This was interesting in the news today...

Published

https://www.npr.org/2023/02/16/1157480905/spain-menstrual-leave-teen-abortion-trans-laws

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The abortion law builds on legislation passed in 2010 that represented a major shift for a traditionally Catholic country, transforming Spain into one of the most progressive countries in Europe on reproductive rights. Spain's constitutional court last week rejected a challenge by the right-wing Popular Party against allowing abortions in the first 14 weeks of pregnancy.

The debate will be heated in Spain, I imagine, as the conservative opposition pushes back. My daughter had horrible menstrual pain during her adolescence and young adulthood.  I'm certain that she would have benefitted from that time. 

Specializes in Case Management.
nursej22 said:

Sure stock prices are going up, and that is going to be handy when insurance premiums and drug prices go up. 

 

Supply and demand. That has pretty much happened since, well, long before either of us were alive. Of course like anything else, there are other forces at play as well. Drugs-wise, generics bring prices down (though this is admittedly a gross oversimplification) and I won't even bother getting into artificial prices that are affected by government subsidies (as the taxpayers' money isn't counted in the end-price). As for insurance, my late pappy had it right: Insurance is legalized racketerring. Of course, if you look upon the history of insurance, that is pretty much how it started in the first place. You want to pay us for protection, right? Yeah, you know you do.

Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
Brewingbiker said:

won't even bother getting into artificial prices that are affected by government subsidies (as the taxpayers' money isn't counted in the end-price).

I'm wondering if you are talking about the government subsidizing things like vaccines or insulin.  I'm interested in your thoughts.  

Specializes in Med-Surg.
subee said:

It really  only matters what your money is worth on the day you need to pull it out.  I needed to buy a new car (not a want, a need) and I'm grateful that I could buy it before Trump took office because I knew he was going to pull this tariff crap again.  It's the only economic trick he knows.  But we will be frought with volatility as long as he's in office.  When I lost bigly in 2008, I bought a copy of The Wall Street Waltz which was way over my head, but it did give me a sense of the kind of intelligence it requires to get through all those charts!  IMHO, it's wise of Powell to remain conservative re: the interests rates because with a nut job like Trump in office, we all have too much to lose.  Trump is more interested in his short term stats rather than the longer term interests of his constituents.  May the market be kind to you before you retire and may you have very few "need" days.  

You are correct that it matters what is going on when you need the money.

I lost bigly in 2008 along with all investors.  I did have the benefit of time and it took years to for it to come back.  I lost not so bigly under Biden and that took a while to come back.   Younger people have the benefit of time which is why as we age, we need to have financial advisors to lower the risk as we approach when we are going to need to remove the cash.  I several friend who are not in the market at all but are still able to draw good incomes off their former investments.  That should be the goal.

Interesting that before you knew before Trump took office you knew it would happen.  Investors didn't seem to know this as stocks rose and continued months into him being in office. Investors were looking forward to tax cuts and a someone that would eliminate regulations weren't thinking about tariffs.  I keep records over time and I can see starting in November 2025 my investments started to rise and was at an all time high on 1/31/25. But by April a year's worth of gains were wiped away rather quickly.  That's when some of us went into "the sky is falling mode".

I think when people criticize us for "the sky is falling mode" they don't understand that some of us are in our sixties near retirement and have saved consistently for our working lives, that industry eliminated pensions in the 90s, that SSI raised the age of retirement in the 80's, and we are on our own and don't have the benefit of years to wait for a recovery.  We are going to have to pay for medicare and a supplement and that isn't cheap for us middle class people.   We have a lot to worry about.  

Many of us don't have a lot of money in these 401K's and to see 25% disappear is gut wrenching.

A few months later things have settled and I'm back at an all time high and the sky didn't fall.  I think now investors are wise to Trump.  When he first announced those ridiculous tariffs the sky was falling.  Now they see how he uses them.  He threatens high tariffs, backs out, extends the deadline and gets a deal.  It's a less volatile now over tariffs and his flip flops.

