The student loan bubble is starting to burst

besaangel, ASN, BSN, MSN, CNA, RN, APRN, NP · Sep 7, 2013

Ah, so all of us on your previous thread giving you advice as to why it may be the better way to go despite the 30k (which as several said, in the broad spectrum of things, is not much and is do-able) are dumb now? Sounds like we're clearly not giving you advice to make a "smarter decision." Hmmm, that's nice.
There is a reason why many are giving you that advice. If you're so gung-ho about ADN-BSN and think it's the "smarter decision" then I don't know why you bothered to post your thread, other than to seek validation for what you already believe in the first place.
I think this response from you is rude. You're the one freaking out over what school to go to, people gave their two cents, and yet you're not even listening and now going around proclaiming, "I don't get it! Shouldn't we be encouraging each other to make smarter decisions?!" Like THAT isn't a slap in the face to all of us trying to help you that think maybe the 30k COULD potentially be worth it.
I don't understand what's not to get anyway. It has all been spelled out for you in black and white what the pros/cons are of each choice. Be mature and make a decision rather than whining about the advice given to you.
At the end of the day, it's just advice, not law.

Thanks for misinterpreting my post. Im sorry u took it as me being rude because that was not my intention. The point is with so many people having a hard time finding jobs (despite what field) they are more often than not told to "get a loan" without the advice to seek out ALL their options. All too often this notion gets thrown around before the whole point gets evaluated. Like very few people suggests grants, scholarships or tuition reimbursements, the first answers are usually, get a loan to finance what you want. I think that should be the last resort (depending on the circumstance) I know 30k is more than worth my future career, that is/was only part of the problem I was inquiring about so don't get me wrong.

P.S. I'm not freaking out about what school to go to. I don't freak out or get anxious and just because I don't 100% agree with your method of thinking does not mean I am not taking your advice or haven't considered your opinion. Once again, I was not being rude.

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applewhitern, BSN, RN · Sep 8, 2013

Esme, just a note: It makes me sick how hard it is for someone who is truly disabled to obtain disability, like the nurse you mentioned who paid in for 40 years. My son died of cancer; it was already stage 4 when diagnosed. He was denied disability and had to re-apply. After several years of this, he enlisted help thru a disability lawyer. Well, just before they went to court, the judge said to settle it without going to court, and awarded him backpay. The attorney got paid first, 25% of it. My son still had to wait about a month to get paid, even though they had already paid his lawyer! He also never got Medicaid; they denied that twice, even though he was dying of cancer and I was supporting him myself. (That would have helped with the chemo drugs, hospital bills, etc.) We have a very unjust system here in the US. Yes, some of our younger generation just doesn't get how quickly you can lose everything you have. I had to spend all of my retirement savings, just taking care of my son, even though I had paid into the system for 40 years.

MrsStudentNurse · Sep 8, 2013

Esme, Glad to be in a conversation with you again.

I'm really sorry about your RN friend. That's a horrible circumstance and very rare.

I'm still unsure how that relates to student loans.

As for the credit checks, I've never had one for a job and wouldn't consent for one. North Dakota has jobs, great paying jobs. I live in an area that has jobs, sure it may be at Starbucks or bed bath and beyond but it's a JOB! In fact In 2008 I was living on my own 2000 miles from any family (still do and have since I was 18) and I didn't have as many hours as I needed, not even close and I needed it to support myself. I applied everywhere and ended up getting a job at bed bath and beyond. I was happy because I was a JOB!! I worked there even though it sucked until I got a better job and continued the progression. Defaulting on bills was not an option. There are jobs, it may not suit ones desires but OH WELL. If I can make ends meet in the height of the recession in PHOENIX which was hit very hard by the recession than anyone can minus the few have legitimate disabilities.

MrsStudentNurse · Sep 8, 2013

Esme just a note: It makes me sick how hard it is for someone who is truly disabled to obtain disability, like the nurse you mentioned who paid in for 40 years. My son died of cancer; it was already stage 4 when diagnosed. He was denied disability and had to re-apply. After several years of this, he enlisted help thru a disability lawyer. Well, just before they went to court, the judge said to settle it without going to court, and awarded him backpay. The attorney got paid first, 25% of it. My son still had to wait about a month to get paid, even though they had already paid his lawyer! He also never got Medicaid; they denied that twice, even though he was dying of cancer and I was supporting him myself. (That would have helped with the chemo drugs, hospital bills, etc.) We have a very unjust system here in the US. Yes, some of our younger generation just doesn't get how quickly you can lose everything you have. I had to spend all of my retirement savings, just taking care of my son, even though I had paid into the system for 40 years.[/quote']
I'm really sorry about your son. All the best.

