Tom Cruise on Postpartum depression

oldiebutgoodie, RN · Jul 10, 2005

what really sucks the most about all this, is I wanted to go see "War of the Worlds".
but now I can't because he's such a dangerous and offensive lunatic, and I promised myself to never give him another dollar.

I agree! I will NOT go see "War of the Worlds" now. I'm sure Tom is tossing and turning as a result of my decision! :rolleyes:

But what is scary is that there will be some depressed postpartum women out there who will be unduly influenced by his comments. What a shame. Although I didn't have postpartum depression, I did suffer from major depression in the past, and antidepressants gave me back my life.

And on a gossipy note (Disclaimer: no social redeeming value in the following comments)

Years ago, when he and Mimi Rogers divorced, the scandal sheets said that he was infertile and she wanted kids. He married Nicole, and they adopted 2 kids. Could this be an interesting defense mechanism?? I also agree about the mania stuff. What's with climbing all over the couches? My mother would have whomped me up side the head for doing that stuff!

oldiebutgoodie

doggiedaddy · Jul 10, 2005

define "cult". Be really careful.

based on the work of the late Dr. Margaret Singer, the world's leading authority of cults and mind control.

The cult is authoritarian in its power structure. The leader is regarded as the supreme authority. He or she may delegate certain power to a few subordinates for the purpose of seeing that members adhere to the leader's wishes and roles. There is no appeal outside of his or her system to greater systems of justice. For example, if a school teacher

feels unjustly treated by a principal, appeals can be made. In a cult, the leader claims to have the only and final ruling on all matters.

The cult's leaders tend to be charismatic, determined, and

domineering. They persuade followers to drop their families, jobs, careers, and friends to follow them. They (not the individual) then take over control of their followers' possessions, money, lives.

The cult's leaders are self-appointed, messianic persons who claim to have a special mission in life. For example, the flying saucer cult leaders claim that people from outer space have commissioned them to lead people to special places to await a space ship.

The cult's leaders center the veneration of members upon themselves. Priests, rabbis, ministers, democratic leaders, and leaders of genuinely altruistic movements keep the veneration of adherents focused on God, abstract principles, and group purposes. Cult leaders, in contrast, keep the focus of love, devotion, and allegiance on themselves.

The cult tends to be totalitarian in its control of the behavior of its members. Cults are likely to dictate in great detail what members wear, eat, when and where they work, sleep, and bathe-as well as what to believe, think, and say.

The cult tends to have a double set of ethics. Members are urged to be open and honest within the group, and confess all to the leaders. On the other hand, they are encouraged to deceive and manipulate outsiders or nonmembers. Established religions teach members to be honest and truthful to all, and to abide by one set of ethics.

The cult has basically only two purposes, recruiting new members and fund-raising. Established religions and altruistic movements may also recruit and raise funds. However, their sole purpose is not to grow larger; such groups have the goals to better the lives of their members

and mankind in general. The cults may claim to make social

contributions, but in actuality these remain mere claims, or gestures. Their focus is always dominated by recruiting new members and fund-raising.

The cult appears to be innovative and exclusive. The leader claims to be breaking with tradition, offering something novel, and instituting the only viable system for change that will solve life's problems or the world's ills. While claiming this, the cult then surreptitiously uses systems of psychological coercion on its members to inhibit their

ability to examine the actual validity of the claims of the leader and the cult.

Cause you could very easily define many "mainstream" religions like Christianity of many denominations as cults.

no you can't. not if you plan to adhere to the academic definition of cult. that is, the definition used by medical professionals, law enforcement agencies, presented in hundreds of hours of Congressional testimony, etc., etc.

It's all about perspective and what people do and don't accept as religion in their lives.

how very relativistic of you. lets extend that to "its all about what people do and don't accept as theft". or "its all about what people do and don't accept as rape." yeah, i suppose someone could claim that there's some gray area in those concepts, and because of that the entire word is meaningless -- so lets not be mean to people and call them rapists or thieves.

I have no desire to go to sites that paint religions as "crackpots.com" thank you.

