I recently became the victim of harassment in the workplace, only to watch my nurse manager cater to the physician as he belittled me and used profanity towards me in her presence.
Backstory: Two weeks ago, a surgeon asked me how his patient was doing. I reported to him that she was very weepy during the day and had mentioned being upset with him because she came out of surgery with 3 JP drains and she had not been expecting that. He marched into her room and began yelling at her. He told her she had better change her attitude because he saved her life and he would stop making rounds on her completely if she didn't start thanking him every time she saw him. I was present during this interaction and said This needs to stop. NOW†and walked out of the room. He told me Don't you ever walk out while I am speaking†and walked off. I did report him to my supervisor, but did not make an occurrence report to human resources, which I am now deeply regretting.
Yesterday, this same surgeon told me he was writing up a discharge order for one of the patients. I told him her blood pressure had been running high and rattled off her morning vital signs from my report sheet. I was waiting in line to pull medications from the Pyxis and he asked me when the patient had received PRN medications last. I replied I'm not sure because I'm not in front of the computer, but I've been here since 7am and I haven't given her anything and it's now 8:15am.†He was sitting at the computer and replied me Well log on and tell meâ€. I knew he was trying to throw his weight around, so I replied I am about to pull medications so I can't do that right nowâ€. He became angry and demanded to speak to my supervisor.
While we were speaking to her, he insulted me, called me names, and used profanity towards me. To my absolute surprise, my nursing supervisor kept making comments like Yes, sir. I agree with you sir.†and She will be spoken toâ€. She not once interjected or disagreed with him. I feel that her very attitude serves to only inflate the ego of this physician and makes his behavior acceptable. He literally made me go to my supervisors office and his argument was she didn't do what I told her to do when I told her to do it!â€. After noting that she was just agreeing with everything he said, I said I'm done with this conversation, I have to go take care of my patients†and began to walk out. The physician replied You're a nurse, you don't get to decide when we're doneâ€.
I may be a nurse, but I am also a very real person with very real feelings. His commentary serves to explain his treatment of me. To him, I am beneath him and am even unable to decide when I no longer want to participate in a hostile exchange. I was upset at how he was treating me, but even more upset that my nurse manager did not intervene. The message she sent across is that I may be important, but he is MORE IMPORTANT to the facility because he is a surgeon. My nurse manager was practically agreeing with him that I needed to wait until he ended the conversation.
This lack of support for nurses should be highly frowned upon and should not be tolerated. I may not have gone to school for 8 years, but I do have an education, a mouth, and a brain and I can make my own decisions! I am more than JUST A NURSE. As nurses, we get caught up in patient care to the point that small interactions such as my original encounter with him go unreported. We must stand up for ourselves and our profession and report incidences such as this one to protect ourselves. We can no longer tolerate doctors making us feel inferior or demanding that we stop performing our responsibilities to cater to their needs.
I am now left with only a few witnesses of our original encounter as my ‘proof' and have been ‘fired' from taking care of any of this surgeons patients in the future. I did nothing wrong, but all of his request were fulfilled and I am left waiting the response of human resources, from which I hear, will do nothing. We need to change this and demand to work in environments in which we are valued and supported instead of freely belittled and harassed. Report all of these incidences to protect yourself!
There are 2 sides to every story, and I feel like there is also a lot of embellishing on the OP's part. I've never seen a Dr yell at a patient in this manner. They have their license to protect as well, so I'm going to have to say I really don't believe this whole story. There might have been some overstepping of boundaries, but I just can't picture this scenario happening the way it's being told here.
I totally believe it could happen. It happened to me. Before I became a nurse, I had a surgical procedure that was done by an on call physician, not my own physician. When my doc visited me in the hospital, I mentioned (not as a complaint at all, just relaying my esperience) that I remembered waking up during the procedure and saying "Ouch!" Obviously I was not intubated.
