Why DNP and not MD?

twinkerrs · Nov 20, 2015

I don't want to be a doctor. I am happy with my role as a nurse practitioner, but I want a terminal degree. I also plan on teaching at some point so a DNP makes sense to me.

The idea is that we all should have the same degree as an entry into practice at an advanced level. More and more professions are moving to this idea

CelticGoddess, BSN, RN · Nov 20, 2015

I'm really curious about why the AACN wants all NPs to become DNPs. I understand the notion of "advancing nursing practice" but I think that there's going be a backlash towards this because (1)if you get the additional education, it doesn't mean you actually have the stature of and MD (2) what is it that you actually study? (3)if it requires you to get the same amount of schooling, why not just go for your MD?

An MD has to do additional residency. And depending on the type of residency that can be 4 to 8 years. So no, it doesn't require the same amount of study

TheCommuter, BSN, RN · Nov 20, 2015

Why obtain the DNP degree and not the MD?

Nursing is part of the nursing model of care provision, not the medical model. Therefore, putting the DNP degree up against the MD would be like comparing apples to banana loaf bread.

In addition, not all DNPs are providers or APNs. Many people have earned the DNP degree with a non-clinical specialization area such as nursing education, leadership or informatics.

klone, MSN, RN · Nov 20, 2015

Nurses who get their DNPs do so because they want a terminal NURSING degree, not to become a physician. Most nurses who get their DNPs have already been nurses for several years. It's not like it's an 18yo kid, planning their career path, here. In what world would it be feasible, for someone in her 30s or 40s who has been working as an RN for several years, and decides she wants to get a graduate degree to become a licensed care provider, to apply to medical school? In most cases it's completely not feasible, even if she WANTED to become a physician.

This is such an illogical question to begin with. Why do people who ask this question assume that someone who is getting their DNP is doing so because they want to be little mini physicians? Do you ask this question of pharmacists? Physical therapists? Why the hell is the field of nursing so disrespected that you would dare to ask that question of us? We get nursing degrees because we want to be NURSES, not physicians.

koreanjohn32 · Nov 20, 2015

Why is it illogical? I'm an RN trying to decide if I want to go for an advanced degree that allows me to become a provider. But if I have to spend just about as much time doing it, why stop short of being an MD, with, sorry, a lot more stature and scope of practice than a DNP? It's about effort/money/time vs. Outcome

klone, MSN, RN · Nov 20, 2015

Why is it illogical? I'm an RN trying to decide if I want to go for an advanced degree that allows me to become a provider. But if I have to spend just about as much time doing it, why stop short of being an MD, with, sorry, a lot more stature and scope of practice than a DNP? It's about effort/money/time vs. Outcome

If you want to be a physician, go to medical school. If "stature" is that important to you, then by all means, you absolutely should become a physician, rather than stay a lowly nurse. G-d forbid.

But no, the schooling is not equivalent. Physicians go through 4 years of undergrad, 4 years of medical school, and 4 years of residency, and then possibly 2 years of fellowship. That's 12-14 years of schooling.

An NP goes through 4 years of undergrad, and then 3-5 years of graduate school. The NP also has the option of working as an NP WHILE completing the DNP portion. That's 7-9 years of schooling. Clearly not the same.

klone, MSN, RN · Nov 20, 2015

Sorry, I've been a bit prickly in this thread.

koreanjohn32 · Nov 20, 2015

I understand. I actually want to be an NP as well, but just not spend more than what is currently required by law, to essentially get more education for something that doesn't further my scope of practice. If you're already an NP, then it makes sense to continue. But, it doesn't make as much sense for someone who is an ADN seeking to advance. For just a bit more time, there's another option. If the law remains where it does, I may continue on and get my MNP.

Also, with the shortage of providers, especially in rural areas like the one I live in, we NEED NPs and PAs. But, how does making it harder for someone to get their NP, adding more education requirements, that don't essentially make you a better NP, help that?

I understand what it does for the profession, but I do NOT understand how it helps America or nurses like me who want to get out there?

Bluebolt · Nov 20, 2015

If it's the extra requirements for the CRNP program you're concerned about, I have good news. The DNP actually just adds a year onto the education length if you go for a BSN to DNP program. Actually a lot of the programs even have this year as hybrid online learning so you can go at your own pace.

As some mentioned before the education length between MD/DO and DNP is different mostly because of the required residency which the shortest specialties are 3 years and can extend for 8 years for rare specialties. During that residency they are "practicing" but under the supervision of another MD, they work 60 hours a week and make roughly $11/hr. As a CRNP student you'll complete many clinical hours over your three year DNP program (easier version of "residency") while working on your academic portion at the same time. I know many fellow ICU RN's who worked at least part time earning income while doing all this. Yes, they were extremely busy and stressed but it doable.

The cost of an MD program which you can not work through vs a CRNP-DNP program that you probably can work at least part time though is different. I work closely with residents at a teaching hospital and they are typically $200,000 to $300,000 in debt with interest accruing while in residency. A DNP program shouldn't cost you more than $50,000 and many RN's work through school to help cover most if not all the tuition as they go.

I think it's reasonable and progressive to require a Doctorate for all APRN's. If they're advancing the nursing field and giving more autonomy, salary and respect then shouldn't we show that we're willing to do the academic and clinical work to warrant that? You won't have the "stature?" of an MD just like a psychologist, optometrist and pharmacist doesn't but you will be a doctorate level health care professional with great pay, great quality of life and the ability to heal your patients.

koreanjohn32 · Nov 20, 2015

Thanks for the thoughtful reply. That actually really helps me

sauce · Nov 20, 2015

What blue bolt said is probably the thought process wanted by the author of this topic. Not so much klones post. Nurses are so touchy why would somebody get mad at an innocent question. Monetarily if u can hold out its worth being a physician. 250k in loans isn't squat. The docs around my parts make 300k plus. Every specialty. Rural medicine makes bank