Why is it... (nurses constantly throw jabs at physicans)

gypsyatheart · May 20, 2004

I have no problem with the fact that my role as an RN will be subordinate to docs who, while I may dislike and disagree with them, they know more than we do. And while I may complain about docs plenty when I get into the field, it will be for good reasons ( like the post about the doc who canceled the angiocath appt and dc'd coumadin thereby possibly causing someone a stroke, this is a good reason to complain), not petty generalized ones.
Well, so far in nursing school, I hear so many instructors, preceptor nurses, fellow nursing students say things that just sound, mmmmm, insecure. They (the ones making these statements) will have me beleive that
1 all drs are incompetent, noncaring and money grubbing egomaniacs
2 All nurses are competent and super in the area of caring\
3 try so hard to show how "professional" nurses are that they dog out another profession, medicine
I know many docs have ego problems and are difficult to work with, but I think a cohesive atmosphere shoould be promoted, not an adversarial one.
The reality that many nurses cringe at is, Docs are more highly trained than us nurses, and they are the ones that make the decisions. And we should give credit that they care about patients too although it may not show;If for no other reason then it will cost them more money if they screw up.

OK, Ms. or Mr. Student Nurse, I really must interject here! :coollook: You truly have no idea, none, nada, zip, zilch as to what you are talking about! How pretentious you sound! I really must excuse your comments as being made out of ignorance. You are only a student. That is a far, far cry from being an RN. Much less a nurse with years of experience under his/her belt. Or an advanced practice nurse, a Masters prepared nurse, perhaps. There is so much you do not know.

Word of advice...before you start "slinging" opinions and preaching to a group of professional degreed individuals, I suggest you focus on graduating, passing NCLEX, actually obtaining a nursing license and then....then try working a few years and really learn what being a nurse is all about. Clearly your classroom has not gotten you there yet....and never will. Only working as a nurse will give you the insight you need to be making these comments.

Just FYI, RN's are not "subordinate" to MD's. We work with MD's as colleagues in our own separate profession. If I had wanted to be a doctor, I would have gone to med school! I am not employeed by an MD, I work for the hospital, just like, (at my institution), the docs and everyone else are employeed by the institution. Yes, the MD's focus in education is different than a nurses, but that doesn't mean that MD's "know" more than experienced RN's. I'm sure you don't know this yet, but many times it is the RN who knows what is best for the patient, it is the RN who suggests a plan of care for the patient..... :rolleyes:

The truth of the matter is, NurseToBe, you really don't know anything at all about the "reality" of being a nurse!

NP2BE · May 20, 2004

OK, Ms. or Mr. Student Nurse, I really must interject here! You truly have no idea, none, nada, zip, zilch as to what you are talking about! How pretentious you sound! I really must excuse your comments as being made out of ignorance. You are only a student. That is a far, far cry from being an RN. Much less a nurse with years of experience under his/her belt. Or an advanced practice nurse, a Master's prepared nurse, perhaps. There is so much you do not know.
Word of advice...before you start "slinging" opinions and preaching to a group of professional degreed individuals, I suggest you focus on graduating, passing NCLEX, actually obtaining a nursing license and then....then try working a few years and really learn what being a nurse is all about. Clearly your classroom has not gotten you there yet....and never will. Only working as a nurse will give you the insight you need to be making these comments.
Just FYI, RN's are not "subordinate" to MD's. We work with MD's as colleagues in our own separate profession. If I had wanted to be a doctor, I would have gone to med school! I am not employeed by an MD, I work for the hospital, just like, (at my institution), the docs and everyone else are employeed by the institution. Yes, the MD's focus in education is different than a nurses, but that doesn't mean that MD's "know" more than experienced RN's. I'm sure you don't know this yet, but many times it is the RN who knows what is best for the patient, it is the RN who suggests a plan of care for the patient.....
The truth of the matter is, NurseToBe, you really don't know anything at all about the "reality" of being a nurse!

How funny..... Touch a nerve here? This is my point, what is wrong with working under phsyicians??? Its reality, no matter how you cut it. But you can try to convince everyone and anyone all day long that its your decision if it makes you feel better. You can suggest treatments for the patients and I am sure the docs take them in many cases, but it is their decision as to what treatment the patient willl receive.

