Why DNP and not MD?

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I'm really curious about why the AACN wants all NPs to become DNPs. I understand the notion of "advancing nursing practice" but I think that there's going be a backlash towards this because (1)if you get the additional education, it doesn't mean you actually have the stature of and MD (2) what is it that you actually study? (3)if it requires you to get the same amount of schooling, why not just go for your MD?

Specializes in critical care.

Mods, can we make this a thread where TOS is forgotten?

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Specializes in critical care.
Never really understood the DNP for a leadership position. I mean why not just get an MBA they are cheaper if you shop around in most cases and actually teach useful stuff. Its not like a DNP is going to teach you anything business wise, which If you are gonna be "leading a hospital" you sorta need business. Oh wait, DNPs dont lead hospitals, CEOS do. DNPS wear white koats and pick on other non-dnp nurses because they dont have a Doktur degree.

Look look look at me, I am a doctor wanna be, Got my coat, got my D, I am smart can you not see?

What is so complex about nursing that it needs a doctorate? NOTHING. Pretty sure a med surg text book could be narrowed down to around 40 pages, 29 of which are med administration and the other 11 are wiping front to back.

I hope with all of my heart that one day we work together. I'll make sure your patients ONLY have meds administered and get their butts wiped. You can go ahead and do the rest of the stuff I do. Hopefully you never, ever eff up an order. We'll see how that works for you.

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make sure to get between the crevices. Sometimes those spots are missed. I suppose you all do assessments too, not that anybody ever looks at those, except the next nurse who comes on shift so they can copy paste it. Just make sure not to put a GCS of like 56 like i have seen before lolol, and I am sure there plenty more silly assessment errors since only once in a blue moon does the chart flip to the nursing notes page and i take a glimpse at the horrible assessment skills of most nurses.

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Specializes in Anesthesia.
make sure to get between the crevices. Sometimes those spots are missed. I suppose you all do assessments too, not that anybody ever looks at those, except the next nurse who comes on shift so they can copy paste it. Just make sure not to put a GCS of like 56 like i have seen before lolol, and I am sure there plenty more silly assessment errors since only once in a blue moon does the chart flip to the nursing notes page and i take a glimpse at the horrible assessment skills of most nurses.

What is the most dangerous time of year to be admitted to a hospital, and it has nothing to do with nurses?

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Specializes in critical care.
make sure to get between the crevices. Sometimes those spots are missed. I suppose you all do assessments too, not that anybody ever looks at those, except the next nurse who comes on shift so they can copy paste it. Just make sure not to put a GCS of like 56 like i have seen before lolol, and I am sure there plenty more silly assessment errors since only once in a blue moon does the chart flip to the nursing notes page and i take a glimpse at the horrible assessment skills of most nurses.

This absolute carelessness will kill your patients. Your nurses' notes and assessments are your FIRST clue when your patient is declining. Feel free to ignore that. When you are testifying in your malpractice suit, the ignored nurses' notes and assessments will be the first thing that hangs you.

Gawds, I'm lucky in that I only have one doctor who ignores nurses and thinks we're just pill pushers. He's new. Heck, maybe he's you, for all I know or care. This man ignored me all day when he admitted a patient for r/o MI, but was so OBVIOUSLY a GI issue (to me, anyway - he was God, so obviously he was right). This woman was in absolute agony for my entire shift because he ignored me. Then came the nighttime Hospitalist, who above all trusts the gut instinct of his nurses, and when he came up to assess the patient (and her third episode of projectile vomiting), he ordered a STAT CT and guess which one of us ended up being right? Complete bowel obstruction. This woman suffered horribly because of someone who's attitude is just like yours. The next horrible patient situation he put on me was a patient who never should have been admitted to step down. Always love getting a dying patient from the ED because an idiot can't listen to the urging of the nurses. This guy is going to kill someone one day. How about getting off your high horse and being better than that?

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What is the most dangerous time of year to be admitted to a hospital, and it has nothing to do with nurses?

What is "July"? for 200, Alex.

