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Yes... I know the bleeding hearts are going to start tugging the heart strings and say "Oh the children... Oh the elderly... Oh Humanity."
But why should we change our system from one of a private market and capitalism to one where the government grows; taxes increase and red tape abounds?
I've seen the stats and charts that viking posts over and over and over. I have seen that the UK and Canada... and "every other first world nation" provides universal healthcare. "And they spend less on healthcare..."
Did you know that the UK has a 10% income tax on income as low as $5 K a year? and a 40% tax on income of 66K a year? That doesn't include sales tax; property taxes; excise taxes and everything else that is taxed to hell and back.
What are the things that are different with their healthcare system? How do they do it so cheaply for everyone?
I have to actually research that; and I will; and then get back to you.
I keep hearing and reading that the actual costs of medical care are going to drop. I fail to understand this; really.
Oh, I understand that is cheaper to prevent a disease with a visit to a doctor's office than to treat one in the emergency room.
I understand that if we ACTUALLY work on prevention then healthcare costs may go down.
But I wonder... who accesses care now? Generally; only the folks that really need it.
What happens when no one has to "pay" to see a doctor. Every runny nose; cough and sniffle will be seeking treatment. You think that is difficult to get in to see a doctor now?... Holy cow.
the Emergency Room will still be utilized as a Primary Care clinic because of the inabiltiy of individuals to get appointments...so there goes those "savings."
And if you think that there will be an improvement in the number of drugs and treatments that are available as opposed to those under private insurance companies... you are sadly mistaken.
Big Brother willl appear to alturistic and people will smile and laugh and make merry... until they realize all the things that will not be covered.
Only one way to ensure that 350 million people get health care all the time... control costs. How do you control costs? Pay for as little as possible.
Diabetic? Having problems managing... doctor wants a HgBA1C a couple or three of months in a row... and then one in 3 and 6 month intervals to see how your NPH coverage is working for you.. sorry only 2 per year.
Chemo... costs to much. Radiation? Why you may get radiation poisoning?
Surgery... sure we will cover that; just not the anethesia.
Then; on top of that; how many providers of care are going to stick around and take 10-15 bucks for the same visit that they were previously getting 85-100 bucks for?
And I keep hearing that the providers will not be government employees; that means that there will still be medical groups and such. They will still want to make a profit or they will leave the business...
They will save money as well by cutting costs... how do you cut costs?
first and biggest costs savings is getting rid of labor... by and large. Don't believe me? Ask all the Ford, GM, IBM, and Mortgage employees that were let go when companies failed to meet the bottom line?
or They can refuse to accept the government contracts and accept private insurance only... happens all the time already.
I personally need knee surgery; not to keep my leg from falling off; not to make it so I can walk; because I can; Hell; not even to let me run... because I can do that too. I need knee surgery to alleviate pain from all my years in the Army. How far down the waiting list do you think that my surgery will be? As it is now; all I need to do is schedule an appointment with the ortho/sports med guy.. pay my 150 hospital co-pay and voila... I ll have my knee fixed within 2 weeks from when I make the appointment.
I would estimate that I would be lucky under government healthcare to get it done in less than 3 years.
Indefinate life support... nope... commitees will have to be formed to decide how soon.. (not if) to pull the plug. Prostate Cancer... why try chemo and wait and see... when its really cheaper in the long run and just do a radical prostatectomy... get that tumor quick and no more cancer for you!...
I am sorry Uncle Sam may in fact be our "rich uncle" but when he has to spread it around 350 million or so of our cousins... we aren't going to get much; at all.
So, no thanks. No government healthcare for me please. I'd rather have more take home pay for me and my family. I'd rather have the choice of all the doctors out there... not just the ones that will work cheaply enough to accept medicare.
I'd rather not have to wait for the medical treatments that I need or want.
And to be quite honest... I am sick to death of my tax dollars paying for well; anyone else. Yes, I am a selfish jerk. And no, I really don't care. I provide for my family with my work; I juggled work and family and school to get myself in my position. I enlisted in the Army to get a trade and the GI Bill; and then used those to get college and my MBA. I give to charity. The charities of my choice. If I want to give money or food to the homeless on the street; should be my choice. I tell you I know I do not want to give money to women and men who have 10 kids from 6 different people cause they don't know how to keep it in their pants or what a condom is. Government should not be the biggest charity that there is. We no longer teach accountability and responsibilty in this country. Nope.. we teach entitlement. And that sucks. This would be just one more in the line of handouts and entitlements.
Life, Liberty and Pursuit of Happiness.
Pursuit does not mean you will neccesarily get it. People need to keep that in mind. And, btw, life is never fair, and it never will be.
Why not put them to work? If they can't or won't learn to wash cars or dishes maybe they are sick or disabled.
Refuse to work, no check. Too addicted or mentally ill to work?
Then they need help because they are a threat to themselves and any children in the family.
A no frills care facility may be in order. Loss of freedom (no Marlboros and beer) may motivate them to take a job.
There should be no honest decent job Americans won't do.
People who can't get a job should be offerred one.
And the employers given tax incentives to hire them. At minimum wage or better.
Then for those who truly cannot do any bettere food stamps for working families is a good thing.
Just my diumb brain trying to think here.
So the government will bungle health care the way they bungle everything? Uhh, we trust them with running the military, the post office, roads, public education, FAA, FDA... My personal observation is that deregulation of government agencies and services has led to more problems and corruption and higher costs.
Yes there is always some waste and inefficiency, but I resent my health care dollars going for lobbying and advertising.
