Texas: Methodist Hospital Moves To Hire Only RNS' with BS degree

[DoGoodThenGo]

New nurses at Methodist will need bachelor's degrees

By CINDY GEORGE

The Methodist Hospital has joined the movement toward requiring their registered nurses to have bachelor's degrees.

Since December, the Texas Medical Center institution has required all newly hired experienced nurses to have a four-year degree. This helps the hospital create a nursing work force equipped to treat patients with more complicated conditions such as transplants while handling expanding technology and an ever-increasing knowledge base, said Ann Scanlon McGinity, Methodist's chief nursing executive and senior vice president for operations.

"At the patient's bedside, the risk is high with very sick patients. The margin for error is very small. You have to have people who think and put together information very critically and very quickly. I don't think people with a two-year degree can do all that," said McGinity, who has a master's degree in nursing and a doctorate in developmental psychology. "The whole notion is creating an environment where education and lifelong learning is a requirement as opposed to getting a license or a degree and that's the end of it."

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/7017108.html

[anonymurse]

"At the patient's bedside, the risk is high with very sick patients. The margin for error is very small. You have to have people who think and put together information very critically and very quickly. I don't think people with a two-year degree can do all that," said McGinity, who has a master's degree in nursing and a doctorate in developmental psychology. "The whole notion is creating an environment where education and lifelong learning is a requirement as opposed to getting a license or a degree and that's the end of it."

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/7017108.html

Yeah, it's an opportunistic PR shot taken in a buyer's market, but I love it! They thought they could get some mileage off this dramatic put-down of other hospitals, but it'll take them a while to get rid of their non-BSN nurses, and during that time, some pt's sharp lawyer will use this snotty quote to jerk the carpet right out from under them.

[General E. Speaking, RN, RN]

Just wanted to update everyone and revive the thread. They are currently advertising for nursing positions. It says BSN preferred . Most job ads say this but I find it ironic given the whoopla BS story they printed in the paper about how only BSNs are equipped to handle bedside care. Publicity stunt?

[txspadequeenRN, BSN, RN]

i am a rn with an associate degree. however, i am half way through with my bsn.....i have never seen so much fluff in all my life...i have not come across one item of discussion that has impacted my clinical practice. well that's not exactly true...i do have better research skills and i can name off some theorist like no bodies business....however, clinically i have not changed...its a darn good thing that i went to a strong lvn and adn program or i might just be in trouble....

"at the patient's bedside, the risk is high with very sick patients. the margin for error is very small. you have to have people who think and put together information very critically and very quickly. i don't think people with a two-year degree can do all that,"

that in itself is just so disrespectful of them. i wonder what all the diploma or adn nurses think. especially those who started as a diploma or adn and happened to earn their bsn later, yet work under the same valuable role.

all the bsn evidence base..........makes me wonder really.

[adiplomadinosaur]

"At the patient's bedside, the risk is high with very sick patients. The margin for error is very small. You have to have people who think and put together information very critically and very quickly. I don't think people with a two-year degree can do all that,"

As a diploma nurse with over 30 years of nursing experience in critical care and my CCRN, I find this statement very insulting.

I may not have a BSN after my name, but I'm not uneducated. Interesting that I've precepted many newbie's and the majority needed to be taught how to critically think.

I'm not sure I believe all the research. I've learned over the years with the schooling I have had, that you can make research prove whatever you want it to prove.

I find it discouraging after spending most of my life caring for patients and doing what I love, that I count for so little. I"m not retirement age yet, but it's sad to think if I ever leave my current position, I may not be able to get a job because I'm not educated enough.

My grandmother taught me that something isn't an antique until its over 100 years old. I'm only in my 50's and feel like I'm being put on a shelf.

[rn4lyfe08]

What no one mentioned is actually one of the main catalysts for the BSN only hiring of nurses.....MAGNET STATUS. Hospitals either have it or want it. To be designated or re-designated, they have to show that a large ercentage of their nurses are BSN and certified. In response to one poster who said that the hospital only said "BSN preferred"; I have spoken with many recruiters and the response to their "BSN preferred" line is "we are applying for magnet designation/re-designation and they require us to have a very large percentage of our nurses be BSN prepared" they go on to say that ADNs are reviewed AFTER BSN applicants and if offered employment, they must furnish proof of enrolling in school to obtain BSN w/in 6mos of start date and finish BSN w/in 2yrs!, otherwise they will be terminated for breech of contract!!! Not a single employer has mentioned hiring only BSNs for the reasons mentioned in the article. Lets just call it what it really is. BTW, its been like this up north for at least 2 yrs and is finally hitting the southern states.

Makes me angry that I spent 3yrs in a ADN prog so I could work to pay for my BSN-MSN and then can't find a job, when I could've spent an extra year and had a BSN with a great job! It's like the extra year is lost in an ADN prog, b/c it is always viewed solely as a 2yr degree.

[General E. Speaking, RN, RN]

What no one mentioned is actually one of the main catalysts for the BSN only hiring of nurses.....MAGNET STATUS. In response to one poster who said that the hospital only said "BSN preferred"; I have spoken with many recruiters and the response to their "BSN preferred" line is "we are applying for magnet designation/re-designation and they require us to have a very large percentage of our nurses be BSN prepared" they go on to say that ADNs are reviewed AFTER BSN applicants and if offered employment, they must furnish proof of enrolling in school to obtain BSN w/in 6mos of start date and finish BSN w/in 2yrs!, otherwise they will be terminated for breech of contract!!!

