Guess my LPN means zilch- vent/rant

Daytonite, BSN, RN · Sep 27, 2005

During most of my hospital career I almost never worked with any CNAs and I started noticing that the LPN population was kind of declining and disappearing too. There has been talk over the years about grandfathering LPNs into RN status. The fact is that acute hospitals have to have RNs doing most of the things required on the patient charts. Is is a sad, but I think true, depiction of what has happened to LPNs in the hospitals. LTC uses LPNs for the very simple reason that they cost less. However, the fact is that what an LPN has to do as a charge nurse in a nursing home isn't that much different from the RNs role as a charge nurse in a hospital. If you hang around LTC facilities long enough a job will open up. I really sympathize with you--my mom was an LPN and experienced some of what you're going through also. I would really, really, urge you to get your RN as it will make your situation so much better and give you more options of places to work. I hope things get better for you.

fireflyLPN · Sep 27, 2005

The roadblock? I'm an LPN. Not one hospital in this area (withing 2 hours of my home) is hiring or is willing to hire an LPN. ...They are all going to all-RN status. ... I don't know all the reasons that prompt hospitals to make this decision

Let me first off say that I am sorry that hospitals in your area are not LPN friendly. In my area all the hospitals hire LPNs (6 total). I believe that the trend towards not hiring LPNs is simply that, a trend. I once sat through a conference held by the esteemed Registered Nursing Advocate Linda Aiken, and she stated that all hospitals should go to a BSN only practice. This is because studies indicate this lowers the patient mortality rate. While of course I think this is VERY important issue... This is not fiscally responsible action (IMO) in a day and age when the health care costs are spiraling out of control! In my area there has been discussion about a large insurance company that is no longer willing to send their pts to a particular hospital. The reason? They are too expensive... I would not be surprised to see more insurance companies taking a stand and only covering the less expensive hospitals. As a result of this I think you will see the RN only trend reverse, and the hospitals will hire a larger share of LPNs, to cut the costs of operating.

To Daytonite, I strongly disagree that "The fact is that acute hospitals have to have RNs doing most of the things required on the patient charts..." I work as an LPN in a major hospital in a critical care unit and the only time I to ask for intervention from an RN is when I have a pt with status changes within a pre-defined parameter, or when I have IV meds that need to be done. This usually only occurs once or twice a night, and they are certainly not doing most of my work.

Fiona59 · Sep 27, 2005

Well Said Firefly.

The hospitals in my province utilize LPNs to full scope of practice. LPNs are not employed in intensive care units, thats about it.

The big joke is our skill set is roughly 85% of an RN's and we are paid 50% of their wages.

Now before I get crucified, here let me state that many of the LPN's I've worked with in the last decade have BA's and BS degrees in addition to their LPN accreditiation. So, don't go "critical thinking" skills on me.

We had limited spaces in the RN programmes and people could get into the LPN programme a lot faster in the late '90's and start of this decade, so they went there.

Right now, for an LPN to go RN in my province, it bites. Only 30 accepted a year in my region. You must complete all first year liberal arts before applying to the programme, complete a nine month bridge and then go into second year of the RN programme (they are strongly urging us to take the BScN route, as they are phasing out the diploma option).

So, even to graduate as diploma RN we are looking at THREE years. Not many people have the patience to put up with that, want the student loans or can afford to be out of the workforce for that long....

SouthernLPN2RN, MSN, RN, APRN, NP · Sep 27, 2005

Thanks y'all for the replies. I'm just really frustrated. I am currently enrolled in an LPN to RN transition program, and my ultimate goal is my master's. I guess it's just easy for me to get discouraged right now, being sick and not bringing home a decent check due to lack of hours.

heaves24 · Sep 27, 2005

Hi there, I am going through the same thing. I graduated from an LPN program that was directly affiliated with a hospital. We went through the year working in the hospital, only to find out two months before we graduated, that we were "needed very badly" in the LTC centers in our areas. The only way we could get a job in the hospital was to be enrolled in an RN program. I work on a "Specialty Unit" and enjoy the residents there, although passing meds and limited resident/patient interaction is not why I wanted to become a nurse. I am very scared that I am going to loose all of the skills I worked very hard to learn, very quickly. Had I known this before I enrolled in the LPN program, I would have gone directly to an RN school. It brings me a little comfort to know that I am not the only one that feels this way, I wanted to be a nurse to help people heal, not to pass pills for 8 hours and count down the hours I am there.

fergus51 · Sep 27, 2005

I can understand you must be very frustrated. Unfortunately LPN opportunities vary so much by location. That's the downside of the shorter program I suppose. It's a shame the schools are not informing applicants of the job situation for LPNs in their area.

Nurseinthemaking · Sep 28, 2005

Do you happen to be in the Dallas Ft. Worth area? That is the trend here now, but I have had MANY people tell me they have seen this trend in their nursing career. It will Phase out. We have multiple hospitals that have listings for over 100 RN posistions and have seen one with more then that. There are not that many RN's to fill the positions, so I give them a couple more months and they will be back to LVN's again.

I was fortunate to be hired into Dialysis right out of Nursing School. Actually I was offered the job a month before I graduated. My status is a GVN until I take my state boards. I love it, love the patients and hope to be there for a good time.

I have seen several Home Health and Hospice Agencies that hire LVN's and I know that Medicare does too. Also I have seen a Pharmaceutical Company needing an LVN, starting pay is $25, with mileage, an expense account and I think once a month or twice a month travel to San Antonio. They actually fly you out to Georgia for training.

There are opportunities out there, you just have to hunt for them. Another thing I have seen is, there may not be a listing on their Job Postings, but some managers in Hospitals are so frustrated with the " NO LVN" thing they do it anyhow, because the patients are suffering and the RN's are exhausted.