MBANurse--thank you for your military service. And I am happy that you do not suffer form a chronic disability that prevents you from working, that your family hasn't been stricken by illness that has caused you to declare bankruptcy or that you employer hasn't cancelled your insurance or made the premiums so high that you must choose between paying the rent or insurance premiums. I would guess that you have never had to have bake sales to raise money for medical care. That is a common occurance in my community of hard working people (farmers, fishermen, loggers, Walmart employees) who can't pay for medical insurance.
i think that this article speaks to the need for consistent health coverage benefits and billing transparency:
lying on the gurney in the emergency room last may, facing an [color=#004276]appendectomy, i should have been focused on my well-being.
instead, all i could think was: what is this going to cost?
it was not that i was uninsured. but i had pre-operation financial [color=#004276]anxiety about the prospect of dealing with my insurance company in regard to surgery that had not even happened yet.
my husband and i had a plan with a $3,000 deductible, and i took comfort knowing that the money was safe in our savings account. i also knew that emergency care and surgery were covered at 80 percent.
what that other 20 percent might amount to was my primary worry-plus what all the á la carte items might cost. that was the hard lesson i had learned the year before, after giving birth, then struggling to decode the bills for various prenatal tests. the doctor might be covered for a test-but my lab work was not. or if the lab work was covered, the "facility fee" was extra.
it is the insurance shell game: you think you know what to expect and you are totally wrong. surprise!
source: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/29/business/yourmoney/29instincts.html?ref=health accessed 12/30/2007.
I also have a MBA, I presume yours is in HCM. Studying the "business" of healthcare was an eye-opener for me. I totally agree with you. As a nurse who has worked with both the Medicare and Medicaid populations, I can tell you that the Government programs are the biggest wasters of money. My Medicaid patients have much better coverage than I do, usually with no questions asked. As for uninsured children, every state in the country has a program that will cover income-eligible children. I know parents who let their kids go without healthcare because they are too busy/lazy to keep up with the recertification requirements. I know people who can afford insurance, but opt to sign their kids up for Medicaid because they need the disposible income for cigarettes, manicures and Starbucks. I remember the brouhaha that arose when the Prez vetoed the CHIP expansion bill, poor uninsured children.... What the media failed to widely report is that the group of children to be newly eligible have parents that make more money than many of us. I just don't feel responsible for the healthcare of a child whose irresponsible mother needs a Starbucks fix once a day.
My Medicaid patients have much better coverage than I do, usually with no questions asked. As for uninsured children, every state in the country has a program that will cover income-eligible children. I know parents who let their kids go without healthcare because they are too busy/lazy to keep up with the recertification requirements.
Sounds like you work in public health too. I work with SCHIP and the Medicaid population. You are right, often people go without health insurance because THEY DO NOT re-cert annually. They only have to re-cert once a year, and sadly the caregiver does not fill out the required application in order for them to have coverage. As with my Medicaid clients, their coverage is free (meds, hosps, sx, er visits, PCP visits, specialist(s) visits, x-rays, diagnosis tests, durable medical equipment, dental, 2 eye exam a year & glasses. The health dept offers a personal care aide for a couple hrs per day/5 days per week if needed, or if medically justified home health aide or private duty nursing. But as you stated, "my Medicaid clients do have better health coverage than I do". Same here, I only have medical insurance with high co-pays and deductibles, also not much of a discount with my prescriptions. The company I work work does not offer dental or eye exams, so I have neither..I have to use my credit card or take out a loan since I do not have the extra money.
I also have a MBA, I presume yours is in HCM. Studying the "business" of healthcare was an eye-opener for me. I totally agree with you. As a nurse who has worked with both the Medicare and Medicaid populations, I can tell you that the Government programs are the biggest wasters of money. My Medicaid patients have much better coverage than I do, usually with no questions asked. As for uninsured children, every state in the country has a program that will cover income-eligible children. I know parents who let their kids go without healthcare because they are too busy/lazy to keep up with the recertification requirements. I know people who can afford insurance, but opt to sign their kids up for Medicaid because they need the disposible income for cigarettes, manicures and Starbucks. I remember the brouhaha that arose when the Prez vetoed the CHIP expansion bill, poor uninsured children.... What the media failed to widely report is that the group of children to be newly eligible have parents that make more money than many of us. I just don't feel responsible for the healthcare of a child whose irresponsible mother needs a Starbucks fix once a day.
Be careful, you are going to be labeled a heartless and uncaring person... How dare you expect an individual to responsible for themselves.
That said, I look to my own sister's experience with wait times in Canada. When she was diagnosed with uterine cancer 10 years ago, there was no wait. Her treatment was immediate. She was also fortunate to be in a large city and could take advantage of an innovative operation that was then being performed by only three surgeons in the world.
Total out-of-pocket cost: Less than $50. Because she opted for a private room.
I have heard a lot of dissatisfaction about the healthcare system in Canada, from Canadians. Most complain about the rationing, the need to wait for diagnostics and procedures. You sister was fortunate (not about the cancer, but the care), but she also had a condition that required immediate attention. Some one with gall bladder disease or back pain might not be so lucky and could find themselves waiting years for care. Would not work in this country, we are too spoiled.
I am quite selfish.I want children of irresponsible parents to have healthcare too.
It hurts me when children suffer.
And I choose to help those I can through charity donations and volunteering.
And work toward having a healthcare system in my country.
I help through the charities of my choice and that is the key...
MBANurse
132 Posts
Individuals choose not to pay attention in school.. or their parents do not make them or choose widgets and gidgets over basics because they know that the basics will be provided. The fact that I have made progress and bettered myself (and will continue to do so) demonstrates that ANYONE can do it. IF they work and sacrifice. Taking away from those that has worked to give to those that won't is not congruent with Respect or Social justice.
There are exceptions. But that is what they should be; exceptions.