"la la la la i'm not listening to you" ! LOL. lets see, shall we (a) investigate facts, or (b) jump to conclusions?

i realize that conclusion-jumping is much easier and self-satisfying than fact-checking, but if you were to bother to look, you would see that that site is devoted solely to the accumulation of evidence on the dangerous practices of "NARCONON", how they circumvent the law and established medical science. exclusively. it is not in any way shape or form an attack on any religion or on religions in general.

Try this one instead to truly challenge yourself, open your mind, and possibly learn something: http://www.religioustolerance.org

yes, thats a very nice site. very good if you want broad and consise summaries of complicated issues. is a perfect companion RELIGION 101: Intro to World Religions.

It gives us a more indepth look at the varying religions of the world. No---- it's not a perfectly definitive site, but it does give you a more objective view point of many of the world's religious systems and places to go for ACCURATE research.

unlike cults, "in-depth" is a relative term.

Be careful what you call a "cult". To some, Catholicism could be considered such, based on THEIR viewpoints.

yeah, youve already said that. and again, no, catholics can't be considered cults by the academic definintion of cult.

Example: Jehovahs Witnesses who allow no blood products. How "crazy" is it to disallow a lifesaving blood or platelet transfusion, even auto-transfusion. Why they "must" be a "cult" right?

well, JW's actually do fit some of the criteria for cult status. but it's not because of their views on medicine.

Like I said, be careful what you are saying here.

yeah, thanks for the reminder.

twinmommy+2, ADN, BSN, MSN · Jul 10, 2005

Andrea Yates is a perfect example of how "clueless" men are to all of this in general. Her husband had to know that she was having (and had had) troubles with depression. Yet he apparently ignored this.

Unfortunatly, he did know. They had her commited and the insurance wouldn't pay for more treatment so they had to discharge her. He tryed to have a family member watch her for a time too but that didn't work either cause she just waited till everyone left. There were several failures in this case and not all the husbands or families.

LydiaNN · Jul 10, 2005

based on the work of the late Dr. Margaret Singer, the world's leading authority of cults and mind control.
The cult is authoritarian in its power structure. The leader is regarded as the supreme authority. He or she may delegate certain power to a few subordinates for the purpose of seeing that members adhere to the leader's wishes and roles. There is no appeal outside of his or her system to greater systems of justice. For example, if a school teacher
feels unjustly treated by a principal, appeals can be made. In a cult, the leader claims to have the only and final ruling on all matters.
The cult's leaders tend to be charismatic, determined, and
domineering. They persuade followers to drop their families, jobs, careers, and friends to follow them. They (not the individual) then take over control of their followers' possessions, money, lives.
The cult's leaders are self-appointed, messianic persons who claim to have a special mission in life. For example, the flying saucer cult leaders claim that people from outer space have commissioned them to lead people to special places to await a space ship.
The cult's leaders center the veneration of members upon themselves. Priests, rabbis, ministers, democratic leaders, and leaders of genuinely altruistic movements keep the veneration of adherents focused on God, abstract principles, and group purposes. Cult leaders, in contrast, keep the focus of love, devotion, and allegiance on themselves.
The cult tends to be totalitarian in its control of the behavior of its members. Cults are likely to dictate in great detail what members wear, eat, when and where they work, sleep, and bathe-as well as what to believe, think, and say.
The cult tends to have a double set of ethics. Members are urged to be open and honest within the group, and confess all to the leaders. On the other hand, they are encouraged to deceive and manipulate outsiders or nonmembers. Established religions teach members to be honest and truthful to all, and to abide by one set of ethics.
The cult has basically only two purposes, recruiting new members and fund-raising. Established religions and altruistic movements may also recruit and raise funds. However, their sole purpose is not to grow larger; such groups have the goals to better the lives of their members
and mankind in general. The cults may claim to make social
contributions, but in actuality these remain mere claims, or gestures. Their focus is always dominated by recruiting new members and fund-raising.
The cult appears to be innovative and exclusive. The leader claims to be breaking with tradition, offering something novel, and instituting the only viable system for change that will solve life's problems or the world's ills. While claiming this, the cult then surreptitiously uses systems of psychological coercion on its members to inhibit their
ability to examine the actual validity of the claims of the leader and the cult.
no you can't. not if you plan to adhere to the academic definition of cult. that is, the definition used by medical professionals, law enforcement agencies, presented in hundreds of hours of Congressional testimony, etc., etc.
how very relativistic of you. lets extend that to "its all about what people do and don't accept as theft". or "its all about what people do and don't accept as rape." yeah, i suppose someone could claim that there's some gray area in those concepts, and because of that the entire word is meaningless -- so lets not be mean to people and call them rapists or thieves.
"la la la la i'm not listening to you" ! LOL. lets see, shall we (a) investigate facts, or (b) jump to conclusions?
i realize that conclusion-jumping is much easier and self-satisfying than fact-checking, but if you were to bother to look, you would see that that site is devoted solely to the accumulation of evidence on the dangerous practices of "NARCONON", how they circumvent the law and established medical science. exclusively. it is not in any way shape or form an attack on any religion or on religions in general.
yes, thats a very nice site. very good if you want broad and consise summaries of complicated issues. is a perfect companion RELIGION 101: Intro to World Religions.
unlike cults, "in-depth" is a relative term.
yeah, youve already said that. and again, no, catholics can't be considered cults by the academic definintion of cult.
well, JW's actually do fit some of the criteria for cult status. but it's not because of their views on medicine.
yeah, thanks for the reminder.