KyleLVN · Sep 8, 2013

Think about why you need a bachelors degree. It's not going to improve or really teach you anything new, unless your trying to get into management or maybe eventually become a nurse practioner. But I'm an LVN and I can't get a job at a hospital only a nursing home, rehab or homehealth. I'm working homehealth. Would have loved Rehab though. Plus it doesn't expand your scope of practice. And 30k is a lot, I'd try to find cheaper option and I doubt you have full time to go to campus. Plus I don't think you would need to do clinicals. I read your other post, so with a masters are you going to try and become a NP, or CRNA, or nurse midwife?

KyleLVN · Sep 8, 2013

People I wouldn't freak out so much, it's a smart move for chase, because most college degrees are worthless. But when I was trying to get loans I got them through the government, and luckily because my mom was indebt to my dad for child support I got a lot of money from my lappel grants 11k but I still owe like 10.4k.

MrsStudentNurse · Sep 8, 2013

People I wouldn't freak out so much it's a smart move for chase, because most college degrees are worthless. But when I was trying to get loans I got them through the government, and luckily because my mom was indebt to my dad for child support I got a lot of money from my lappel grants 11k but I still owe like 10.4k.[/quote']
I agree!! Good for you or only having that much to pay off!!

brandy1017, ASN, RN · Sep 8, 2013

I think it is a good thing if the big banks are getting out of private student loans. Federal loans are capped and without private student loans less people will get in over their head and end up defaulting on their student loans! Also this will put pressure on colleges to lower tuition as less people will have access to all the loans they need to pay tuition. Of course, it will have the negative effect of increasing income inequality and class differences as less poor and middle class will go to expensive private colleges, while the wealthy can always outbid the others and afford the insane tuition of $30-60K a year that some colleges charge! But since student loans cannot be discharged in bankruptcy this is really a good thing! Too many people are in over their head either unable to pay off their loans, taking decades too or ended up permanently poor unable to buy a house or car. Some have even committed suicide in despair! The only real option with them is income based repayment of 10-15% of income for 20-25 years depending when you graduated and some loan forgiveness after 10+ years if you qualify. I think this is a bad deal all around.

Student loans are a gamble, there is no guarantee you will get a decent job or any job for that matter, yet the loans have to be repaid. On top of that you can see your wages garnished, tax returns confiscated, social security and disability garnished and even your professional license withheld if you can't afford to pay. God forbid if you default, and many do without realizing the massive negative consequences of a 25% penalty off the bat plus interest capitalization and next thing you know your loan is 2-3 bigger than the original balance. If you have cosigners they will face the same consequences if you don't pay. On top of that your credit score is trashed which leaves you unable to buy a house or car and increases the cost of everything from credit cards to insurance and can make it even more difficult to get a job!

If our economy is ever going to get better we need consumer spending so the student loan mess is another factor making the recession worse and hampering an economic recovery! I have coworkers who have BA degrees working as CNA's making $10-15/hr with many thousands of dollars in student loans who temporarily have deferred them, but there is a time limit on this. Some are in their fifties and will probably end up with their social security garnished and nothing to show for college but overwhelming debt!

We would be better off with an apprenticeship program and less people going to a 4 year college. Technical education is a better bet for many people! Ironically many in the know grads take the initiative and get tech training after college in order to find a decent paying job, but how much better off would these people be if they didn't have the albatross of student loan debt from their BA/BS! They would have less debt and be working years sooner and be much better off!

But the govt refuses to accept the truth about education because if they did they would have to admit that there is income and class inequality in America, and that we need to do more on the labor end to improve working conditions and pay! So many people are being burdened with student loans in this blind approach toward social equality. In the end the students from rich families are going to end up ahead anyway because they have the most money, connections and opportunities! Look at Hillary Clinton's daughter she is a special correspondent on TV and she wouldn't have been chosen if not for connections. Likewise the Bush daughter on TV as well. They may have the IVY league education, but I'm sorry I don't believe they have the same skill and ability as Katie Couric, for example. And even Katie Couric had a college connection that enabled her to get her first break in the TV business, but she is talented unlike Ms Clinton, who while educated and earnest, appears quite awkward on screen!

The truth is college is a huge gamble and many people would be better off not going to college, as long as there are no bankruptcy protections for student loans. If they really want to level the playing field between the rich and the poor, they would restore the bankruptcy option to student loans, but they realize it would cost them too much money if they did! Better to pretend we all have the same opportunities than admit the truth! This is unfortunate for the millions, upwards of 50% of college grads who are in jobs that do not require a degree and consequently making very little money to actually pay the loans off! In the meantime, high school students and their families are being bombarded with the lie that college is the answer and being courted by many colleges who feed off the student loans and could care less what happens to the grads after they graduate!

besaangel, ASN, BSN, MSN, CNA, RN, APRN, NP · Sep 8, 2013

Think about why you need a bachelors degree. It's not going to improve or really teach you anything new, unless your trying to get into management or maybe eventually become a nurse practioner. But I'm an LVN and I can't get a job at a hospital only a nursing home, rehab or homehealth. I'm working homehealth. Would have loved Rehab though. Plus it doesn't expand your scope of practice. And 30k is a lot, I'd try to find cheaper option and I doubt you have full time to go to campus. Plus I don't think you would need to do clinicals. I read your other post, so with a masters are you going to try and become a NP, or CRNA, or nurse midwife?

