to me, it's the ultimate measure of desperation on the part of nurses to develop independence from physicians. that it has been turned into a "science" demeans the nursing profession terribly!
while there can be certainly a psychological/placebo effect, the seriousness with which even some phd's in nursing believe in literal truth of therapeutic touch simply amazes me.
it's witchcraft. sheer absolute nonsense in its highest refined form. the techniques are quite laughable, and have no place in medicine, any more than folk remedies supplied by witch doctors.
yet at virtually every major university, there are ladies with phd's running around who literally believe they've developed these powers in their hands. that they can "ruffle" and "realign" forces.
to many, this is the holy grail of nursing. to me, it's delusionary.
I am quite surprised at the resistance to be open to other forms of treatment and care. I have been doing a lot of reading and experimenting with all different forms of alternative medicine. It works! The first thing is to be open to possibilities, and I am seeing a lot of resistance here in this thread. The other is to educate yourself more on it before you slam the door on it. Alternative care comes from energy, love and connection, which I believe is why most nurses got into this profession in the first place. Unfortunately our health care system and stress has hardened a lot of people. In my eyes it is sad. I feel the pain that people are carrying and only wish for you that you would stop, breathe and quiet the body and mind for a moment to see where you really are. If at this point, you are saying I am full of &%$# then I rest my case. I wish you well all the same. For those of you who are more open to this, or at least curious, watch a movie called "What the Bleep do we know", available at most video stores, as well as "The Secret" which you can order on line from http://www.thesecret.tv/ If you take time to notice, there is a real shift in the world. People are coming back to basics. The kinds of movies coming out are more spiritual ie: the Da Vinci code, Celestine Prophecy etc and the kinds of books written by others such as Wayne Dyer, Eckhart Tolle are talking more about our inner truth and relying less on the exterior world. Even leadership books such as Inspire by Lance Secretan speak about how much people are looking for love, truth and connection. If we don't change our ways and open up our minds, the world cannot change. We are the catalysts of change. There is no mistake we are where we are right now and it is not wrong or right. It just is. My request: be open, be curious, be ready to learn and then make up your own mind. Thank you for opening up this discussion. It is an opportunity for us to learn about and from each other. Namaste!
I place myself along with the Western thinkers in the group, and say that therapeutic touch, reiki, etc, may have a placebo effect, but nothing more. As a Christian, I cannot discount the possibility of a demonic influence, but I would say it is more likely not, due to the fact that demons would not be interested in healing people.
At my nursing school, we had a section of one class ("Nursing Practice" or something like that) where the instructor (actually the head of our nursing program) gave a demonstration of "therapeutic touch". Not a single person in the class believed in TT.
She also had her son come one day and lead the class in doing Tai Chi, which I refused due to my beliefs (it is Taoism, I am not a Taoist, therefore I don't do it). I don't discount the exercise and calming element of tai chi, but I don't like the religious aspect of it. You could probably have the same effect with any slow moving isotonic exercise and stretch program.
My mother-in-law sells therapeutic magnets. She is almost religious in her attempts to get people to see the benefits of wearing a magnet belt, magnet insoles, etc. I say it's total bunk. But I don't crusade to get her to stop wearing them. If it works for her (placebo), fine...it's not hurting anybody. But don't tell me I have to believe it. I don't think there is anything in my house that operates under the principle of, "We don't know HOW it works, we just know it works. You hear that a lot from these kinds of camps.
Witchcraft? Really? Well, how about if we all pray that most nurses don't think like you that the only real work nurses can do is give drugs and monitor side effects with "assessments". Nursing without the spiritual aspect (notice I left all the religion out, which has nothing to do with spirituality) is nothing but a regular job. Real nursing involves keeping an open mind as to what works and what doesn't. Have you ever read any of the real research done by Dolores Krieger or Tiffany Field on energy healing? Have you ever experienced energy work? Western medicine is the number one killer of Americans, according the Life Extension Foundation, and kills over 1 million people a year. Aren't you proud of your work now?
western medicine is the number one killer? really? smoking, drug/alcohol abuse, diet and sedentary lifestyle are towing the rear? you've got to be kidding, right? or can we do all those things and live forever if we abandon western medicine?
