Difference in dregrees and licensures - page 2
I am just throwing this out there since there has been so many discussions on here about unions, respect for other nurses and confusion with pt families and doctors. Do you think that one of the... Read More
Mar 12, '02Thank you JMP. Sometimes when all I hear is negativity, it makes me think that perhaps there is no hope for nursing and that I might as well go into real estate. But the occasional words of support from fellow nurses, like yourself, make me feel better.
So.. hear that folks??? I AGREE with JMP!
Mar 12, '02I am with Suzy, education is important. An instructor once told me that 10 years of experience doesn't mean anything if it is just the same year of experience 10 times over. It's the theoretical education that helps make the experience something enriching. I think nurses in general really downplay the importance of education. I have never heard a doctor or an engineer say they shouldn't have had to waste so much time in school.
JMP, I am in BC and we're doing the same thing almost. Our LPN prgrams aren't changing to my knowledge, but the RN programs are. It isn't a really huge issue. Before it went through, the diploma and BSN prgrams were the same until the third year when diploma grads left and BSN students stayed for another year. Now the diploma students just don't have the option of bridging out. I have an instructor friend who told me out of their class of 60, they haven't had more than 6 bridge out in the last 5 years anyways. I think this will benefit nurses in the future.
Mar 12, '02My experience is many females have not learned to integrate their femininity with women's lib! As a result, I see many become 'aggressive' and never learn 'assertive'.
I agree with the premise that an organized movement of bedside nurses could accomplish great things...and I believe this is what UAN is attempting. Most anti nurse legislation I see originates from AHA, AANE, and AMA lobbying efforts. Sure wish we could pick up the pace and outshout these powerful groups.
Mar 12, '02Nursing is fractured into many pieces. We have "nurse" in labels from Nurse Practioner to Certified Nurses Aide. It is little wonder that nursing can not speak with one unified voice.
Just a few: Nurse Practioner, Registered Nurse, Licensed Vocational Nurse, Licensed Pratical Nurse, Nursing Assistant and Certified Nurses Aide. This is not to mention all the lay people working within a Doctor's Office, who do not clarify to the patient, they hold no license and only assist the Doctor under his directions and allow patients to incorrectly identify them as nurse.
When society thinks of nurse, they think of all those who have "nurse" in the title. Society is confused because we are confused.
Why should they, we have failed to educate society and continue to bicker among ourselves about the ADN vs. BSN. We go so far as to continue fracturing the Registered Nurse into Certifications such as CCRN, IV Certified, etc, etc.
The list will be endless. I am not agaisnt these certification, I use the example just to demonstrate we continue to divide ourselves and then ask the question, " Why do we seem unable to unite".Last edit by RNed on Mar 12, '02
Mar 12, '02This thread, and the threads that view the different "caring" if not always actual "nursing" elements of healthcare, are so interesting to me. I jumped through lots of hoops on my way through the different phases of my professional development (I won't say 'levels', as in one being "higher" because each contributed to my personal growth). I went from CNA (back in the pre-glove days-gave lots of bare-handed enemas!) to LVN (LPN to non-Texans) to BSN to MSN/CNS. I've taught in a BSN and a diploma program (one of the few still left), which both produced outstanding nurses. I still love working with patients, as well as with staff of all levels. I've had my butt saved by the observational skills of a CNA, worked side-by-side with another LVN in an ICU, and been fortunate to have learned from outstanding colleagues with an alphabet-soup of titles behind their names. I agree that our professional diversity has made it difficult for us to unite into one politically-strong voice to save ourselves. Where we do unite, as educators, bedside caregivers, managers, or wherever our professional paths have led us, is in wanting the best for those whose care is our responsibility. I think it is that concern that has made us a political force to be reckoned with, perhaps in spite of ourselves. (IMHO
Mar 13, '02Since we "only"have the diploma-education here (takes 3 years) and a nursing- aide one (takes one year), can't really discuss about the others.