Very interesting. I am going to investigate from some of my fellow nurses that are ADNs and applying there. Thanks!

[pedicurn, LPN, RN]

Just asking....when these hospitals say 'BSN preferred' .... do they include BScN ( Canadian and Australian) ?

As the BScN can be less than 4 yrs ...mine was a 3 1/2 yr program ....is it an issue?

[Lupan]

Ah here we go again!! That infamous Atkins study was about staffing/pt ratios not AD versus BSN. And don't we all take the same board exam?? On that note let's say ADs pass the same exam as BSNs and with less college hours. You could say with that data that ADs have higher abilities because they took 2 years instead of 4 years to pass the same board exam. Hummmm...... I took all the "nursing" classes when working on my BSN and found no monetary reward for taking on more debt. 25 cents an hour more to pay off about 10,000 more in debt. As one friend said " I will be able to retire the same year I pay off my student loans for my masters!" Instead of BSN requirements let us ALL look at CE requirements!

[msn10]

A hospital in the area is doing the same thing (BSN requirement) but allowing the ADNs to be grandfathered in. However, many have come to realize - we are our own biggest problem.

We need to decide what the universal entry degree should be and stop fighting.

I think it should be BSN, but I am biased. I started out as an ADN on a cardiac floor; practiced for 5 years and realized the BSN's were getting all the charge nurse/supervisor roles, but that is because they learned all of those skills in their BSN training. They also had incredible critical thinking skills.

Watching them encouraged me to finish my BSN 8 years later and then my MSN. Every degree has been more valuable than the last and helped me to fully understand the aesthetics, empirics, ethics, and personal knowing of nursing.

Nursing is a science and and art. God bless the ADN student because they are run ragged, but they are deprived of the rest of the education that makes nursing the unique profession that it is. Some will (on their own) go onto study the theories, history, and nursing research, but some just do not have the time because of their busy lives.

Every other autonomous health care discipline has a minimal bachelor's into entry. We are more than capable, but we fight among ourselves.

The NCLEX only makes us nurses in the eyes of the government. We deserve more than pushing our brightest minds through the system in 2 years when that information should really be over 3 years. One more year of theory, management, and community and we would stop the fighting. UGH!!! So sad to me.

[blueheaven]

Just wanted to update everyone and revive the thread. They are currently advertising for nursing positions. It says BSN preferred . Most job ads say this but I find it ironic given the whoopla BS story they printed in the paper about how only BSNs are equipped to handle bedside care. Publicity stunt?

I've been hearing this BSN entry level into practice crap since I was in high school. I used to read my mom's Nursing magazines and even in the 70's this was a hot topic at times. (no flames please-I'm tired right now and I'm cranky) Where I work, there are positions that REQUIRE you to have a BSN. You could only be a practicing nurse for a year or two with a BSN and get the job over someone who has more experence who is a lowly diploma or AD nurse. Fair...he%% no. Way it is. That is why my butt is in school right now getting a BSN. At some point in the not too distant future, I need to get out of the physical work side of nursing. Been pounding the floors since 1975. Not about to look for another hospital, I have fantastic benefits and hopefully will be able to retire by the time I'm 999. LOLOLOL

[blueheaven]

a hospital in the area is doing the same thing (bsn requirement) but allowing the adns to be grandfathered in. however, many have come to realize - we are our own biggest problem.

a great portion of "we" is the money generating system that would get screwed if bsn was the entry level.

1) not as many people would be able to complete program due to time and monetary constraints.

2)there would be closures of ad/2 year diploma programs and the loss of income from students enrolled.

3)not to mention the lower number of students graduating, thus contributing to the shortage. i also have other reasons but i'm too tired after 4 12hr shifts and i need to go nighty nite.

we need to decide what the universal entry degree should be and stop fighting.

i think it should be bsn, but i am biased.

where would you have been if not for your ad program??? obviously not able to work the 5 years that you did

they also had incredible critical thinking skills.

having more or different letters after your name does not give you critical thinking skills. happily the folks you are describing have good old fashoned common sense combined with a good solid knowledge base

watching them encouraged me to finish my bsn 8 years later and then my msn. every degree has been more valuable than the last and helped me to fully understand the aesthetics, empirics, ethics, and personal knowing of nursing.

the nclex only makes us nurses in the eyes of the government. we deserve more than pushing our brightest minds through the system in 2 years when that information should really be over 3 years. one more year of theory, management, and community and we would stop the fighting. ugh!!! so sad to me.

3 years.....hmmmmmm......lets see here........that is what 3 year diploma programs did. we had a lot of management/theory our 3rd year and our program had a considerable amount of community nursing throughout the program. at the time i was in school, we had more college prerequisites than the ad program at our local university. ours weren't prerequisites, we took classes at the university along with our nursing classes, third year was all nursing.

i'm not arguing or am i angry. i do get very, very, very tired of this same old baloney going on and on and on ad nauseum :vlin::spbox:

[VicksburgNurse]

What I am wondering is with different hospitals going to this new BSN requirement and such do they offer their "now on staff" none BSN nurses educational means to meet these new standards. I think that would be more to the point.