To me if a Hospital is willing to pay an agency RN twice as much as a Staffed RN, there is something really wrong with that. Why not pay their regular RN's normal or maybe increase shift diff's and staff LVN's too, then you have happy employees and happy patients.

FroggysMom · Sep 28, 2005

I graduated 3 years ago, worked a year on a surgical floor, then transferred to an office for the past two years. Since I'm now going back to school (and I REALLY miss the hospital) I left the office job. I'm working part time in LTC, which I don't like, and am actively seeking a position in a hospital. The roadblock? I'm an LPN. Not one hospital in this area (withing 2 hours of my home) is hiring or is willing to hire an LPN. They are all going to all-RN status. I feel as if the hard work I put in and the experience I have gained don't mean anything. I don't know all the reasons that prompt hospitals to make this decision, but it seems to me there is no reason to offer an LPN program when the instructors are fully aware that the only place their graduates will be able to get a job is in LTC or if they're really, really lucky, an office. This is a big blow to me and I feel that it's unfair. I never envisioned LTC as where I wanted to be, and now that I'm there, I know it's not. I can't even get fulltime hours there because they don't have the openings. UGH!!!

Hi. Long time LPN here and I have to lend a little more to your rant (which I understand PERFECTLY). Seems that whether LPNs are accepted or not accepted in hospitals blows with the wind. Some facilities do, some don't. Someone in Administration gets the great idea to go to all RN staff, they get rid of their LPNs, the local LPN school(s) enrollment declines, maybe the school even closes, and all of a sudden when the hospital can't meet their staffing requirements, they are seeking LPNs yet again.

It is extremely frustrating to have your education and experience valued, discounted and dismissed and then valued again. I wish SOMEone would decide whether we are, or are not, nurses.

Personally, I think that we are and should be considered valuable members of the healthcare team, but more and more I hear comments negative toward our chosen career. It seems strange, but it also seems the ones that squawk over our presence are the same ones who squawk louder when there is no one around to do the work.

In some ways I guess I am lucky - I'm staring retirement in the face in the not too distant future. I would consider staying in the profession except for the continuing disdain I see that waxes and wanes.

I DO think that there is a place for us, that we are thinking, intelligent and capable nurses but unfortunately there are many out there with lots of letters behind their names who don't. I don't know where LPNs will be as a profession in the near, or far, future. I think those that push for a minimum requirement for nurse to be a BSN or better are not seeing the whole picture but perhaps they dislike the idea they paid huge tuitions (that many of us cannot afford by the way due to family or other concerns) to do what not only LPNs do, but also ADNs and Diploma nurses do as well.

I've been ranting about this for years, wishing we could all see the value in each other and agree that "professional" is more a state of mind and display of behavior and understanding and doing one's job very well, rather than another set of letters behind a name. But in this political world it is likely not to ever be that way.

Perhaps too many years of being unappreciated and devalued has jaded my thinking, but since the rant has started I just felt I wanted to add mine to it. Soon I will be out of the profession but not without memories of some wonderful people I've worked with, LPNs, CNAs and RNs (and also some seriously hurtful memories too, unfortunately) but for you younger LPNs out there, if you don't stand up for yourselves you will look back in the years to come wondering why nothing has changed. I sincerely hope and pray this is not the case because we are caring, intelligent nurses.

Balder_LPN, LPN · Sep 30, 2005

Our local hospital ceased hiring LPN for 3-4 years but has resumed hiring them in the last year or so.

I would think that with the incredible nursing shortage no hospital will be able to meet patient needs and minimum staff ratios for the long term without hiring LPN's

jodyangel, RN · Sep 30, 2005

Ditto what she said. I work in a hospital in a telemetry unit and I only "help" from an RN if one of my patients really has a sudden change in their condition or I have IV meds to push. I had 2 patients yesterday that were very intense. One had TPN and Lipids, the other developed SVT and required a cardizen bolus and then a drip. He had a Morphine pump for pain and was ordered 2 units of blood yesterday. At the end of the day, the RN I gave report to said, "man Jody, you should of not had to have that patient". She then commented that I gave her a very good report. It was a hard day but at the end of the day I know I learned more valuble lessons. I appreciate the job I have, altho its a very hard floor and we are so short staffed..because I have learned so much there. I hope you find your hospital job soon. I am back in school primarily because I want my job options to remain open with lots of options in the future. Having my RN will do that for me...consider it!

Let me first off say that I am sorry that hospitals in your area are not LPN friendly. In my area all the hospitals hire LPNs (6 total). I believe that the trend towards not hiring LPNs is simply that, a trend. I once sat through a conference held by the esteemed Registered Nursing Advocate Linda Aiken, and she stated that all hospitals should go to a BSN only practice. This is because studies indicate this lowers the patient mortality rate. While of course I think this is VERY important issue... This is not fiscally responsible action (IMO) in a day and age when the health care costs are spiraling out of control! In my area there has been discussion about a large insurance company that is no longer willing to send their pts to a particular hospital. The reason? They are too expensive... I would not be surprised to see more insurance companies taking a stand and only covering the less expensive hospitals. As a result of this I think you will see the RN only trend reverse, and the hospitals will hire a larger share of LPNs, to cut the costs of operating.
To Daytonite, I strongly disagree that "The fact is that acute hospitals have to have RNs doing most of the things required on the patient charts..." I work as an LPN in a major hospital in a critical care unit and the only time I to ask for intervention from an RN is when I have a pt with status changes within a pre-defined parameter, or when I have IV meds that need to be done. This usually only occurs once or twice a night, and they are certainly not doing most of my work.