Why are Nursing Programs so Cruel to Students

[soon_2Bnurse]

Hi folks,

Ok, so I have been an LPN for 4 years, started college from scratch after one year of full time as a LPN because I knew I wanted to do more than a LPN can do within the scope of practice. I am half way through a 4 semester program to get my AAS in nursing.

Why does it seem that absolutely everything is a struggle? There is no empathy AT ALL within the administration. In the last two semesters we went from 72 students to 34. Examples of what I mean are as follows.

1) Student is in top 10% of class, we have a 10 question test on fluid and electrolytes and the student gets metabolic and respiratory confused. 8 of the answers were respiratory, he gets them all wrong..out of the program..remediation 1 year later if he so chooses.

2) Weather doesn't mean anything; it may be raining on campus, but for myself, who drives 70 miles EACH WAY to get there, it is snowing, but if I am tardy more than once..I'm done and have to appeal at the end of the semester. I ended up in a ditch not once but twice risking my life to get to class, (and made it) out of FEAR of getting kicked from the program.

3)A student requests a copy of a physical for a summer internship that she had to have for school/clinicals. The dean says "read the handbook", no copies. So that student pays another $70 for a physical.

4) A conflict between an instructor and the dean causes the dean to write the next two exams without lecturing on them...the entire class fails the first test. The scores stand and we lose more people. The instructor is "let go" before the next term.

I guess I am just at a loss. This accredited program is "the only" one with a 2 year degree offered within 150miles of where I live. I wonder to myself if ALL programs are just so vicious to it's students? I am disheartened and dreading the next 2 semesters, but if I quit, I am back to being a LPN and nothing more with lots of debt.

[BabyLady, BSN, RN]

Babylady,

Thank you for your honest replies. I wish it was as simple as living on campus. The campus isn't a live-in campus nor am I able to do that. I am an adult, put my husband through college to get his masters, we have 3 children, one already graduated from college and 2 in college. I work weekends in a penal facility as a lpn to make ends meet. Nothing is easy EVER, but I do try. This is my "one shot". I have been married a very long time (25 years) so if I fail, then I can't do it again.

You are correct on the grades of the man I spoke of...his name was not posted, but he was a friend and the "curve" was posted online.

Living where I do, I wish I could say driving wasn't a challenge. I made the decision to commit to college, so I drive it. The college is so far away that the weather is different "there" than here. They have a policy that if you miss one day or 2 tardies, you can go in for grade appeal. The 2nd absence automatically is an "F". Btw, the test he took on electrolytes was the only test over that material and it counted in "lab". With a total available points of 42 and him losing 8 of those with 2 points on the CCE's lost, it was mathematically impossible to pass the lab portion. He was an EMT and paramedic..its a real shame.

I guess what I am getting at is that it just shouldn't be this cruel. There really should be some understanding. I don't mean taking advantage but seriously having empathy. What point is being a nurse if you have no regard for other people.

I agree they need to be more understanding and more professional.

That is one of the reasons why I aspire to be a nursing educator.

Because there are too many in the profession that have ZERO business teaching.

[jjjoy, LPN]

Get the frustration of it off your chest and then get going to do whatever it is you need to do to finish this thing despite the obstacles - which is what you are probably doing anyway.

Why do some schools seem so unsupportive? We can speculate and speculate - I still have questions about my program from years ago - but there's not going to be a satisfactory answer to your question and you've still got to jump through the hoops.

As far as the weather and driving, maybe there are some creative possibilities? Just because you're an adult with a husband and college-age kids doesn't mean crashing at a friend or classmates place now and again is definitely out of the question (though there may be other reasons it wouldn't work). Getting a motel room closer to the school on bad weather nights might cost $40-50 a night, but that's a lot less than an accident would be. If you could avoid driving home at all some days, you'd be saving the gas money.

There may be reasons that wouldn't work and all the creativity in the world may not resolve anything. If you keep plugging along, though and don't have too much bad luck weather-wise, you can get past this and not have to worry about that again.

Be safe, of course. If you did end up having to fail due to missing/being late from avoiding dangerous roads, it would really be horribly frustrating but would still be better than ending up in a horrible accident, injuring yourself and/or others.

It sounds like you've already shown that you're willing to do what it takes. Keep it up and you'll succeed one way or another!

[TheCommuter, BSN, RN]

Do you want this person taking care of your loved ones?

One of these nurses who earned marginal grades and test scores while in school probably has taken care of me or one of my loved ones at one point in time, and I have no complaints. Always remember that 50 percent of all nurses in the workforce had to have graduated in the bottom 50th percentile of their class.

[ParkerBC,MSN,RN, PhD, RN]

First let me say that I am sorry you are going through this. I experienced a similar situation. I recently started teaching at a for-profit school. If my students don’t understand something, I make it a point to work with them. Let me give you an example. In a pathophysiology course I am teaching, there are only a handful of students who really get the material. It is a difficult subject. I allow all of the students to earn half of their missed points. Whichever question is missed, I ask the student to first write out the rationale to why they chose their answer. Then I ask the students to look up the correct answer and write the rationale behind that answer. When they do that, they earn ½ a point back.