:yeahthat:

SmilingBluEyes · Jul 10, 2005

based on the work of the late Dr. Margaret Singer, the world's leading authority of cults and mind control.
The cult is authoritarian in its power structure. The leader is regarded as the supreme authority. He or she may delegate certain power to a few subordinates for the purpose of seeing that members adhere to the leader's wishes and roles. There is no appeal outside of his or her system to greater systems of justice. For example, if a school teacher
feels unjustly treated by a principal, appeals can be made. In a cult, the leader claims to have the only and final ruling on all matters.
The cult's leaders tend to be charismatic, determined, and
domineering. They persuade followers to drop their families, jobs, careers, and friends to follow them. They (not the individual) then take over control of their followers' possessions, money, lives.
The cult's leaders are self-appointed, messianic persons who claim to have a special mission in life. For example, the flying saucer cult leaders claim that people from outer space have commissioned them to lead people to special places to await a space ship.
The cult's leaders center the veneration of members upon themselves. Priests, rabbis, ministers, democratic leaders, and leaders of genuinely altruistic movements keep the veneration of adherents focused on God, abstract principles, and group purposes. Cult leaders, in contrast, keep the focus of love, devotion, and allegiance on themselves.
The cult tends to be totalitarian in its control of the behavior of its members. Cults are likely to dictate in great detail what members wear, eat, when and where they work, sleep, and bathe-as well as what to believe, think, and say.
The cult tends to have a double set of ethics. Members are urged to be open and honest within the group, and confess all to the leaders. On the other hand, they are encouraged to deceive and manipulate outsiders or nonmembers. Established religions teach members to be honest and truthful to all, and to abide by one set of ethics.
The cult has basically only two purposes, recruiting new members and fund-raising. Established religions and altruistic movements may also recruit and raise funds. However, their sole purpose is not to grow larger; such groups have the goals to better the lives of their members
and mankind in general. The cults may claim to make social
contributions, but in actuality these remain mere claims, or gestures. Their focus is always dominated by recruiting new members and fund-raising.
The cult appears to be innovative and exclusive. The leader claims to be breaking with tradition, offering something novel, and instituting the only viable system for change that will solve life's problems or the world's ills. While claiming this, the cult then surreptitiously uses systems of psychological coercion on its members to inhibit their
ability to examine the actual validity of the claims of the leader and the cult.
no you can't. not if you plan to adhere to the academic definition of cult. that is, the definition used by medical professionals, law enforcement agencies, presented in hundreds of hours of Congressional testimony, etc., etc.
how very relativistic of you. lets extend that to "its all about what people do and don't accept as theft". or "its all about what people do and don't accept as rape." yeah, i suppose someone could claim that there's some gray area in those concepts, and because of that the entire word is meaningless -- so lets not be mean to people and call them rapists or thieves.
"la la la la i'm not listening to you" ! LOL. lets see, shall we (a) investigate facts, or (b) jump to conclusions?
i realize that conclusion-jumping is much easier and self-satisfying than fact-checking, but if you were to bother to look, you would see that that site is devoted solely to the accumulation of evidence on the dangerous practices of "NARCONON", how they circumvent the law and established medical science. exclusively. it is not in any way shape or form an attack on any religion or on religions in general.
yes, thats a very nice site. very good if you want broad and consise summaries of complicated issues. is a perfect companion RELIGION 101: Intro to World Religions.
unlike cults, "in-depth" is a relative term.
yeah, youve already said that. and again, no, catholics can't be considered cults by the academic definintion of cult.
well, JW's actually do fit some of the criteria for cult status. but it's not because of their views on medicine.
yeah, thanks for the reminder.

