For a while now I've been reading about the so called nursing shortage and today I read a thread that discusses this issue and the general opinion that the problem is the poor working environment, pay etc. So I can't help but wonder why we aren't organized. Surely if ALL of us were unionized we'd be in a better position to negotiate. I live in Denmark where 97% of all nurses are union members. Things are not perfect here, but better than the US I think.
So, what do all of you think? Why aren't we more organized? Seems like I've read somewhere that ca. 30% of american nurses are unionized?
Specializes in Trauma,ER,CCU/OHU/Nsg Ed/Nsg Research.
So what do you do when management comes to you and says you are fired, you ask why, and they just smile and say 'cause?
But with that kind of reasoning, every worker in America should be represented by a union. I have no fear of being fired without reason, because a.) There is a nursing shortage b.) I'm a good nurse who has never even been written up. c.) I don't know one nurse in my hospital that's been fired without good reason.
But with that kind of reasoning, every worker in America should be represented by a union. I have no fear of being fired without reason, because a.) There is a nursing shortage b.) I'm a good nurse who has never even been written up. c.) I don't know one nurse in my hospital that's been fired without good reason.
Nurses are so IDEALISTIC. I am coming from the perspective of the textile industry. Believe it or not, hospitals are for profit. And believe it or nor I used to feel the same way as you until I got a good dose of reality. But believe me or not I don't care because the first thing to go in the face of losing your job is your IDEALISM. :rotfl:
Please let me clarify. I am not a physician, did not attend four years of medical school, did not spend 5 years residency, have student loans that are comparable to the national debt, and will never try to fathom why a physician becomes a physician. I am however very concerned about my profession and do not want it to descend to placing only a dollar value on what I do. I have always been employed in South Carolina, and as a nurse have always enjoyed excellent benefits and salaries without a union. My hospital alliance is non-profit which may make a difference and our administration beginning at the corporate level is very attuned to the needs, the accomplishments and the contributions of nurses. I would believe your statement about a union being "a group of people who stand up for one another" if the first issue they bargain wasn't payroll deduction for union dues and not my benefits. And to answer your first question, when I began my nursing career my salary was 1/20th of what it is now. And my benefits have continued their upward spiral without a union. Do I need a union? No. Do other nurses need a union? Maybe. I can only say that in my experience and on observation of conflicts between employee/employer relationships in other areas, it would appear that both may have their priorities confused. Perhaps all of us need to review why we went into nursing in the first place. How much "money" did we expect to make? And, more importantly, who did we think our target population was? Is our profession now relegated to defining what we do by the money we make? Can't we receive enourmous satisfication for helping deliver a healthy baby, watching a mother bond successfully with her infant, watching our patients return to their optimal level of function? How much more appreciated do we need to be? I have excellent insurance, tuition assistance and reimbursement, numerous education opportunities, involvement in the function and practice of my unit, service line, and my hospital, excellent retirement plans, outside benefits, overtime, call back pay, shift differential, permanent shift differential, bonuses for higher degrees, and much more. What could a union do for my coworker? When the CEO and President of my Alliance and CFO and Nursing V-P know my name, stop me and ask about my family, and how things are going, and are interested in my opinion for improvements, how could I not support my status quo? I think I have it great but am truly sorry for those nurses who are not as fortunate as I. Maybe a union is right for you, but for me at this time it is not necessary nor has ever been.
Yours is a well thought out and well expressed opinion on this subject. While I do not agree with your opinions I respect the fact that you took the time to explain your positions and your reasons for them and appreciate that you did not respond with a typical knee-jerk response against unions. Thank you
Specializes in Trauma,ER,CCU/OHU/Nsg Ed/Nsg Research.
Nurses are so IDEALISTIC. I am coming from the perspective of the textile industry. Believe it or not, hospitals are for profit. And believe it or nor I used to feel the same way as you until I got a good dose of reality. But believe me or not I don't care because the first thing to go in the face of losing your job is your IDEALISM. :rotfl:
I'm not coming at this with childish idealism. Oh, and believe it or not- my hospital is a non-profit, and we do lose money every single year. Sorry you don't have the same kind of work environment that I do. If your workplace is bad, then I think unionizing would be a good idea for your workplace. Not all of us have those problems, though.
Specializes in Trauma,ER,CCU/OHU/Nsg Ed/Nsg Research.
And secondly, How are you going to come in here as a nursing student and tell us nurses how we should bargain for ourselves? If the textile industry you worked in was so great since it was unionized, then why are you in nursing school? Hmmm...could it be the good pay and great job security?
HappyCamper - I agree with you. Count me in as someone who would not work at a hospital if I had to join a union.