  He just did this with the EU threatened outrageous tariffs, and got a deal and investments.  

https://www.cnbc.com/2025/07/27/stock-market-today-live-updates.html

He also did this with the Thai-Cambodian military disputes "figure it out or you're going to get high tariffs" and they just agreed to a cease fire today.

https://www.cnbc.com/2025/07/27/stock-market-today-live-updates.html

 

 

Specializes in Med-Surg.
nursej22 said:

Sure stock prices are going up, and that is going to be handy when insurance premiums and drug prices go up. 

 

I wanted to do a deeper dive in this drive by statement.  I do know many pharmaceuticals are manufactured in places like India.  I do also know there are deeper problems that in the US the same drug is more expensive here than in places like Canada.  It's a mess.

Again, we are blaming the other countries for taking advantage of us, but we have ourselves to blame.  Will the tariffs in the long run fix things?  We'll see.  Will they raises prices in the short term.  Probably.

https://www.medicaleconomics.com/view/how-will-tariffs-affect-prescription-drugs-get-ready-for-price-increases

Quote

In the last 20 years, much of the manufacturing has shifted overseas — but not like heavy production seeking cheap labor, such as auto makers opening plants in Mexico or China. Instead, drug makers have sought out favorable tax policies and have moved to high-income countries, with Switzerland, Ireland and Germany among the leaders, Ballreich said.

In the last 10 years, drug imports have more than doubled in worth, from $100 billion to more than $215 billion, he said, citing U.S. Customs data.

"So, we are now sourcing a lot of our branded drugs from overseas from high income countries because of tax policy,” Ballreich said.

About health insurance.  Obamacare is expected to rise next year.  I'm sure most of these people don't have investments to draw from for health care.  

https://www.npr.org/sections/shots-health-news/2025/07/18/nx-s1-5471281/aca-health-insurance-premiums-obamacare-bbb-kff

On a side note, I've noticed for myself I don't need healthcare much.  But when I went to the dentist when I never had a copay, I paid $41.36 (weird number) co-pay.  When I went to my PCP for a routine medication review it was $30 (used to be zero and then 25).  I went to a free standing ER last Monday and my co-pay was $250.  Used to be zero and then for a while was $100.  So while my health insurance costs per paycheck has risen in small amounts the co-pays have gone up.  

So it's us with the means to have healthcare and pay our bills that will be funding those who don't pay their bills or have insurance.  

 

Specializes in Med-Surg.
toomuchbaloney said:

I'm wondering if you are talking about the government subsidizing things like vaccines or insulin.  I'm interested in your thoughts.  

I was interested in this too.  Google AI mode summarizes several sites:

Quote

government subsidies for drug for prescription drugs - Google Search

 Summarize

Government subsidies for prescription drugs

The United States government offers various programs to help individuals afford prescription medications, primarily through Medicare and Medicaid. 

1. Medicare Part D Low-Income Subsidy (LIS) - "Extra Help"

Purpose: Assists Medicare beneficiaries with limited income and resources in paying for their Part D prescription drug plan costs, including premiums, deductibles, and copayments.

Eligibility: Income up to 150% of the Federal Poverty Level (FPL) and meet specific resource limits.

Benefits (2025): No Part D deductible, no Part D premiums, reduced copayments (e.g., $4.90 for generics, $12.15 for brand-name drugs), and eliminates the coverage gap (often referred to as the "donut hole").

Application: Apply through the Social Security Administration (SSA) online, by phone, or at a local office. 

2. Medicaid

Prescription Drugs - Medicaid

Prescription Drugs. Medicaid is a joint Federal-State program that pays for medical assistance for individuals and families with low incomes and relatively few ...

Apply for Medicare Part D Extra Help program | SSA

Apply for Medicare Part D Extra Help program. The Extra Help program helps people with limited income and resources lower or cut Part D costs. Medicare Part D p...

Social Security Administration (.gov)

7 Programs to Help Pay for Medications - BuzzRx

Mar 14, 2024 — Medicaid. Medicaid is a joint federal and state-funded government program that helps people with limited incomes pay for health care costs, including prescripti...

Purpose: Joint federal-state program covering medical costs, including prescription drugs, for low-income individuals and families.

