Hospital Requiring BSN or your pay will be Capped?

chowlover · May 10, 2008

Can you say what hospital this is? Or, at least what state you are in? Is this so the hospital can get Magnet status?

Agnus · May 10, 2008

A way to "upgrade" the workforce and replace workers by attrition. Every nurse who leaves, is one less that the hospital has to pay out retirement benefits to. Can be replaced by a new nurse at less pay, perhaps with less benefits. A tactic used by many employers to manipulate their bottom line. They also get the advantage of having something to brag about to the public by insinuating that their nurses are of a higher caliber.

Exactly

Katie82, RN · May 10, 2008

It depends on what job titles nurses are being demoted from. I feel that supervisory positions should be held by bachelor-level nurses.In today's playing field, if you have been a nurse for 20+ years and have not gone back for a 4-yr degree, I think it shows a lack of initiative. With online programs and tuition-reimbursement, there isn't an excuse. I would debate that a BSN makes you a better nurse, but it does make you a better manager and administrator, so if that's a career goal, these ADN nurses need to go back to school. I waited until my children were through college before I went back, I should not have waited. I do not feel like I am a better nurse because I have a graduate degree, but I definatly feel more professional, and respected.

Daytonite, BSN, RN · May 10, 2008

is any other hospital out there doing this? we have just been told that if you do not have a bsn, your pay will be capped and you cannot be promoted past a certain point. oh and also the nurses that have been there a million year--they are making them either take a demotion in title or go back for a certification/bsn in order to stay at their payrate and title. there is talk about having the million year nurses being "granfathered" in ...... but about this whole thing ---i don't think this is really a smart thing to do especially in a recession and shortage. people are considering leaving and going to a hospital that does not do this. what do you think?

you probably live in an area that has a large population of bsns so they can do this. an employer can make any rules they want. i moved to one town and worked for a very large facility that only hired bsns. i did not know this at the time i applied and was hired for a job with them. i later found out that adn and diploma grad applicanta didn't even get job interviews! they still do it today because there are 3 universities in the area cranking out bsns by the barrelful. this facility, which is ranked in the top 50 of the country, likes to advertise that they only have bsns on their staff. they also have quite a few advanced clinical nurse practitioners and they expect a lot out of their bsns than just regular staff nurse duties. the hospital does have a few diploma rns from their very old hospital based rn nursing program of years ago and lpns who were hired on more than 30 years ago. as they resign or retire, they are replaced with bsns.

when you are the boss you can make the rules. this is why many people would love to be self-employed or own their own business if they could.

RNsRWe, ASN, RN · May 10, 2008

As Daytonite said, it may have more to do with the ready availability of BSNs than the desire to kick out the ADNs. In my area, administration knows they would be doing more than shooting themselves in the foot with such a maneuver, it would eliminate a large percentage of their current staff, which is already not enough to handle the census most of the time. Might as well shoot themselves in the head and be done with the misery of failing as a hospital faster.

We have something of a problem now with LPNs: we don't hire any more of them anywhere, but we do have a short stack of them sprinkled throughout the hospital who have been there a long time. The hospital has promised to not fire them for not continuing on in school, but it's been made clear that at some point, they'll have a choice to either be used as techs, chart auditors, or voluntarily leave. We're going to an all-RN staff, period.

The LPNs are unhappy with this, naturally. Any that leave are replaced with RNs. A few of them have decided to continue on with education, and will secure positions as RNs without any difficulty. The others, those who will not go back to school ("I won't, and they can't make me!!") will be out of nursing at this hospital, eventually.

The hospital is the boss. If they feel they can manage with this current dictum of "get the BSN or else", then they'll do it. Nothing you can do.

James Huffman · May 10, 2008

The hospital has a "right" to do this. It's their business.

And the non-BSN nurses have the right to take their skills elsewhere.

I agree with another poster who suggested that this was likely an area with a lot of BSN-prepared nurses. It's just a matter of supply and demand.

lsyorke, RN · May 10, 2008

In today's playing field, if you have been a nurse for 20+ years and have not gone back for a 4-yr degree, I think it shows a lack of initiative.