As to a "collective voice" ... all you have to do is hang around allnurses.com and you will see that there is no such thing as a collective voice. We all think differently regarding the solutions to the problems in the medical field.
To each their own.
steph
Thank you for your response and your independence. I dislike having an outside entity "calling the shots" for me, telling me I have to leave my patient's beside to go on strike, ridiculing my colleagues for having to cross picket lines to support their families, and demanding I pay union dues whenther or not I voted affimative for their organization. Perhaps nurses who work at a for-profit institution do have issues I am not experiencing, just like employees at any corporation. It delights me that my healthcare facility has ".org" instead of ".com" after its email. Enjoy your nursing career. I sure do mine. :)
There is no MAJOR shortage where I work (Kansas City, MO). Only some hospitals - mainly those belonging to HCA have difficulty staffing their units.
I would not work in a facility that had a union. How can we be viewed as PROFESSIONALS when we organize in unions that were originally designed to get better working conditions for 'blue-collar' workers at the turn of the century?
Yes, stand up for your rights.
Yes, raise your voice to be heard.
Yes, show your view/choice by not working any longer at that "understaffed" hospital in town.
But, no...there is no reason to behave unprofessionally and go on STRIKE. There is no reason to behave unprofessionally and make snide comments to those that must keep working to feed their families during a strike.
IMO, it's one or the other.
Be a NURSING PROFESSIONAL -or- Be a worker in a blue-collar union job.
Personally, I like to think of myself as a member of the Nursing Profession.
Doctors work and negotiate as groups, that doesn't make them less professional. IMO, worrying about being perceived as blue collar holds us back. I would love to get the benefits and wages of some of those blue collar jobs.
And secondly, How are you going to come in here as a nursing student and tell us nurses how we should bargain for ourselves? If the textile industry you worked in was so great since it was unionized, then why are you in nursing school? Hmmm...could it be the good pay and great job security?
The textile field in which I worked was NOT unionized. All of our jobs have gone to China. In my career I have seen our manufacturing base lost. While the hospitals cannot go to another country they COULD do what the Lockheed plants have done: import foreigners for the SPECIFIC purpose of keeping wages down. I live in a real world where there are real problems that require real solutions. I do not live in fantasyland where all of the doctors are perfect gentlemen(women), all of the hospitals lavish us with pay and benefits, and we all have a 1:1 patient ratio. Bargain however you choose but the 40 hour workweek, paid holidays, health benefits, paid vacations, etc. were all won at the expense of people standing up together and saying enough is enough.
Unions are useful as a final solution if there is no resolving working conditions any other way. They can be a major headache and prevent the removal of deadweight though. The threat of unionization is sometimes enough to get management to change policies. I will always support unions. I work hard and expect to compensation for my labor. I am called to be a nurse but that does not give anyone the right to use my calling as an excuse to treat me any worse than the most secular mercenary. I do not preach at others and would appreciate them not using my faith against me.
Specializes in Trauma,ER,CCU/OHU/Nsg Ed/Nsg Research.
The textile field in which I worked was NOT unionized. All of our jobs have gone to China. In my career I have seen our manufacturing base lost. While the hospitals cannot go to another country they COULD do what the Lockheed plants have done: import foreigners for the SPECIFIC purpose of keeping wages down. I live in a real world where there are real problems that require real solutions. I do not live in fantasyland where all of the doctors are perfect gentlemen(women), all of the hospitals lavish us with pay and benefits, and we all have a 1:1 patient ratio. Bargain however you choose but the 40 hour workweek, paid holidays, health benefits, paid vacations, etc. were all won at the expense of people standing up together and saying enough is enough.
You made a previous statement that you thought all nurses should be unionized. Some of us don't feel it is needed *where we work.* How is that living in a fantasyland? Some of us are able to bargain with our employers without unions. You're making assumptions of a workforce that you haven't even joined yet based on one that you used to belong to. When I was an agency nurse, I had the opportunity to work at union and non-union hospitals. Let me tell you, in my area there was a big difference 'twixt the two. When you become a nurse, you will have the right to choose which one you want. That's a good thing. I don't want to be forced to join a union.
It also costs hospitals money to import nurses- do you think a third-world nurse has the financial capacity to come over here on their own? They get a lot of the same benefits as travel nurses working on contract, and their pay is the same as the other nurses. They're not cheap labor as you seem to think. Although, they are probably cheaper labor than union nurses.
BBFRN, BSN, PhD
3,779 Posts
But with that kind of reasoning, every worker in America should be represented by a union. I have no fear of being fired without reason, because a.) There is a nursing shortage b.) I'm a good nurse who has never even been written up. c.) I don't know one nurse in my hospital that's been fired without good reason.