i suppose i can't be a "real nurse", since i label nonsense as what it is... nonsense. when i'm saying that it's nonsense, i'm referring specifically to the preposterous conclusions drawn from the evidence presented. the question is, whose vision of a "real nurse" is it that i'm failing? a real or delusionary vision?
energy work? how about evidence and scientific study? again, where is the connection? the arguments essentially comes down to this: we're composed of energy, thus xyz energy techniques work. huh? this is proof?
you can believe in anything you want. if you want to believe religion has nothing to do with spirituality, you can believe it. i think most would argue otherwise.
certainly, it would be nice if i could lay hands on people and heal them. if i could do this, i'd be busy 24/7, presenting my great gift to mankind. it would be nice if i could speak to the dead and solve problems for the living. heck, it would be nice if i could levitate, and fly to the moon without a spaceship. but the facts are just that, the facts. i can do none of these things.
i can give meds, monitor and assess patients, treat them with respect and dignity, attend to their physical and psychological needs, and intervene when things go wrong. it's too bad i can't be a "real nurse" unless i believe in unproven mystical nonsense. it's too bad that "real nursing" doesn't involve using restraint and evaluating the evidence before embracing theories that simply don't hold water.
why can't the proponents of energy techniques do things like cure hiv, etc? why can't they make amputees sprout new limbs? why can't they do a single thing that can be evaluated via evidence in the scientific community? then our problems would be solved overnight! are evil scientists involved in a huge conspiracy to discredit the truth?
is it wrong to rely on science? i ask you this the next time you flip on a light switch or use your cell phone, or get on the internet. keep in mind that it's the only thing that keeps you from living in a cave and having a life expectancy in the 30's.
Have any one of us ever felt better after a massage or a backrub?
That's TT.
Actually, respectfully (I'm not flaming you, just correcting misinformation), no, it's not. Therapeutic Touch is a specific discipline concerned with realigning "energy fields" and it's my understanding (someone else pls. correct me if I'm wrong, because I'm certainly no expert) that, in TT, the practitioner does not actually touch the client at all, but moves her/his hands around/above the body in close proximity. It's (again, my (limited) understanding, and feel free to correct me if I'm wrong) nothing like massage or a backrub.
As for Western medicine being the #1 killer of Americans, I'm reminded of a college friend who used to defend his practice of having a beer for breakfast (and various other times throughout the day) as a health practice by claiming that solid food was the #1 killer -- his proof being that nearly everyone who has ever died had eaten solid food at one time or another ...
be open, be curious, be ready to learn and then make up your own mind. Thank you for opening up this discussion. It is an opportunity for us to learn about and from each other. Namaste!
I prayed for one of my pts on Monday (per usual) and he was MUCH better on Tuesday. Maybe not a 'turning the water to wine' miracle, but, close enough.
I take this as proof that prayer works to the exclusion of TT.
I have all the anecdotal evidence I need. I hereby DEMAND that prayer is officially included in Nursing's core knowledge as known therapies that can aid in bedside care.
I think nurses should be formally taught how to pray the correct way. Of course, that requires knowing the background knowledge of prayer: so, off to Christian church you all go (I only have proof - see above - that CHRISTIAN prayer works).
I think NANDA should include the diagnosis: Spiritual imbalance r/t Christian prayer deficit.
And if you disagree: why can't you be more open, curious, and ready to learn known therapies that have LOTS of practitioners in nursing?
Specializes in Cardiac care/Ortho/LTC/Education/Psych.
Thank you soooo much ,for this post. I thought I am the only one in holistic nursing class that frown on some sentences I heard there( and yes I did not get good grade maybe I was to honest with my comments!) Any way I do not want to take out any possible way that can make pt feel good but when somebody comes into the classroom and wave with hands and say that " energy is GOOOOOODDDD now, and we SHOULD FEEL GOOOD " and I feel stupid becouse I do not feel anything than dude something stinks there or is it me who can not feel , or as it look more than me , thank you!
I realize this subject is "out there" for some folks. And for me it is also "out there" when people tie it into mysticism etc.. But I am a Christian and I pray and I thank God for my children and I ask for wisdom in caring for them.