Later that day, the anesthesiologist called me on the phone and RIPPED ME A NEW ONE, saying that as I was receiving IV sedation, I couldn't have "woken up" because I was never "asleep." He said "How DARE you report me to Dr. Jones for this." And on and on.
I was sick. I was missing my newborn. I was vulnerable. I felt like crap. And this
*(#%^ threw his weight around and tried to make me feel even worse.
I don't even remember what I said. I, as a patient, didn't realize that I had any power of my own. If this happened to me today, you better believe I would report that jerk to every power that be, and I would demand an apology on the spot.
Most docs I know are pretty decent people. But some of them are complete and total narcissistic, personality disordered, egotistical, power hungry, arrogant asses, and they need to be put in their place when they abuse patients and staff. Period.
I would probably not have told the surgeon she was upset with "him" about the drains, simply that she was having a rough day because she hadn't been aware she might need drains. Or something to that effect. It would seem to go without saying that telling him a patient was upset with him might have made the doc defensive and put the patient in the line of fire.
And it's totally possible that my past experience would probably have been the basis for that decision. In fact, it's probable. The OP didn't know the guy was such a jerk, but now that she does, I hope that this experience might make her change her next interaction just a tad. Not to protect the doc from becoming angry, but to make sure nothing is said which might negatively impact the doctor/patient relationship. The patient always has her own options if she wants to tell him herself that she is upset with "him."
it would have been unprofessional to allow the doc to walk in to see the patient WITHOUT warning him the patient was upset with him. Would you want someone to do that to you?
it would have been unprofessional to allow the doc to walk in to see the patient WITHOUT warning him the patient was upset with him. Would you want someone to do that to you?
No. I agree with this, morte.
I would have phrased it differently than "She's mad at you..."
OP's part in this was small. The NM and doc sound like turds. They aren't here asking about it, though, OP is. This is maybe how she can do better in the future.
This being said, those nurses that work with surgeons on a daily basis have my respect (and sympathy) I personally find them the most difficult "group" to work with. I had to bite my tongue hourly while on a certain Ortho floor.
Yet, one of the top 3 docs I've ever worked with was a hotshot cardiac surgeon. Great guy, great doc.
Specializes in OR, Nursing Professional Development.
This being said, those nurses that work with surgeons on a daily basis have my respect (and sympathy) I personally find them the most difficult "group" to work with. I had to bite my tongue hourly while on a certain Ortho floor.
Yet, one of the top 3 docs I've ever worked with was a hotshot cardiac surgeon. Great guy, great doc.
Nah, we just learn how to deal with them because we spend so much time with them.
OP, one of the things to learn from this is how to approach things with tact. Yes, the surgeon was out of line, but knowing how best to handle the situation will be a very valuable skill, whether at work or anywhere else. Saying the patient is upset with the surgeon vs. saying the patient is upset about having drains- which do you think sounds better?
This being said, those nurses that work with surgeons on a daily basis have my respect (and sympathy) I personally find them the most difficult "group" to work with. I had to bite my tongue hourly while on a certain Ortho floor.
I can count on one hand the surgeons I have to work with that are difficult and unreasonable. And my NM is great! When those doctors go and complain about staff to her, her first questions to them are, "What did you do to them and did you deserve it?" That normally shuts them up pretty quickly.
I can count on one hand the surgeons I have to work with that are difficult and unreasonable. And my NM is great! When those doctors go and complain about staff to her, her first questions to them are, "What did you do to them and did you deserve it?" That normally shuts them up pretty quickly.
I totally believe it could happen. It happened to me. Before I became a nurse, I had a surgical procedure that was done by an on call physician, not my own physician. When my doc visited me in the hospital, I mentioned (not as a complaint at all, just relaying my esperience) that I remembered waking up during the procedure and saying "Ouch!" Obviously I was not intubated.