NP2BE · May 20, 2004

What wrong with criticizing doctors they usually blame a Nurse for everything.

nothing, never said there was

gypsyatheart · May 20, 2004

How funny..... Touch a nerve here? This is my point, what is wrong with working under phsyicians??? Its reality, no matter how you cut it. But you can try to convince everyone and anyone all day long that its your decision if it makes you feel better. You can suggest treatments for the patients and I am sure the docs take them in many cases, but it is their decision as to what treatment the patient willl receive.

Nothing would be wrong with that, my dear, if that truly were the case...which it is not. As I said, you are supposedly a nursing student....you don't know anything about the "reality" of being an RN. Also, you are not qualified to make comments or state opinions on the relationships between RN's and doctors, now are you? I'm beginning to wonder if you are even a nursing student....

Hmmmm, perhaps "troll" would be more accurate!

If indeed you are a nursing student I would suggest that you focus on your studies and quit worrying so much about doctors. Try and use your clinical experiences to learn how to become a good nurse!

Have a good day now!

NP2BE · May 20, 2004

Nothing would be wrong with that, my dear, if that truly were the case...which it is not. As I said, you are supposedly a nursing student....you don't know anything about the "reality" of being an RN. Also, you are not qualified to make comments or state opinions on the relationships between RN's and doctors, now are you? I'm beginning to wonder if you are even a nursing student....
Hmmmm, perhaps "troll" would be more accurate!
If indeed you are a nursing student I would suggest that you focus on your studies and quit worrying so much about doctors. Try and use your clinical experiences to learn how to become a good nurse!
Have a good day now!

Now that is the maturity I have come to expect. Call me a troll. I bet you are the pride of your floor.

veteranRN · May 20, 2004

NP2BE....It is your perception of nurses being "under physicians" that put them on a pedestal in the first place. I agree that we are all collegues in the care of the patient. And you can be I know more about the holistic care of the patient. The physician only knows the physical aspect. But it is I who is providing spiritual and emotional care as well as physical care to ease their pain and suffering. Good luck in nusing, I think you may need it.

gypsyatheart · May 20, 2004

Now that is the maturity I have come to expect. Call me a troll. I bet you are the pride of your floor.

Actually, I am! :rotfl: Bye bye now! :rolleyes:

talaxandra · May 20, 2004

My favourite moment on ER was in the first or second season - Peter Benton, one of the surgical residents, had been giving Haleh a hard time about initiating treatment before he prescribed (you'll never hear me say "ordered"!) it. In response, she stopped doing anything unless he wrote it down on the treatment plan first. Peter went to Carol Hathaway, the nurse manager, to complain about Haleh's lack of respect, to which Carol responded something to the effect: "Why should she listen to you? She's a qualified professional, you're still a student."

Maybe, when nurses were unthinking tools of their medical masters, doctors issued orders to subordinate nurses. There may be some doctors who are unaware that those days are long past; nurses know better.

leslie :-D · May 20, 2004

I know many docs have ego problems and are difficult to work with, but I think a cohesive atmosphere shoould be promoted, not an adversarial one.
The reality that many nurses cringe at is, Docs are more highly trained than us nurses, and they are the ones that make the decisions. And we should give credit that they care about patients too although it may not show;If for no other reason then it will cost them more money if they screw up.

until you've walked in our shoes, your 2nd and 3rd hand presumptions come across as quite arrogant. furthermore, mds and nurses act under their own licenses so you're not comparing apples to apples. it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that mds have many more years of training so no, we do not cringe. respect is earned by acknowledging what each has to offer and not by virtue of title. if you are to be a part of the nursing profession, then you need to study the critical issues involved, one of them being the need for nurses to empower themselves and being recognized for their genuine worth and abilities. it is evident you have a long way to go.

NP2BE · May 20, 2004

The main point i was making was basically can't we all get along instead of blaming everything on another profession. ok, I stand corrected, an atmosphere of blaming everything on docs and having attitudes is the way to go.

Perhaps I will make a better nurse when i can walk around all day saying things like "those stupid drs....." If that is the case then yes, i do have a long way to go, and I hope i never get there.

Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN · May 20, 2004

I bet you are the pride of your floor.

By making this remark, you've answered your original question.

leslie :-D · May 20, 2004

The main point i was making was basically can't we all get along instead of blaming everything on another profession. ok, I stand corrected, an atmosphere of blaming everything on docs and having attitudes is the way to go.
Perhaps I will make a better nurse when i can walk around all day saying things like "those stupid drs....." If that is the case then yes, i do have a long way to go, and I hope i never get there.

but you see, that's not the case. you are rubberstamping the entire nsg. profession on the variable vents that you've heard. that is a biased and short-

sighted perspective.