then you can define many if not all organized religions as "cults", based on what you are saying.

I dont' buy it.

I really am tired of seeing people slam others' belief systems in general when they know or understand so little about them. What Cruise has said is very wrong---not because he is scientologist. Have you read L. Ron Hubbard's books? Do you KNOW anyone who practices scientology?

Hmm, but let's be careful about slamming or broad-brush painting other belief systems when we really dont' know all there is to about them. For you, it's a cult; for others, it's a religion or way of life. Like I said, you can paint Jehovah's Witnesses, and people/communities such as Amish or Mennonite/Hudderite as "cultists", based on your judgements here. I would rather not. You, nor I, alone, get to define what is legitimate or not based on "wacko" religion websites or other references, just because "we choose to".

Oh and the site I refer to? If you wanted to go beyond "religion 101" as you put it, you need to check out the NUMEROUS references, books, sites and other materials to which they refer. It's like anything else, you have to do a bit of work to learn more. Much like learning in general, be it formalized, university degree pursuit or reading up to understand more.

Shoot, Anyone can go to a website that supports his or her beliefs and proclaim it as gospel, but that does not make it so! Sorry.

nurse_wannabe · Jul 10, 2005

well, as i've been living in a bubble for the past 3 weeks i hadn't heard anything about this. i haven't been able to find the script for his original comments about brooke shields, but i did find a today show interview where he was asked about those comments here, just in case any of you are living in a bubble, too:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8343367/

after reading this, i agree that he is definitely going off his rocker. i've never liked him as an actor or a person, and this further solidifies my feelings about him.

SmilingBluEyes · Jul 10, 2005

Not living in a bubble, here. I saw the interview. I read his comments. I also read Ms. Sheild's interviews/words after them. I think she is handling herself and the situation very well. She does not seem to need anyone to defend her at all. I would rather focus on her strength and brilliance in handling things at this point, than the ravings of Tom Cruise.