Later that day, the anesthesiologist called me on the phone and RIPPED ME A NEW ONE, saying that as I was receiving IV sedation, I couldn't have "woken up" because I was never "asleep." He said "How DARE you report me to Dr. Jones for this." And on and on.
I was sick. I was missing my newborn. I was vulnerable. I felt like crap. And this
*(#%^ threw his weight around and tried to make me feel even worse.
I don't even remember what I said. I, as a patient, didn't realize that I had any power of my own. If this happened to me today, you better believe I would report that jerk to every power that be, and I would demand an apology on the spot.
Most docs I know are pretty decent people. But some of them are complete and total narcissistic, personality disordered, egotistical, power hungry, arrogant asses, and they need to be put in their place when they abuse patients and staff. Period.
Doctors are people too. You have your good, and you have your bad. I'm just not believing doctors treat patients the way some of the events are being described here. And also, we live in a different time. Doctors used to be held in high regards, untouchable. Like Bill Cosby, they got away with things. Remember, we weren't even allowed to view our own medical records - it was your words against his. So I don't doubt your story, but this fresh one from the OP has me questioning it. Like you said, in this day, that would've never happened. I've no doubt doctors can be your worst nightmare; but they're also smart enough to toe the line when it comes to it. I've been on the receiving end, trust me, I know it exists out there. I just don't think the boundaries get crossed that grossly.
Also, I have seen 1 doctor yell at a patient like that. A drug addict, not a fresh post op.
A bit of a difference between a drug addict and a fresh post op, though, right? I think a doctor yelling at a drug addict might actually be beneficial in his case, vs a vulnerable fresh post op. Some people need no help, some people need a helping hand, and some people need a swift kick in the rear.
A bit of a difference between a drug addict and a fresh post op, though, right? I think a doctor yelling at a drug addict might actually be beneficial in his case, vs a vulnerable fresh post op. Some people need no help, some people need a helping hand, and some people need a swift kick in the rear.
He was frustrated, but no. It didn't help the patient. I don't know that anyone could. He died.
I heard him down the hall, "you are driving everyone here ******* crazy!!!" He was LOUD! My co worker and I looked at each other, ran down the hall, and dragged him out of there .
Nah, we just learn how to deal with them because we spend so much time with them.
OP, one of the things to learn from this is how to approach things with tact. Yes, the surgeon was out of line, but knowing how best to handle the situation will be a very valuable skill, whether at work or anywhere else. Saying the patient is upset with the surgeon vs. saying the patient is upset about having drains- which do you think sounds better?
that would be treating the surgeon as a child, he deserves/needs to know that the patient expressed displeasure with him, before the patient can broad side him with it.
that would be treating the surgeon as a child, he deserves/needs to know that the patient expressed displeasure with him, before the patient can broad side him with it.
So it's better for the patient recovering from surgery to be broad sided by the surgeon?
Horseshoe, BSN, RN
5,879 Posts
I totally believe it could happen. It happened to me. Before I became a nurse, I had a surgical procedure that was done by an on call physician, not my own physician. When my doc visited me in the hospital, I mentioned (not as a complaint at all, just relaying my esperience) that I remembered waking up during the procedure and saying "Ouch!" Obviously I was not intubated.
Later that day, the anesthesiologist called me on the phone and RIPPED ME A NEW ONE, saying that as I was receiving IV sedation, I couldn't have "woken up" because I was never "asleep." He said "How DARE you report me to Dr. Jones for this." And on and on.
I was sick. I was missing my newborn. I was vulnerable. I felt like crap. And this
*(#%^ threw his weight around and tried to make me feel even worse.
I don't even remember what I said. I, as a patient, didn't realize that I had any power of my own. If this happened to me today, you better believe I would report that jerk to every power that be, and I would demand an apology on the spot.
Most docs I know are pretty decent people. But some of them are complete and total narcissistic, personality disordered, egotistical, power hungry, arrogant asses, and they need to be put in their place when they abuse patients and staff. Period.