One thing we need to consider is that God...or someone...created the "mystic" peoples and gave them their gifts. Why do we think that we have the right to think that our gifts are superior?
Thank you soooo much ,for this post. I thought I am the only one in holistic nursing class that frown on some sentences I heard there( and yes I did not get good grade maybe I was to honest with my comments!) Any way I do not want to take out any possible way that can make pt feel good but when somebody comes into the classroom and wave with hands and say that " energy is GOOOOOODDDD now, and we SHOULD FEEL GOOOD " and I feel stupid becouse I do not feel anything than dude something stinks there or is it me who can not feel , or as it look more than me , thank you!
it's a pity you were subjected to that. i'd like to ask you to show the instructors this thread. perhaps they can come here and explain this in a way that would convert me and the other skeptics. :).
western medicine is the number one killer? really? smoking, drug/alcohol abuse, diet and sedentary lifestyle are towing the rear? you've got to be kidding, right? or can we do all those things and live forever if we abandon western medicine?
American Medicine good or bad?
The following is stats from a pubmed article that you can access at the bottom of this.
116 million extra physician visits
77 million extra prescriptions
17 million emergency department visits
8 million hospitalizations
3 million long-term admissions
199,000 additional deaths
$77 billion in extra costs
Americas healthcare ranking.
13th (last) for low-birth-weight percentages
13th for neonatal mortality and infant mortality overall
11th for postneonatal mortality
13th for years of potential life lost (excluding external causes)
11th for life expectancy at 1 year for females, 12th for males
10th for life expectancy at 15 years for females, 12th for males
10th for life expectancy at 40 years for females, 9th for males
7th for life expectancy at 65 years for females, 7th for males
3rd for life expectancy at 80 years for females, 3rd for males
10th for age-adjusted mortality
I think science is good but please do not be fooled into beliveing that the Pharmaceutical companies are out for the best of the patient. They are out to make a buck!
western medicine is the number one killer? really? smoking, drug/alcohol abuse, diet and sedentary lifestyle are towing the rear? you've got to be kidding, right? or can we do all those things and live forever if we abandon western medicine?
American Medicine good or bad?
The following is stats from a pubmed article that you can access at the bottom of this.
116 million extra physician visits
77 million extra prescriptions
17 million emergency department visits
8 million hospitalizations
3 million long-term admissions
199,000 additional deaths
$77 billion in extra costs
Americas healthcare ranking.
13th (last) for low-birth-weight percentages
13th for neonatal mortality and infant mortality overall
11th for postneonatal mortality
13th for years of potential life lost (excluding external causes)
11th for life expectancy at 1 year for females, 12th for males
10th for life expectancy at 15 years for females, 12th for males
10th for life expectancy at 40 years for females, 9th for males
7th for life expectancy at 65 years for females, 7th for males
3rd for life expectancy at 80 years for females, 3rd for males
10th for age-adjusted mortality
I think science is good but please do not be fooled into beliveing that the Pharmaceutical companies are out for the best of the patient. They are out to make a buck!
i'm not sure what your point is. for example, americans have twice the rate of heart disease and diabetes as the british, which i attribute to diet and lifestyle... not western medicine. the british have western medicine as well. our society has many problems which are reflected in these statistics. how does western medicine cause obesity? if people ate properly, didn't drink, didn't smoke, didn't use drugs and exercised, we'd have much better health statistics.
the term "western medicine" would mean science based medicine, with practices supported by evidence gathered and analyzed via scientific method. i'm not sure what you mean by american medicine, unless you mean western medicine as practiced in america.
i do believe that our health care system has access problems. i just don't see how that would relate to the validity of alternative therapies such as TT.
a fat person will have a high risk for diabetes and heart disease. americans are fat. thus we're going to have high morbidity and mortality rates that relate to obesity, no matter what our health care system is like.
You know how the brain gets a new idea? You know how cells repair themselves? How bones make blood? There is much more that we do not know than things that we truly know. I do not know how electricity gets into those little wires, how TV, radios, heck, how does the computer know where I clicked the mouse??
And as long as we are on stuff I don't know, what does NEO stand for in::wakeneo: ? Thanks.
reformednurse
18 Posts
Thank you for saying it so well.