tension with medical students and physicians

TheCommuter, BSN, RN · Sep 27, 2007

When I was a student 2.5 years ago, I quickly noticed the tensions that sometimes arise between physicians and nurses. I even created a thread that was entitled, "Why are doctors so rude?" Just remember that going through 4 years of undergrad school, 4 years of medical school, and 3 to 7 years of residency requires a certain degree of intelligence, dedication, abstract thought, confidence, and...um...arrogance.

https://allnurses.com/forums/f8/why-doctors-so-rude-99309.html

catlynLPN · Sep 27, 2007

Hi all
I am writing this more out of curiosity rather than looking for a solution...I'm just wondering if I am the only one to notice a bit of "tension" or maybe even annoyance/snootiness between medical students/residents/interns, etc. I am not a paranoid person, and I have a great respect for physicians- heck, I know I wouldn't make it through 10 years of school! That being said, I feel as if there is a bit of...tension.....or snobbery....or just general annoyance whenever I have to be around or interact (minimally, if ever) with medical students and new doctors. For example, today I was walking in the hallway while at clinicals- wearing my white nursing jacket, dressed nicely, walking with my head up (but not nose in the air), being professional and I noticed a medical student/young doctor examining me from the corner of my eye as I walked by, with kind of a curious smirk on her face. I've noticed this before, and I've had fellow nursing students report that they've noticed it as well. I don't know. Maybe I am just being paranoid. Am I imagining this? I rarely talk to the doctors or medical students, as I am usually taking care of my own business, but I find it hard to believe that someone could automatically dislike me when I haven't said or done a thing to them--what do you think? Is it possible that the ridiculous "doctors versus nurses" mentality starts THIS early on?

I bet she was jealous. You were showing an air of confidence and she noticed and was jealous.

texasnurse08 · Sep 27, 2007

I know how you feel. I've had the same thing happen to me. I also had an incident where some med students were standing outside my patient's room discussing his dx and when I tried to pass them in the hall I literaly had to push them out of the way b/c they wouldn't move when asked. Once in the pt's room he asked "who are those snooty people talking about me? I hope they don't come in here" and I just had to laugh. He felt the same way as me. However, for me it not only happened in the hospital but in my school too. I attended a scholarship luncheon where we had seating charts and there was three med students with three nursing students. We tried making conversation with them but all they did was brag/complain about their classes. They were so arrogant.

allthingsbright · Sep 27, 2007

I havent noticed this much at all--but have had one doc be rude to me...For the most part I just ignore people that arent part of the team I am working with for the day. Doctors are people which means there are good ones and bad ones!

Good luck!

caroladybelle, BSN, RN · Sep 27, 2007

When I was a student 2.5 years ago, I quickly noticed the tensions that sometimes arise between physicians and nurses. I even created a thread that was entitled, "Why are doctors so rude?" Just remember that going through 4 years of undergrad school, 4 years of medical school, and 3 to 7 years of residency requires a certain degree of intelligence, dedication, abstract thought, confidence, and...um...arrogance.
[/quote/]
Not to dismiss nursing school, but what we go through does not even come close to the trials that they have ahead of them. Whenever, I hear nursing students griping about their required grade point averages, math requirements, and how mean instructors are, I have to laugh when compared to what med students are required to do and undergo.
On the other hand, they have no right to ever treat you rudely....education or not.
Chalk it up to the med student being jealous... you will soon have more freedom and time than she will. And the male med students are more likely to flirt with NS students. And as a senior nurse, those same med students will be coming to you for help.

TheCommuter, BSN, RN · Sep 27, 2007

Not to dismiss nursing school, but what we go through does not even come close to the trials that they have ahead of them. Whenever, I hear nursing students griping about their required grade point averages, math requirements, and how mean instructors are, I have to laugh when compared to what med students are required to do and undergo.

I am fully aware of what doctors must undergo to earn their place in the healthcare chain. That's why I had included this last bit in my previous post:

Just remember that going through 4 years of undergrad school, 4 years of medical school, and 3 to 7 years of residency requires a certain degree of intelligence, dedication, abstract thought, confidence, and...um...arrogance.

Sun*shine · Sep 28, 2007

this post made me giggle. i've certainly noticed this. i mean i've met some fantastic doctors and student doctors, who are really polite and just gernally very compassionate towards their patients.

a good doctor will soon learn that they need to build up a good working relationship with the nurses pronto. they rely just as much on the nursing staff for advise, information and direction as we do on them. There has to be respect between the professions. Its no use using their status as a barrier on the ward, titles couldn't matter less in a team thats all working towards common goals like we should be.

i've never felt threatened or intimidated by the presense of a top consultant or anything like that, at the end of the day we're all part of one team. but i still see some doctors jump a mile when the staff nurse comes bounding along to see them!! i think doctors are often use their status as a barrier to this issue in order to feel empowered perhaps?

one of the highlights of ward rounds is when the medical staff turn and ask me questions about very alert and competent patients right infront of them such as 'how is she normally' 'how is her eating and drinking'..and i turn straight to the patient and repeat the question directly to them, and let the patient tell us the answer!! :lol2:

KarafromPhilly · Sep 28, 2007

IMHO, I think med students are anxious to prove that they rank above SOMEONE in the hospital. But some of them seem to think that since they are part of the "medical" team (and they don't know what nurses actually do) they are free to tell us how to care for patients. Of course, there is no way I'm going to do anything that some dork off the street with a little jacket and NO LICENSE (except maybe a driver's license) instructs me to do.

On the other hand, some med students are very nice and since they do have a more extensive understanding of pathophys, etc., they can be a great resource. Some of them just make me laugh, though--"Yes, do you have a question?" Oh, please. :lol2:

Trauma Columnist · Sep 28, 2007

When I first started in nursing (1992 as an LPN), I was 34 and looked a lot younger. At that point in my career, I had the same issue of disrespect from the med student. However, as I've gotten wwaaayyy more experienced, I find that that they seek me out for my opinion before they ever talk with an attending.

I do think I now remind them of their mothers - lol!

Seriously, no one should ever tolerate rudeness. It works both ways. These med students are guests on our floors/units just like nursing students. It goes a long ways to help them find equipment, help them find their way in the land of computerized charting and generally just being available if they questions.

I like what someone said about us all being on the same team. As medical/nursing care becomes more complicated, it truly does take a team to care for the pt.

Sun*shine · Sep 28, 2007

well said! i'd never, ever look down upon a healthcare assistant and I'd never want to feel like I was being undervalued or looked down upon. I mean we're all working towards the same goal and thats our patients.

I like what you said about the med students being guests too. I worked along side one medical student who needed his workbook signing off for skills like manual Bp, temperature readings and I had a great morning teaching him! He was really enthusiastic and grateful, and I know for sure when I qualify I'll be leaning on all the ward staff becuase I'll need all the help I can get. Just shows its all give and take.

jedv#1 · Sep 28, 2007

:chuckle i am a student nurse myself and have noticed also that SOME student doctors are snobbish and rude. probably their rudeness and snobbishness is a defence mechanism; they are afraid of committing mistakes due to their lack of experience:wink2:. but i've also have met very nice and polite medical students who are very helpful in giving information and some of them even have become my friends.