SmilingBluEyes · Jul 10, 2005

based on the work of the late Dr. Margaret Singer, the world's leading authority of cults and mind control.
The cult is authoritarian in its power structure. The leader is regarded as the supreme authority. He or she may delegate certain power to a few subordinates for the purpose of seeing that members adhere to the leader's wishes and roles. There is no appeal outside of his or her system to greater systems of justice. For example, if a school teacher
feels unjustly treated by a principal, appeals can be made. In a cult, the leader claims to have the only and final ruling on all matters.
The cult's leaders tend to be charismatic, determined, and
domineering. They persuade followers to drop their families, jobs, careers, and friends to follow them. They (not the individual) then take over control of their followers' possessions, money, lives.
The cult's leaders are self-appointed, messianic persons who claim to have a special mission in life. For example, the flying saucer cult leaders claim that people from outer space have commissioned them to lead people to special places to await a space ship.
The cult's leaders center the veneration of members upon themselves. Priests, rabbis, ministers, democratic leaders, and leaders of genuinely altruistic movements keep the veneration of adherents focused on God, abstract principles, and group purposes. Cult leaders, in contrast, keep the focus of love, devotion, and allegiance on themselves.
The cult tends to be totalitarian in its control of the behavior of its members. Cults are likely to dictate in great detail what members wear, eat, when and where they work, sleep, and bathe-as well as what to believe, think, and say.
The cult tends to have a double set of ethics. Members are urged to be open and honest within the group, and confess all to the leaders. On the other hand, they are encouraged to deceive and manipulate outsiders or nonmembers. Established religions teach members to be honest and truthful to all, and to abide by one set of ethics.
The cult has basically only two purposes, recruiting new members and fund-raising. Established religions and altruistic movements may also recruit and raise funds. However, their sole purpose is not to grow larger; such groups have the goals to better the lives of their members
and mankind in general. The cults may claim to make social
contributions, but in actuality these remain mere claims, or gestures. Their focus is always dominated by recruiting new members and fund-raising.
The cult appears to be innovative and exclusive. The leader claims to be breaking with tradition, offering something novel, and instituting the only viable system for change that will solve life's problems or the world's ills. While claiming this, the cult then surreptitiously uses systems of psychological coercion on its members to inhibit their
ability to examine the actual validity of the claims of the leader and the cult.
no you can't. not if you plan to adhere to the academic definition of cult. that is, the definition used by medical professionals, law enforcement agencies, presented in hundreds of hours of Congressional testimony, etc., etc.
how very relativistic of you. lets extend that to "its all about what people do and don't accept as theft". or "its all about what people do and don't accept as rape." yeah, i suppose someone could claim that there's some gray area in those concepts, and because of that the entire word is meaningless -- so lets not be mean to people and call them rapists or thieves.
"la la la la i'm not listening to you" ! LOL. lets see, shall we (a) investigate facts, or (b) jump to conclusions?
i realize that conclusion-jumping is much easier and self-satisfying than fact-checking, but if you were to bother to look, you would see that that site is devoted solely to the accumulation of evidence on the dangerous practices of "NARCONON", how they circumvent the law and established medical science. exclusively. it is not in any way shape or form an attack on any religion or on religions in general.
yes, thats a very nice site. very good if you want broad and consise summaries of complicated issues. is a perfect companion RELIGION 101: Intro to World Religions.
unlike cults, "in-depth" is a relative term.
yeah, youve already said that. and again, no, catholics can't be considered cults by the academic definintion of cult.
well, JW's actually do fit some of the criteria for cult status. but it's not because of their views on medicine.
yeah, thanks for the reminder.

You know, I have noticed a decidedly sarcastic and rude tone from you on several occasions and more than one thread here.....("lalala I am not listening to you")? nice.

so, could you please tune down the insults, barbs, and patrionizing way you choose to express your views? I am not doing this to you----

great, stimulating debate need not include inflammatory words and insulting tones. You do nothing for "your point" by being insulting and sacarstic with me. It's hard to see your point at all, or even care to--- when it's put this way.

Thank you. :)

z's playa · Jul 10, 2005

Awwww rats !

Another interesting thread doomed to be closed. :chuckle

Z

(this is not directed at anybody in particular BTW)

SmilingBluEyes · Jul 10, 2005

I don't want to see it closed. But I do wish it could remain free of insulting and derogatory words and tones.

z's playa · Jul 10, 2005

Not living in a bubble, here. I saw the interview. I read his comments. I also read Ms. Sheild's interviews/words after them. I think she is handling herself and the situation very well. She does not seem to need anyone to defend her at all. I would rather focus on her strength and brilliance in handling things at this point, than the ravings of Tom Cruise.

Yes. Shields sounds like she is doing great isn't she? I didn't hear first hand but from what I've read here....... :)

Z

SmilingBluEyes · Jul 10, 2005

I read a portion of a recent interview she had and she sounds ever-stronger and more determined than ever to educate others about her odyssey into depression and out again. She sounds upbeat, positive and looks radiant.

THAT is what I would love to focus on, (just personally), not the negative ravings of people like Tom Cruise, or even religion. No one "wins" a religious debate. WE all know THAT.