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My patients home visit NP tried to give me some advice indirectly when she saw me studying (correctly assuming I'm returning to school) and expressed how she wished she never gotten her NP. She got her NP after decades of bed side nursing. One thing she complained about was paying for health insurance and something about retirement. I didn't probe because I never seriously wanted to be an NP. But i did consider it just because I want to advance and advance but I've made up my mind what I want to do and it's not an option not to happen. I do plan on getting my DNP after graduate school but won't touch NP. I am not discouraging the idea to no one but it clarified for me that its possible to regret the decision. One may not be happy but more may be you know? I think you should do as much research as possible and definitely see about shadowing a couple of NP in different fields. Especially more than once in a different facility/environment for the type of NP you're interested in the most. For MD, think about if you want to specialize and what you would want to specialize in. What do you see yourself being happy doing?

There are many Anesthesiologists who say if they did it all over again they'd would just become a CRNA. You can research this yourself. Studentdoctor.net is a good site to get advice (not all!) But also there is a thread made to bash CRNAs and disgusting things were said there about them (mainly jealousy of the high salary). This is a sign that the Internet isn't the best place for advice for a life decision. After you've asked all your questions spend several days at least off the internet and thinking about what YOU want. But first research research research.

I saw your post for what it was. You were not trying to offend any nurses. You are trying to deal with your own doubts and make an important decision for your future. The fact is though this is a nursing forum and you will have people defending nursing and if you ask this on a doctor forum you will see the same thing (except more insults toward nurses). Ultimately you have to make a decision based on what makes you happy. I think it will be helpful to (but not too much) focus in on all the positive things said here and on a doctors forum and then consider the negative things on both sides especially if they come from a good place and compare the two. In the end I think Your factual research about both fields, shadowing and interests are the most important in making your decision.

******EDIT. I just read your about me section. You seem very passionate about nursing. If you do med school just because an extra year is put onto your nursing goals you will be miserable through med school. Do what you love and want to do! You may be able to save time doing a BSN-DNP. Research which schools you would be interested in and compare the routes of BSN-MSN-DNP to BSN-DNP. This would be easiest if you were interested in completing it online. Also did you factor in the time it would take to do the medicine prereqs?

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Did you know about accelerated nursing programs? You could have skipped the adn and got a bachelors in nursing in 1 year with your previous bachelors. That is the importance of research. If you did know this and just didn't get accepted into a program I apologize. I think it would have been a better route. It may still be a smart route unless you do a RN-BSN that is one year. If you only find ones that are 2 years in length just do an Accelerated BSN. Compare th length of time it will take to complete both keeping in mind which already met class requirements from both degrees are able to be transferred in.

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Clinically wise- the DNP is essentially worthless. It sounds like it may have some merit for leadership and research... if you go to a good school. I thought about it for a while but for financial reasons decided to go back to medical school.

Seems like most people defend its purpose on here like its their puppy that chewed up the neighbors lawn ornaments. To those overly defensive about the DNP, check yourself, you may be in for a surprise when it was not all its cracked up to be.

But if you want a terminal degree you may as well get it, there are better options, like not getting it for MOST people, but for those with a hard-on for nursing and really want to lead without getting an MBA or such, it might be an OK idea.

Advancing your practice for the sake of advancing your practice is a motto that schools have come up with to get you to give them your tuition dollars. If you really want more fulfillment, and do not have a monetary end to acquiring a DNP, just go pick up some research books and philosophy and enjoy your life for pennies on the dollar that a DNP would cost.

If nobody else has noticed, they tend to make degree programs for everything, most of which, you could obtain self-fulfillment from reading books free from your public library.

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If you really want to be a physician, by all means do so and pick a good specialty. If I was younger, I would and I wish someone had sat me down and counseled me on this. I was too intimidated with the prospect of going back to school for a long period of time. Now, that my daughter is in pre med, I realize, I should have and could have done it.

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It is monetary worth it. Just takes a long time. I am in my mid 20s so I still have the time, its never too late. People seem to use the word debt to shy away from medical school. Yeah its expensive, but its one of the few expensive degrees worth it, esp if you live in rural areas. Law on the other hand......

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People who tell you that probably do not realize the rewards later on. My friends lived in apartments for the first 5 years after their fellowship and paid off their $300,000 loans and saved money but in 6 years working in their specialty, they have 2- 3 million dollar homes paid for in cash and are debt free and they are in their 40's so they have 20 more years making half a million dollar a year. So yes, go to medical school.

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