I also have quizzes...I call them whenever quizzes. They only consist of five questions (the ones missed where students had to look up rationales). Every student has received a 100% on those quizzes which indicate to me they are learning. Now, the questions are structured a little differently so that students cannot simply memorize the material. I have had great success in the courses. I also make myself available. Maybe I am the exception.

Here are my thoughts…I think nursing school performance should be based upon first-time pass rate AND student retention rates. There is no room for error. So, schools get rid of you. They don’t want to chance their first-time pass rates to decrease because of marginal students. There seriously needs to be some overhauling done with nursing education.

[soon_2Bnurse]

Parker,

Thank you for your post, and I can't agree with you more. Thank all of you for your words of wisdom and maybe things will change in the future

[LPNVa2Ny]

I feel your pain....am now in RN program and i tell you....there is nothing like it. I have been through boot camp and LPN school and I would much rather experience this over than what I am experiencing now in RN school. Hopefully you have a good support system and before you know it..it will all be over. Just dont give up....had to many friends to count that walked away from their dream.

[bamamamacat]

I am in Nursing III of an LPN to RN bridge program after many years as an LPN, and I am in clinical Hell. The instructor throws out off-the-cuff or somewhat informative but abridged answers to most questions, whether in clinicals or lecture. She gives out contradictory rapid-fire information, acts annoyed of she's asked to repeat anything, then blames any confusion on the student. She and I personally do not mesh, although I have tried just about everything I can think of to smooth the waters; I am now thinking of reporting her to administration, which is going to make for a very long semester considering the attitude she already has where I'm concerned. Also, the school I'm attending has a habit of encouraging students to give instructors frank critiques, then supports instructors who receive complaints. It's very hard to know what to expect from this instructor, because she has a mercurial temperament and can go from pleasant to downright sarcastic and confrontational in a heartbeat. I am older than most of the students -- roughly the same age as my instructor -- and I'm not afraid to ask questions or admit I don't know something. In my opinion, the instructor has used that to her advantage during end-of-shift conferences by making snide remarks in front of the other students instead of answering my questions, or using a condescending tone if the answer is actually given. The result is that these students generally don't ask questions, and when they do, it's offered tentatively or apologetically. She also rushes through procedures, at least with me. I don't know about the other students, because we do no procedures as a team. Last semester, students would gather and watch each other do procedures, learning from each other and providing support. There was a wonderful feeling of safety in numbers, if that makes sense. Other Nursing III instructors use the team approach, but not ours. Every interaction basically boils down to her word against each individual student's. It's ridiculous and frustrating and sad. This woman has a wealth of knowledge but that, in itself, does not make a good teacher and she is, in fact, a truly awful instructor. Such is life.

[MrsBradyMom]

I had an instructor that was constantly on my butt. She always put me on the spot with questions, picked me to perform procedures with her, and basically "hawked" on me for an entire 3 semesters. It was year of hell with no end in sight.

Finally, we had graduation conferences to learn where we stood in regards to grades. Of course, I was assigned to this instructor for the conference. I walked into the room so scared I thought I'd need a Depends to get through it, lol. This is what the instructor said to me:

"I bet you thought I wanted to fail you. Nothing was further from the truth. You were at the top of the class, so I knew I could push you. You were smart & had excellent clinical skills, but you lacked self-confidence. I hope I gave that to you. I look forward to being your colleague"

:redpinkhe She'll never know what a difference she made in my life & in my career. RIP Mrs.S.

[mzrainydayz, BSN, RN]

Don't give up keep on pushing, you can't dwell on what is happening to others in your class. Your program does sound harsh, but you have to make it to the end. Hang in there and keep focusing on your goal to become a RN. I wish you the best of luck:up:

[mama_d, BSN, RN]

In my LPN program, there was only one instructor who truly seemed to care about her students, make herself available to them, and just generally be helpful. The rest seemed to just be there for the paycheck. We had clinical instructors who had never actually done bedside nursing, one who showed up two hours late reeking of alcohol one day (but she was besties with the director, so it was okay), one who tried to fail me b/c I admitted that upon rare occasion I spanked my child. All at a for-profit that got 15 grand out of me.

I'm doing my bridge at a community college with a good rep for their program starting in the spring, along with one of my close friends. I'm praying it's the polar opposite of what I went through the first time.

Makes no sense to me, but it is what it is, and since I couldn't change them I just counted down every day as a little victory over them and that crappy school.

[RHope]

That sounds like the school I went to. But thank God there were a few professional, ethical instructors and managers there too. I stuck close to them. The unreasonable, rude, unprofessional ones, I'm so glad I had no interaction with.