Coverage: All states offer outpatient prescription drug coverage.

Cost-sharing: Federal law limits cost-sharing (copayments) for beneficiaries with incomes below 150% of the FPL.

Mechanism: Uses a drug rebate program where manufacturers pay rebates to states, shared with the federal government, to offset drug costs.

Application: Contact your State Medicaid Office to check eligibility and apply. 

3. Other programs and strategies

State Pharmaceutical Assistance Programs (SPAPs): State-funded programs (available in roughly half of the states and one territory) providing assistance with drug costs, particularly for low-income and medically needy older adults and people with disabilities.

Patient Assistance Programs (PAPs): Offered by drug manufacturers and other organizations to help uninsured or underinsured patients access medications at reduced or no cost.

Medicare Prescription Payment Plan (starting 2025): This plan allows you to spread out-of-pocket prescription drug costs over the calendar year, rather than paying them all upfront. This is a payment option, not a subsidy, and doesn't directly lower medication prices. 

Note: Eligibility requirements for these programs vary. Contact the relevant agencies or organizations to determine if you qualify. You can also find resources and assistance through organizations like the National Council on Aging (NCOA) and the Center for Medicare Advocacy. 

 

Specializes in Public Health, TB.

Employers are paying a great deal for insurance programs for their employees, so it's not just those of us individuals paying to cover those who can't. I've sat on several union contract negotiating committees and insurance costs were always rising, along with deductibles and co-pays. 

I never needed much health care either until I got to age 63, and then hoo boy, the expenses shot up, due to an inherited heart condition. My sister has the same condition in a more advanced state, and her medication costs would be well over $1500 a month, without her Medicare and Medicaid. I am concerned how that will change. 

My point is, as Americans we are not only paying for health care, we are supporting the insurance companies. I agree, they are legalized racketeering. 

Specializes in Med-Surg.
nursej22 said:

United Health Care became the scapegoat of all our frustrations because of the murder of their CEO.  However in very few ways are they different than any other huge insurance company.  Our case managers have to deal with Humana and getting patients what they need post discharge is really a pain, they rarely approve of acute rehab for example, saying instead the patient can go to a cheaper nursing home. Same with BCBS which wants "preauthorization" for certain things that they ultimately decline.  They just now have the benefit of the eye off of them and on UHC and can take a look at how to avoid some of the bad publicity themselves.  

I agree about employers paying a high cost to insure their employees.  My employer says they pay 80% of my premium (less for family plans which are more expensive) but they also pay for short term and long term disability insurance.  So I really shouldn't complain.  But again these premiums they pay fund the healthcare of those that don't have insurance or can pay their copays.  

 

Specializes in Public Health, TB.
Tweety said:

 

I agree about employers paying a high cost to insure their employees.  My employer says they pay 80% of my premium (less for family plans which are more expensive) but they also pay for short term and long term disability insurance.  So I really shouldn't complain.  But again these premiums they pay fund the healthcare of those that don't have insurance or can pay their copays.  

 

These premiums pay for a lot more than the uninsured. They pay for the salaries of a huge corporation, they pay for hackable data bases, they pay for staff who job is to refuse and delay payments,  millions in compensation for executives, and dividends to share holders.

My tax dollars pay for government workers who are not paid millions and do not go to dividends for shareholders. 

Specializes in Med-Surg.
Beerman said:

You are absolutely correct,  and I apologize.

appreciated

nursej22 said:

These premiums pay for a lot more than the uninsured. They pay for the salaries of a huge corporation, they pay for hackable data bases, they pay for staff who job is to refuse and delay payments,  millions in compensation for executives, and dividends to share holders.

My tax dollars pay for government workers who are not paid millions and do not go to dividends for shareholders. 

Well they enriched Senator Scott but  digress and agee

Specializes in CRNA, Finally retired.
Beerman said:

Which is what I was alluding to when I made that comment the other day.

I guess you guys only pay attention when you hear that the sky is falling.

Oh yeah.  These are great times to be alive.  I'm grateful for antibiotics, a good education and vaccines but that's about it.  My eyes are wide open.

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