I do know though that the first university trained nurses are getting out next year after 4 years of lots and lots of theory and just a few hours of practise and we are all very anxious to see what and how they will be working on the wards.
of course they won't work with us diploma-nurses side by side, since they go right to the top of the management and/ or education.
Ah well, we'll see!!
Take care, Renee
Mar 13, '02It doesn't have to be that way Renee. My four year BSN had more clinical time than the diploma, and I NEVER want to go into mangement or teaching (four years of school was enough for me! I can't imagine teaching like you)
Mar 14, '02If all the nurses that frequent this board; decided to unite around one idea, it would become reality. Absolutley, without a doubt. There is endless power in one idea that is supported by many.
Mar 14, '02No it is planned that way. They study to go into management or education.
And I know fo a fact that their clinical hours are 200 med/surg, 200 OB/Gan, 200 Geriatrics and 100 Healthcare/ Homecare.
Not really much in 4 years!! In the diploma-thing we've got more then double!
Teaching is fun! (weeeellllll, not on friday afternoon, from 1-5pm, like I have to do tomorrow!!)
Take care, Renee
Mar 14, '02[QUOTE]Originally posted by mattsmom81
[B]My experience is many females have not learned to integrate their femininity with women's lib! As a result, I see many become 'aggressive' and never learn 'assertive'.
Oh how I AGREE with that quote of yours, mattsmom81! I took an Assertive Training Course for Nurses during my last year of college, and it was so helpful to me when I started working in the field as a nurse. It's almost like I could easily detect who was and who wasn't being aggressive or assertive. Amazing! Once you see it in action, being able to respond to it is "key" in how the conversation or situation plays out. Perhaps hospitals should offer an Assertive Training Class for all healthcare professionals, mandating they repeat the class annually on their "birthdate" as set up by the hospitals they work for.
Mar 19, '02Howdy Yall
From deep in the heart of Texas
I went into nursing to be a nurse, So I chose to become an AD RN. I have no complaints. I have been in administrative for almost 15 years now..
We are nurses together, UNITE FOR POWER
keep it in the short grass yall
Mar 19, '02Hello,
I've read all of the posts on this thread, and I wonder if my choice to apply next year to an associate degree nursing (ADN) program to earn an RN degree is wise, or should I, instead, apply to a BSN program.
I have the pre-requisites needed for both programs; but my reasoning for tackling the ADN program first is that I can afford the ADN program, can go to school part-time for two years, graduate, get my license and work as a nurse (in a hospital, I hope); and then, I can apply for an RN to BSN program, which also will take two years; but, RN to BSN is part-time (some classes over the Internet too), so I can still work.
If I enter the BSN program next year instead of the ADN program, I'd have two years of school to attend (like for the ADN), but school would be full time, and I'd have to get loans and if possible, to be able to afford it.
The wisdom question comes up for me in wondering if I would have a more solid footing INITIALLY as a nurse with a BSN degree. (The clinical hours for the ADN program are 53 and for the BSN program, 69.)
I presently transcribe multi-specialty clinics and hospital reports, and based on what I see in the reports, I ask myself, "How will I gain all of the knowledge that is needed?" "Should I perhaps go for the BSN instead?"
I realize I will need also to learn to think critically, i.e., to be able to put the facts and the patient together to equal appropriate nursing care. I accept that as a lifetime educational process. It's the knowledge base that looks, at this point in my ignorance, to form the foundation, but perhaps not.
So, how do I gain a strong foundation? There is a lot of information to learn. This is why I ask, "Would a BSN degree give me a stronger foundation than an RN degree?"
Thanks for sharing your wisdom and experience.
, FrancaLast edit by Franca on Mar 19, '02
Mar 19, '02Hello Franca,
You have to follow the beat of your own drum on this one. You've pretty much answered your own question as to which one would fit into your financial budget -- INITIALLY -- then, when you graduate and are able to earn a better living for yourself, there are many fine BSN programs that you can enter as an RN pursuing a BSN.
No route is everything to everyone, but one route is the beginning of everything that can eventually be obtained and attained by anyone who applies themselves. Best of luck to you in whatever you decide!Last edit by live4today on Mar 19, '02