Yes It is and yes, I am going to to be a NP;I wont need to go FT either :up:

Coming from a close-knit family, I have no qualms about sacrificing to help my mother and using an extra 10k for her and to help my sickly grandfather live comfortably while I go through school... :yes: I can always go back to school but my elders wont always be around... Hopefully it wont get to that but only God knows if it will come to that. But I live realistically because that might be the case a year or two from now

Esme12, ASN, BSN, RN · Sep 8, 2013

Esme, Glad to be in a conversation with you again.
I'm really sorry about your RN friend. That's a horrible circumstance and very rare.
I'm still unsure how that relates to student loans.
As for the credit checks, I've never had one for a job and wouldn't consent for one. North Dakota has jobs, great paying jobs. I live in an area that has jobs, sure it may be at Starbucks or bed bath and beyond but it's a JOB! In fact In 2008 I was living on my own 2000 miles from any family (still do and have since I was 18) and I didn't have as many hours as I needed, not even close and I needed it to support myself. I applied everywhere and ended up getting a job at bed bath and beyond. I was happy because I was a JOB!! I worked there even though it sucked until I got a better job and continued the progression. Defaulting on bills was not an option. There are jobs, it may not suit ones desires but OH WELL. If I can make ends meet in the height of the recession in PHOENIX which was hit very hard by the recession than anyone can minus the few have legitimate disabilities.

Nice to see you.....

it a large forum sonetime it is difficult to cross paths....LOL

It applies because not all people who have loans of any kind default because they are lazy and refuse to get a job. There are circumstances that are beyond our control that no matter how hard we try...it just isn't enough.

As for the credit checks, I've never had one for a job and wouldn't consent for one.

You may have agreed to a credit check and NEVER know it. If you have applied for a job and they performed a background check....AND your state allows it......they can perform a credit check as a part of that background check. MANY retailers perform background checks for those employees who handle money....ie: Cashiers.

As a nurse, applying for a job, you WILL be subjected to credit checks in the states that allow them and some of those states do NOT have to notify you. Did you know they perform a credit check to sign up for a mobile phone? You have probably had your credit checked without your permission. depends on the state

That you will NEVER consent to a credit check and will ALWAYS be able to find a job and work enough that default is not an option........Never is a long time and always has an exception.

It shows to your good character that your efforts, hard work ethics and perseverance that you were able to keep your head above water. Right now there are hard hit areas of the country where this is near impossible.

California has a 47% unemployment rate of new grad nurses. MANY of the previously laid off and underemployed went to nursing school on the promise of a nursing shortage (that doesn't exist) and paid exorbitant tuition for a key to the door that opened to the yellow brick road...who can't find enough work to pay the new loan bill and can't negotiate for longer/better terms/forgiveness who have no choice but to default.

As nurses it is our job to have empathy and understand of another's circumstances and decisions, whether or not they are correct decisions, and sit in judgement. We can have our own personal opinion but it is our job to look at all possibilities and see all side of one story.

SE_BSN_RN, BSN · Sep 8, 2013

Think about why you need a bachelors degree. It's not going to improve or really teach you anything new, unless your trying to get into management or maybe eventually become a nurse practioner. But I'm an LVN and I can't get a job at a hospital only a nursing home, rehab or homehealth. I'm working homehealth. Would have loved Rehab though. Plus it doesn't expand your scope of practice. And 30k is a lot, I'd try to find cheaper option and I doubt you have full time to go to campus. Plus I don't think you would need to do clinicals. I read your other post, so with a masters are you going to try and become a NP, or CRNA, or nurse midwife?

"It's not going to improve or really teach you anything new, unless your trying to get into management or maybe eventually become a nurse practioner."

This is not true. You may need a BSN to get your MSN, or NP, but a bachelor's is not all about management. I am an LPN and I just finished a BSN program. If you want even a chance at working in a hospital, or somewhere other than LTC or HHC, you need your RN. And moreso.....a BSN.

SE_BSN_RN, BSN · Sep 8, 2013

People I wouldn't freak out so much, it's a smart move for chase, because most college degrees are worthless. But when I was trying to get loans I got them through the government, and luckily because my mom was indebt to my dad for child support I got a lot of money from my lappel grants 11k but I still owe like 10.4k.

10K on a loan for LVN school? Did you go to a tech school?