily. Some cannot.

The problem with legalizing physician assisted suicide is that some health care workers -- physicians and nurses -- who aren't really comfortable with the process are going to be bulldozed into getting with the program. And I cannot support that.

Specializes in LTC.

Just recently I read an article, I think in the newspaper. It was about a woman's choice to end her life by simply stopping eating and drinking. She had a form of brain disease and she didn't want to live her life out in a nursing home. She chose to stop eating and drinking. Life ended for her about 2 weeks later. Her husband kept her at home and she died quite peacefully. As a nurse I don't think I could give meds that would end one's life, however I would have no problem caring for someone like the above describes. Just my 2 cents.

Specializes in Emergency/Cath Lab.

As I've said before, I think everyone has the right to die in order to end their suffering -- but I don't think they have the right to suck someone else into that decision or that act. The patient DIES. The helper will have to live with it for the rest of their life. Some can, quite easily. Some cannot.

What is so bad about patients dying if they want to?

I am 100% for it. If I was terminal I would want that option as part of my care plan. I would want a doctor to order the medicine a caring nurse to start an IV and hang the medicine and if and when I chose to pus the button I would. I also would have no issues inserting an IV in a patient and hanging the meds for my patient to do the same thing. How long does any human have to suffer? Why do we humans love our pets more than we do each other? Everyday people put their pets who they have stated was close as family , down due to the pain and suffering the animal was in. So why do we want anyone to prolong an inevitable death and ensure they will suffer until they pass? I guess the closest thing we have is hospice as they will keep the patient heavily medicated, and if that person is that medicated what quality of life do they have? Why not let them push a button say goodbye and be done?

Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
What is so bad about patients dying if they want to?

Nothing. As long as they don't drag anyone else into it.

Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
I am 100% for it. If I was terminal I would want that option as part of my care plan. I would want a doctor to order the medicine a caring nurse to start an IV and hang the medicine and if and when I chose to pus the button I would. I also would have no issues inserting an IV in a patient and hanging the meds for my patient to do the same thing. How long does any human have to suffer? Why do we humans love our pets more than we do each other? Everyday people put their pets who they have stated was close as family , down due to the pain and suffering the animal was in. So why do we want anyone to prolong an inevitable death and ensure they will suffer until they pass? I guess the closest thing we have is hospice as they will keep the patient heavily medicated, and if that person is that medicated what quality of life do they have? Why not let them push a button say goodbye and be done?

You cannot explain to a pet that they're in pain because they have cancer of the spine, and that's why they can't move their hind legs or control their bowels. You can't tell them that their case is hopeless and they cannot ever get better; they'll never run again or even walk to your side to lick your hand. They cannot make decisions for themselves about ending their suffering and their lives; they trust us to do that for them.

Grandma can receive and understand the explanation that her cancer is inoperable and she won't get better. If she wants her suffering to end, she can figure out how to end it. She has that right. And that capacity for thinking. But I'm not convinced that she has the right to involve anyone else in the end of her life. *I* certainly don't want to be involved with euthanizing Grandma, so how can I be in favor of Physician Assisted Suicide? That would be saying that it's fine for someone else to do, but not OK for me.

Specializes in Oncology/Haemetology/HIV.
If you believe that PAS is "euthanasia" then the poll answer that fits your stance is: Physician Assisted Suicide is "never allowable"... So if someone "decides" or "processes" that they would like to end their life and their suffering what would be your recommendation to those people?

There are any number of resources at their disposal. There are books, organized groups, internet groups, as well as clandestine providers of such activities. There is a well known book that was national available in the 1980s with actual "recipes" for killing oneself. And as an oncology nurse who previously worked in HIV nursing, I have known of several patients, a few caregivers, and at least one acutely ill and depressed fellow nurse that have utilized those. "Solutions" at home.

We will not discuss the incredible amount of moral distress that staff felt from this deaths. I suspect that in some cases the caregiver died partially from guilt at assisting the loved one. As such, I do not wish this visited on my fellow healthcare providers, because I feel many would be guilted into providing services that do not believe are right and ethical, if it is authorized into law. It blows apart, "First Do No Harm".

If one wishes to decriminalize suicide (it is indeed a criminal act in many places) for the terminally ill, that is one thing. There is plenty of information available from many reliable sources for committing the act. But I have no desire to watch many of my coworkers damage themselves by assisting with this in a professional capacity. We have enough misplaced guilt and bad dreams over what is our job .

Ok I understand the do no harm issue, I do not see me ever pushing a button for someone nor do I think anyone other than the patient should be allowed to push the button, but I would have no bad feelings or guilt for starting an IV and hanging medicine for the patient to use if they so desire. To me there is no harm there, but that is my interpretation of the saying. As far as some nurses having issues with it again to me it is no different than the nurse who can not administer blood due to religious beliefs.

Specializes in Emergency/Cath Lab.
Nothing. As long as they don't drag anyone else into it.

Why not? Millions drag us into it every year already. The chronic people that dont take care of themselves, continue to smoke with COPD, etc etc that are killing themselves a little more everyday then come to see us for help when they have abused themselves enough that they cant fix it. Why cant we help the people that say "You know what, its time to go"?

I would much rather see someone get to check out and be done with it then see another hanging that goes wrong, or someone who flinches when they pull the trigger and only shoot half their face off. To some people, and I agree with this, there are far worse things than death. So why cant we help? Not everyone has to be a part of it. Its just like any specialty you deal with in nursing, you arent a part of it if you dont want to be. Why cant there just be special end of life nurses/physicians?

Specializes in Oncology.

I'm with Ruby. Regardless of method, a person can try to end their own life, but they don't have the right to involve someone else. As such, we as healthcare providers would never recommend to anyone that they take all their benzos. I think the point was just that if you really want to die, there are always ways to accomplish that. I'm sure suicide attempts can turn out terribly, and I don't think anyone is encouraging patients to do that. I would never, as a nurse or as a human being, be a part of euthanasia. Euthanasia doesn't always turn out well either... I was with my suffering, complete renal failure kitty when she was put down and it took multiple injections before she finally went. It was anything but peaceful. So no, I'm not a supporter of euthanasia, though as an oncology nurse I see immense suffering and understand the reasons someone would want to die.

Specializes in Case Management, ICU, Telemetry.
Nothing. As long as they don't drag anyone else into it.

How would they be "dragging" someone else into their decision? "Dragging" implies force... How could someone force a provider assist them in suicide? They can't. Every provider has the right to treat or not treat whoever they want... The provider would be choosing to treat them, not be "dragged" in. Also, I suggest you update your allnurses bio because it says that you specialize in ICU/CCU.

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