Wow, that's a blanket slam for older nurses.A BSN does not make a better nurse. There are many other ways to become the best in your field. Time served is one way! Specialty certifications, continuing education specific to your area of practice is another.

Another aspect is to recognize that "older" nurses are dealing with life circumstances that "younger" nurses don't have yet. Raising children,children in college, care of elderly parents, health issues. This isn't about "lack of initiative", this is about balancing your career with your life.

I have no problem with changing the education requirements for incoming nurses. But penalizing those who have spent their careers working to elevate the profession to what it is today is wrong, just plain wrong.

Trauma Columnist · May 10, 2008

Hope this hospital can fill all the soon-to-be-empty positions. I think its okay to change the standards of new hires, but not those of the veteran nurses. And...sorry but there are many excellent nurses who have chosen not to pursue a higher degree. That is a personal choice and does not reflect a different level of professionalism.

When I went back to school, I did it to give myself more choices as I age. It did not make me a better bedside nurse.

pagandeva2000, LPN · May 10, 2008

As Daytonite said, it may have more to do with the ready availability of BSNs than the desire to kick out the ADNs. In my area, administration knows they would be doing more than shooting themselves in the foot with such a maneuver, it would eliminate a large percentage of their current staff, which is already not enough to handle the census most of the time. Might as well shoot themselves in the head and be done with the misery of failing as a hospital faster.
We have something of a problem now with LPNs: we don't hire any more of them anywhere, but we do have a short stack of them sprinkled throughout the hospital who have been there a long time. The hospital has promised to not fire them for not continuing on in school, but it's been made clear that at some point, they'll have a choice to either be used as techs, chart auditors, or voluntarily leave. We're going to an all-RN staff, period.
The LPNs are unhappy with this, naturally. Any that leave are replaced with RNs. A few of them have decided to continue on with education, and will secure positions as RNs without any difficulty. The others, those who will not go back to school ("I won't, and they can't make me!!") will be out of nursing at this hospital, eventually.
The hospital is the boss. If they feel they can manage with this current dictum of "get the BSN or else", then they'll do it. Nothing you can do.

I am an LPN that does not wish to become an RN. In my area at this time, LPNs are not being phased out, really. But, I do have a concern when hospitals are applying for magnet, it may leave LPNs at a disadvantage. But, I'll say this; if they offer me a position as a chart auditor or something a bit less stressful than patient care, I would do it in heartbeat, and work as an LPN as a side job.

marilynmom, LPN, NP · May 11, 2008

I am all for requiring BSN as entry level, and I encourage all people thinking about nursing school to go for the BSN. It is the way of the future.

I know many of the hospitals in my area have totally done away with LPNs, and some are hiring BSN over ADN new grads (especially in desirable areas and desirable hospitals).

I do NOT agree with just kicking ADN nurses with prior experience to the curb--they should be encouraged to go back for their BSN and the hospital should help pay for that like many do and offer credit for work experience. I know my hospital offers on site/online ADN-BSN classes, etc. Prior experience counts for a heck of a lot.

Nursing isn't the only field that caps salary for not advancing your education though. My husbands job/salary was capped because he didn't have a bachelors---so he is taking classes now towards his bachelors. He had 10 years experience at his job. His police department is no longer hiring recruits without a college degree and those who have no degree or only associates are having to go back and get their bachelors if they ever want to advance in rank or pay (this didn't used to be the case).

traumahawk99 · May 11, 2008

this isn't something that will spread industry wide. which hospital is it? it's one thing to hear this without verifying it, but i'd like to call this hospital as an experienced adn, and see if they'd hire me. then i'll report back here.

otherwise, i'm hard pressed to buy this as fact. call me skeptical.

Surgerygirl · May 11, 2008

sounds like a good idea to me...it will further the profession...
Mex

I disagree. BSN and ADN graduates all had to pass the same state boards. I would rather have an experienced ADN RN than a new BSN RN care for me. Having a BSN does not automatically make someone a "better" nurse. When graduates from a BSN program are required to pass a completely different and more difficult state board exam, then I will reconsider my position. :nono: